View Poll Results: Is atheism a religion

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Thread: Is atheism a religion[W:711:831]

  1. #71
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    Re: Is atheism a religion

    Quote Originally Posted by TiredOfLife View Post
    Care to put that to the test? What does "fittest" mean?
    Grim is going to run as he always does from demonstrating expertise.

    Furthermore, only one creationist I've seen actually went to the forum I linked. He got a proverbial new one ripped. The rest were way too cowardly to attempt to argue with PhDs in the hard sciences who actively study evolution out in the field. When push comes to shove about demonstrating their alleged knowledge, they all run in the end. IMO, anyone who accepts YEC has issues with maturity and reality acceptance.

    Furthermore, I generally don't wade into what or who is a Christian, but I cannot consider a YEC to be a Christian as YEC deems God to be the Supreme Liar of all time.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  2. #72
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    Re: Is atheism a religion

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Did you catch the logic there that deems that the Catholic Church is a bunch of atheists per James's criteria?
    I don't know if I'd agree his statement could arrive at that conclusion, but he was certainly trying to say, "hey, since atheists also think these other unrelated things are true, atheists are religious!"

  3. #73
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    Re: Is atheism a religion

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    I don't know if I'd agree his statement could arrive at that conclusion, but he was certainly trying to say, "hey, since atheists also think these other unrelated things are true, atheists are religious!"
    But when we turn that around, anyone who believes in the same theories that alleged atheists do is an atheist as well.

    "theory of evolution, the big bag theory and any numerous theories not rooted in a belief of a deity"

    Huh.

    Therefore, accepting evolution, big bang, gravity, germ, radioactivity and other theories not rooted in a diety makes you an atheist.

    Seems that under Rage's criteria there are more atheists then theists.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  4. #74
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    Re: Is atheism a religion

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    I think the term you are looking for is "agnostic," they are the ones who claim to neither believe nor disbelieve in God. However, in my opinion, such a middle-of-the-road stance is impossible for the human mind to take.

    If I tell you not to imagine a pink elephant, the first thing you will do is imagine a pink elephant. That's because the human mind can't deal in negatives, it only deals in concepts and constructs. Thus, a person who is atheistic generally believes that no god exists. They may, however, concede that there is no evidence to support the assertion that no god exists, and that it's simply an opinion.
    Nope.

    Agnosticism is a stance about knowledge and what is knowable. Atheism is practical philosophy. It has nothing to do with what can or cannot be known.

  5. #75
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    Re: Is atheism a religion

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Do you have a problem with evidence being required in order to make the claim that god exists?
    Allow me to point out that I didn't make any value judgement on that. I simply stated the fact that said premise is implied as part of the supporting logic to your claim.

    The point, lest it be lost, was that "there is no God" is the belief held by most atheists.


    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post

    You may not be "demanding" that proof of the negative be given, but you sure are putting the burden on atheists to prove that there is no god. The result is convenient (and painfully obvious): divert attention away from those making the claim that god exists.
    I'm not doing any such thing - and so perhaps what's "painfully obvious" is your lack of reading comprehension.

    Who has the burden of proof was never even peripheral to the point I was making.

    Again, what I said was that while many atheists believe that God does not exist (this being a positive claim), they would acknowledge the inherent inability to prove this claim. Which is indisputable.

    Again, this is fact, and I made no value judgment on that fact either way. You cannot disprove the existence of God.

  6. #76
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    Re: Is atheism a religion

    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeAndMirrors View Post
    Nope.

    Agnosticism is a stance about knowledge and what is knowable. Atheism is practical philosophy. It has nothing to do with what can or cannot be known.
    Aren't you splitting hairs now? Here's what you said...

    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeAndMirrors View Post
    Most atheists don't believe that no god exists.

    They simply don't believe claims made by the religious, because there's no evidence for them.
    So most atheists don't believe that no god exists.... I'm assuming your double-negative was just bad grammar and what you meant to say was "most atheists do believe in the possibility of a god existing, they just don't believe in religious claims due to the lack of evidence."

    Stop me here if I'm wrong. I may just have misunderstood you.

    However, that seems like a statement that would suggest that since God's existence is a possibility, and since it's simply down to the evidence (which only adds to our uncertainty), you're really describing agnostics and not atheists.

    Atheism is a belief set, I would argue. It's the proactive belief that no god exists.

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    Re: Is atheism a religion

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Your postings suggests you do not even have the most pedestrian grasp of any of the concepts that make up the foundation of the Theory of Evolution much less the finer points it makes.

    Especially the fact that you never refute anything said and you run away from long technical posts.

    Furthermore, if you truly believe you understand the theory, you shouldn't have any problem convincing PHds in the hard sciences that evolution is false here.
    I got a good laugh out of that one. Thanks.

  8. #78
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    Re: Is atheism a religion

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    Aren't you splitting hairs now? Here's what you said...

    So most atheists don't believe that no god exists.... I'm assuming your double-negative was just bad grammar and what you meant to say was "most atheists do believe in the possibility of a god existing, they just don't believe in religious claims due to the lack of evidence."

    Stop me here if I'm wrong. I may just have misunderstood you.

    However, that seems like a statement that would suggest that since God's existence is a possibility, and since it's simply down to the evidence (which only adds to our uncertainty), you're really describing agnostics and not atheists.

    Atheism is a belief set, I would argue. It's the proactive belief that no god exists.
    No. These are two entirely different subjects.

    One is about what knowledge is possible. One is about how to live our lives and assess reality based on whatever knowledge we have.

    Atheists do not "believe" anything. They simply have not seen compelling evidence of any deity. End of story.

    Well, you may "believe" that's what atheism is, but you're mistaken.

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    Re: Is atheism a religion

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    Allow me to point out that I didn't make any value judgement on that. I simply stated the fact that said premise is implied as part of the supporting logic to your claim.

    The point, lest it be lost, was that "there is no God" is the belief held by most atheists.
    If discussing this informally with anyone else (e.g. other atheists) I would consider this to be a perfectly reasonable statement. Only with you I have to remember that "belief" carries a more specific meaning, so I would amend your statement to "'There is no God' is the conclusion reached by many atheists."


    I'm not doing any such thing
    That's what you keep saying, and then you go and keep doing it.

    Who has the burden of proof was never even peripheral to the point I was making.

    Again, what I said was that while many atheists believe that God does not exist (this being a positive claim),
    Wrong, and you're contradicting yourself since you yourself have already acknowledged that the nonexistence of God is a position arrived at through lack of evidence of his existence, which is not the same thing as coming out and making the positive claim that he doesn't exist. Religious people make the positive claim that he exists, fail to support it in any way, and atheists have responded quite reasonably that until such time as you provide evidence they're not required to accept the claim (or even the possibility) that he exists. You're playing semantic games but they're completely transparent.
    they would acknowledge the inherent inability to prove this claim. Which is indisputable.

    Again, this is fact, and I made no value judgment on that fact either way. You cannot disprove the existence of God.
    That's an irrelevant observation since it's not our job to disprove the existence of god in the first place. It's your job to prove that he does.

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    Re: Is atheism a religion

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    But when we turn that around, anyone who believes in the same theories that alleged atheists do is an atheist as well.

    "theory of evolution, the big bag theory and any numerous theories not rooted in a belief of a deity"

    Huh.

    Therefore, accepting evolution, big bang, gravity, germ, radioactivity and other theories not rooted in a diety makes you an atheist.

    Seems that under Rage's criteria there are more atheists then theists.
    I hadn't looked at it like that.

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