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Should Daycare Be Subsidized

Should Daycare Be Subsidized?

  • Yes, Should Be Fixed Price (Quebec)

    Votes: 2 5.0%

  • Yes, Means-Tested (France)

    Votes: 8 20.0%

  • No, It Should Not Be Subsidized

    Votes: 30 75.0%
  • Total voters
    40
0bserver92 said:
No it isn't I thought a Libertarian would understand the daycares are as good as private ones because they are and they are just cheaper. Quebec is not a low-income province they have one of the highest average incomes in Canada mainly due to it's economy.
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A libertarian is the most vocal advocate for personal responsibility. Having kids you cannot afford is the pinnacle of personal irresponsibility. I don't know how you could connect the dots between libertarianism and almost any subsidy.

Okay, and Quebec has a high average income. How do they compare to other provinces in taxation?

If you just keep reabsorbing and reabsorbing for the purpose of socialist distribution, you can solve many problems. All it costs is your identity, aspirations, and self-respect.
 
Gipper said:
A libertarian is the most vocal advocate for personal responsibility. Having kids you cannot afford is the pinnacle of personal irresponsibility. I don't know how you could connect the dots between libertarianism and almost any subsidy.

Okay, and Quebec has a high average income. How do they compare to other provinces in taxation?

If you just keep reabsorbing and reabsorbing for the purpose of socialist distribution, you can solve many problems. All it costs is your identity, aspirations, and self-respect.
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See, I think there's a disconnect between your thinking and what Observer92 is suggesting. I don't believe he's suggesting people have kids and then ask for help later. He's talking about a policy for future parents going forward as an attempt (which you probably disagree with, whatever) to improve society.
 
Dapper Andy said:
You and your spouse can just as easily work different hours so someone is always home with the kids.
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In what world does that apply? Do you know how businesses work or no. Usually things like finance and engineering firms have the same hours and you usually work the entire day please tell me how you stagger your hours so someone always home.
 
mike2810 said:
At this time I voted no it should not be subsidized.
I might change my mind if the tax laws were changed to where everyone no matter what income paid a tax that went towards the day care.

As it stands now, don't we have about 50% who pay no income tax.
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Keep in mind that no income tax != no taxes.
 
0bserver92 said:
In what world does that apply? Do you know how businesses work or no. Usually things like finance and engineering firms have the same hours and you usually work the entire day please tell me how you stagger your hours so someone always home.
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Also, why would we want to live in a world where we resort to that when we don't have to?
 
0bserver92 said:
In what world does that apply? Do you know how businesses work or no. Usually things like finance and engineering firms have the same hours and you usually work the entire day please tell me how you stagger your hours so someone always home.
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There are plenty of businesses that operate at night and if yours doesn't then you can always find another job or figure out another solution.
 
afr0byte said:
See, I think there's a disconnect between your thinking and what Observer92 is suggesting. I don't believe he's suggesting people have kids and then ask for help later. He's talking about a policy for future parents going forward as an attempt (which you probably disagree with, whatever) to improve society.
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A policy for future parents to have kids they can't afford? Yes, I think he's talking about that too.

A better policy would be to crack the whip and tell people that their mistakes are not costing taxpayers, and to err at their own peril.

You'll never convince me that irresponsibility, and throwing money away that encourages it as opposed to dissuading it, is "improving society".
 
Gipper said:
A libertarian is the most vocal advocate for personal responsibility. Having kids you cannot afford is the pinnacle of personal irresponsibility. I don't know how you could connect the dots between libertarianism and almost any subsidy.

Okay, and Quebec has a high average income. How do they compare to other provinces in taxation?

If you just keep reabsorbing and reabsorbing for the purpose of socialist distribution, you can solve many problems. All it costs is your identity, aspirations, and self-respect.
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Quebec has the highest taxes in North America but has one of the lowest costs of living though the taxes are comparable to provinces like Ontario, B.C., or the Maritimes. Alberta and Saskatchewan, the low tax provinces are starting to catch up aswell because they realize they need mor money and can get more money.
 
Last edited:
To those who say: I want my free stuff
No
If you don't eat your meat you cant have any pudding!

“The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”

Why even ask these questions anymore? why place any limitations on what your fellow man is supposed to provide to you?
think about it commies
 
Gipper said:
A policy for future parents to have kids they can't afford? Yes, I think he's talking about that too.

A better policy would be to crack the whip and tell people that their mistakes are not costing taxpayers, and to err at their own peril.

You'll never convince me that irresponsibility, and throwing money away that encourages it as opposed to dissuading it, is "improving society".
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You still don't seem to get it. He's not talking about mistakes. His scenario would make it possible for two parents to work instead of just one.
 
afr0byte said:
You still don't seem to get it. He's not talking about mistakes. His scenario would make it possible for two parents to work instead of just one.
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No, YOU don't seem to get it. Know what else would make it possible for two people to work instead of just one? Three guesses.

You're offering a pound of cure. I'm offering an ounce of prevention.
 
0bserver92 said:
Should we subsidize the cost of daycare? I was reading a Globe and Mail article (which I can't link to because of the 10 article limit) which talked about the cost of daycare. It was talking about how daycare can cost you 20,000$+ a year thus being a big hit to new families even those making 100,000$+. The couple in the article from Toronto said they spend 13$/day on daycare (fully licensed, nothing fancy daycare) for their child while parents in Quebec can register at government subsidized daycares for 7$/day and there is a waiting list. In France they subsidize daycare and it is means-tested with the lowest price being 50 cents and the highest I think was 13 euros, a day of course. I personally support subsidized daycare as it enables both parents to have successful careers but it is expensive and hard on even the most successful new families, it is not a case of parents that need to make more money or wait but it is just unaffordable and the price needs to be brought down. It also has the benefit of encouraging parents to have more children because they can afford to especially in Quebec where immigration is a problem. I support means-testing as it enables everyone to afford daycare and it avoids waiting lists but Quebec is a nice compromise between the two.
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Daycare is an important instrument in the success of the Nordic Model... Allows for fluid transition in the workplace. Giving families and women in particular a stabilizer which allows for a more expeditious return to the workforce.
 
No. It should NOT be subsidized. That's why children have TWO parents - so one can work and the other can raise the child.
 
Dapper Andy said:
There are plenty of businesses that operate at night and if yours doesn't then you can always find another job or figure out another solution.
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I don't think you understand unless you work in a factory or McDonald's you can't work at night or have different shifts.
 
0bserver92 said:
I don't think you understand unless you work in a factory or McDonald's you can't work at night or have different shifts.
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So work in a factory or McDonalds.

There ya go. Problem solved and it didn't cost the tax payer anything.

You're turning into quite the conservative. You might consider changing your lean soon.
 
Gipper said:
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If both you and your wife work in a knowledge industry the hours are rather hard to stagger and why would you want to stagger when both of you can work a full day.
 
afr0byte said:
You should move to Somalia.
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As a current beneficiary of the US, EU, UN and EAU, in a successful attempt to route Al Shabaab from the country, Somalia is currently an international entitlement (human rights) program. It's actually going very well, with Kenya and Ethiopian troops doing the heavy lifting (with massive support from the West).

I don't get the idea that limiting government = Somalia. Somalia was ruled by the totalitatian AlS (in affiliation with AlQ) and is currently being liberated by the Western world.

As someone who appears to believe in giving people a chance, do you support Operation Linda Nchi?
 
Dapper Andy said:
So work in a factory or McDonalds.

There ya go. Problem solved and it didn't cost the tax payer anything.
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No why the **** should my wife or I have to work in a factory just to take care of a child, it benefits you and society to have both of us working in well paying and educated jobs and having subsidized daycare than to have one of us work in a degrading job.
 
Gipper said:
No, YOU don't seem to get it. Know what else would make it possible for two people to work instead of just one? Three guesses.

You're offering a pound of cure. I'm offering an ounce of prevention.
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No, I understand your concerns. I just think the policy/program would be a good thing for society. I doubt most people are going to have a kid just because they can get free daycare. They're still having to pay more money than they would had they not had a kid. Plus, I don't know if you have kids, but it's pretty tiring.
 
0bserver92 said:
If both you and your wife work in a knowledge industry the hours are rather hard to stagger and why would you want to stagger when both of you can work a full day.
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So only nine-to-fivers are having kids and being unable to afford them? Is that what you're saying?

The careers that tend to work those hours are the ones that are most likely to afford kids. The ones that can't are the ones who often have night shifts (grocery, retail, fast food, etc. - that isn't including well-paying careers that don't work standard hours, such as pretty much anything in the medical industry).

If first-shift, shirt-and-tie professionals can't afford daytime babysitters, I guess the world, as we know it, is going to fall into chaos. Embrace for the apocalypse and keep Tina Turner away from all your canned tuna and gasoline.
 
ecofarm said:
As a current beneficiary of the US, EU, UN and EAU, in a successful attempt to route Al Shabaab from the country, Somalia is currently an international entitlement (human rights) program. It's actually going very well, with Kenya and Ethiopian troops doing the heavy lifting (with massive support from the West).

I don't get the idea that limiting government = Somalia. Somalia was ruled by the totalitatian AlS (in affiliation with AlQ) and is currently being liberated by the Western world.

As someone who appears to believe in giving people a chance, do you support Operation Linda Nchi?
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Oh, I was just using Somalia as an example because it's been called a Libertarian paradise in the past. Yes, I suppose I would support Operation Linda Nchi.
 
If Day Care is subsidized, then it comes under the influence of the government. That means eventually the government will be have oversight into the whole concept. While daycare is a challenging proposition, it seems to me, the last thing we need is government influence on our children at an even earlier age.
 
afr0byte said:
No, I understand your concerns. I just think the policy/program would be a good thing for society. I doubt most people are going to have a kid just because they can get free daycare. They're still having to pay more money than they would had they not had a kid. Plus, I don't know if you have kids, but it's pretty tiring.
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One, I don't have kids. Aside from not really wanting one, I don't want to shell out for them. I also have enough of a conscience to not expect you to either.

Which do you think is a better solution: giving every skateboarder free helmets and kneepads so they don't get hurt, or telling them not to perform dangerous stunts with a skateboard?
 
Gipper said:
So only nine-to-fivers are having kids and being unable to afford them? Is that what you're saying?

The careers that tend to work those hours are the ones that are most likely to afford kids. The ones that can't are the ones who often have night shifts (grocery, retail, fast food, etc. - that isn't including well-paying careers that don't work standard hours, such as pretty much anything in the medical industry).

If first-shift, shirt-and-tie professionals can't afford daytime babysitters, I guess the world, as we know it, is going to fall into chaos. Embrace for the apocalypse and keep Tina Turner away from all your canned tuna and gasoline.
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Do you not want white-collar workers? If even the most well payed can't afford it then you have an issue.
 
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