View Poll Results: Should Daycare Be Subsidized?

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  • Yes, Should Be Fixed Price (Quebec)

    3 5.77%
  • Yes, Means-Tested (France)

    9 17.31%
  • No, It Should Not Be Subsidized

    40 76.92%
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Thread: Should Daycare Be Subsidized

  1. #411
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    Re: Should Daycare Be Subsidized

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    A society is only as great as it treats its poor. My way will give people a hand up and not a hand out if limits are put into place as well as education for retraining.

    You are for removing ALL safety nets for people. Your plan increases the poverty rate and crime rate ending in more money spent for prisons, etc.
    No, I'm not for removing ALL safety nets. I am, however, for anything that would make people think twice about bringing an 18 year money pit into existence and pawning it off on the general public.

    Since these people would die on the streets at a bare minimum of taxpayer expense, it wouldn't increase the poverty rate. It also wouldn't increase the crime rate because I'd just paddy them up a few buses at a time, drive them out to California, and set them free to do as they choose. Wouldn't affect my state at all - let those silly-nanny liberals carry the burden.

    You can sit there and play semantics by saying you approve of "hand ups" instead of hand outs, but it's all the same thing. It's just the same socialist drivel and rhetoric.

  2. #412
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    Re: Should Daycare Be Subsidized

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    You can sit there and play semantics by saying you approve of "hand ups" instead of hand outs, but it's all the same thing. It's just the same socialist drivel and rhetoric.
    No it's not the same thing, but your way would just cause more money to be spent wastefully busing people. It's ok, you're part of the problem and eventually you'll die out so one less problem to worry about.

  3. #413
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    Re: Should Daycare Be Subsidized

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    No it's not the same thing, but your way would just cause more money to be spent wastefully busing people. It's ok, you're part of the problem and eventually you'll die out so one less problem to worry about.
    Sorry, but the USA isn't quite as socialist as you want it. Your kind will die out before mine.

  4. #414
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    Re: Should Daycare Be Subsidized

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    The problem with that is that it doesn't solve the problem of keeping people OFF welfare. To do that you need a retraining program and possibly daycare during that time.
    Why not, since once you get your check, you are then off welfare for life?

    The current "safety net" programs don't do that either and cost considerably more. Many now require the presense of a dependent to even "qualify" for them which is simply insane. Try to get gov't "help" to buy some basic carpentry/landscaping tools, a used truck and some pocket cash to buy gas and find work - they will simply laugh at you.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  5. #415
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    Re: Should Daycare Be Subsidized

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    You can sit there and play semantics by saying you approve of "hand ups" instead of hand outs, but it's all the same thing. It's just the same socialist drivel and rhetoric.
    I'm fine with a very basic social safety net that takes people who have been hard-working all their lives, who happen to fall off the horse, and helps them climb back on the horse again. Limited, short-term help isn't a problem. It's when it becomes long-term, extensive help that doesn't require the individual to solve their own problems or take control of their own destinies that I dislike. In this case, it's not "help struggling parents with daycare costs in the short term until they can do it on their own", it's "pay for daycare forever and ever and ever".

    No way in hell.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  6. #416
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    Re: Should Daycare Be Subsidized

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    A society is only as great as it treats its poor.
    You're advocating the poor be treated like needy children instead of autonomous adults. That is not an appropriate way to treat the poor. The poor are adults who wear big boy and big girl underwear. Being poor doesn't make them less in charge of their own affairs.

    Your way makes them increasingly dependent and expectant over time on the external providing things to them and solving their problems for them.

    My way treats adults like adults, subjecting them fairly and equally to the same set of laws. It does not insult their adult free will or decision-making by training them to expect to be nursed and soothed when they're having a bad day.

  7. #417
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    Re: Should Daycare Be Subsidized

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    You're advocating the poor be treated like needy children instead of autonomous adults. They have a need? Then society should rescue them and provide for it.

    Your way makes them increasingly dependent and expectant over time on the external providing things to them and solving their problems for them.

    My way treats adults like adults, subjecting them fairly and equally to the same set of laws. It does not insult their adult free will or decision-making by training them to expect to be nursed and soothed when they're having a bad day.
    How is helping them by having welfare limits, retraining, and daycare during that time treating people like needy children?

    The current welfare does that and that's NOT what I'm advocating. You're way throws them to the wolves by removing all safety nets.

  8. #418
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    Re: Should Daycare Be Subsidized

    If society wants people to have children and wants those kids to be properly cared for, then subsidies for daycare should be provided. I think the anti-abortion folks can lead the way by writing out the first checks.

  9. #419
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    Re: Should Daycare Be Subsidized

    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    If society wants people to have children and wants those kids to be properly cared for, then subsidies for daycare should be provided. I think the anti-abortion folks can lead the way by writing out the first checks.
    Except that's far too simplistic. Society wants people who can afford to have children and can afford to properly care for their children to have children. Those who cannot need not apply.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: Should Daycare Be Subsidized

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Except that's far too simplistic. Society wants people who can afford to have children and can afford to properly care for their children to have children. Those who cannot need not apply.
    Well, I live in the real world where everyone has children, those who can least afford it having the most. Now, if you favor mandatory abortions and birth control for the stupid, poor and genetically unfit...you may be living in the wrong decade, and the wrong country. Adolf went thataway.

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