View Poll Results: Is communism possible in the USA?

Voters
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  • Yes, Soviet type of communism

    12 10.62%
  • Yes, community type of communism

    14 12.39%
  • Yes, religious type of communism

    2 1.77%
  • Yes, other type of communism

    14 12.39%
  • No, not possible

    61 53.98%
  • Dunno

    3 2.65%
  • Other

    7 6.19%
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Thread: Is communism possible in the USA?

  1. #191
    double secret probation AngryOldGuy's Avatar
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    Re: Is communism possible in the USA?

    "Forced healthcare"
    is that like an involuntary proctology exam?
    oh yes now that we've embarked on the fully socialized healthcare journey
    we'll have to endure decades of stories of lousy medical care
    until in a very short time our medical industry which is currently the envy of the world
    has sunken to the level of the performance of our public schools

    but its a-ok cuz them evil rich folks will not only continue sending their kids to private schools
    but get their A1 quality private medical care as well

    The beat goes on, the beat goes on
    Drums keep pounding
    A rhythm to the brain
    La de da de de, la de da de da

  2. #192
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    Re: Is communism possible in the USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Forced healthcare. How horrible.

    Well, it sure beats torture and secret renditions...aka Bushcare.
    I've had government run healthcare almost all my life. For the life of me, I cannot figure out why anyone with a choice would want it.
    Only a fool measures equality by results and not opportunities.

  3. #193
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    Re: Is communism possible in the USA?

    Why did you add the "in the USA"? It doesn't change the question :P

  4. #194
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    Re: Is communism possible in the USA?

    oh sry DV my bad
    if someone declares themselves as left or right it helps (as a very shorthand method)
    to try and quickly figger out 'where they're coming from'
    since you've listed other I'm bereft of that avenue

    yup a mixed economy doesn't stay that way for long
    and sadly history shows it always goes in only one direction

  5. #195
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    Re: Is communism possible in the USA?

    Mach wouldn't it change it completely ?

    "Is communism possible"

    that's material for a whole nuther thread

  6. #196
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    Re: Is communism possible in the USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    Well, that's not what your policies actually do. They stagnate power and wealth as much upward as possible. The "competitive market" is based wholly on the power of owners, with workers feeding on the scraps. Actual merit seldom makes even a little bit of difference. Most people obtain employment through connections or nepotism, not through talent or skill.



    Artificial scarcity of work and artificial lowering of wages are tools to keep power and wealth moving ever upward. It has nothing to do with merit. It is merely setting the rules for the marketplace to benefit the rich and powerful over the poor, and denying them any power.



    That's absurd. There is, right now, far more labor available than there is work to do. Especially if you take out all the work that does nothing but produce profit, instead of actual goods or services. The idea that competition keeps wealth and power distributed is nonsense. It never has. It has no effect on the concentration or distribution of power at all.



    The system is already totally broken. Or have you become so mired in this "job creator" nonsense that you don't see that the only thing standing between a worker and starvation is whether or not a rich person can make a profit off of their labor. The worker is, by definition, forced to sell their labor for less than it is worth. Sure, you can go into business for yourself, but then that vaunted competition comes in and the rich and powerful can do whatever they want to force you out of the market.



    None of this is true. How difficult really is it to understand "from each according to their ability, to each according to their needs"? Everyone contributes, and everyone reaps the rewards.

    The future will unfold in one of two ways. Either we will stick with the current systems where all the power is held in the hands of a few people, and increasing technology will render labor less and less important, and more work will be done without humans. A growing population and fewer jobs (and the number will only continue to decrease) will mean a bigger underclass and lower pay. The impoverished class will grow, and the gap between rich and poor will widen. Or, we do not let the entire economic system continue to operate for the benefit of a few, and aim it to benefit everyone. Everyone will contribute, and no one will have to be overworked because there will be less work to do. And we can all enjoy the fruits of that labor. Do you want your capitalist dystopia, or do you want an egalitarian future where people are actually happy?
    Apparently you have confused the current/past US economy with some form of unregulated capitalism. The government has been screwing with it for a very long time. Industrialist/corporatist started trying to control the market and limit competition at least as early as the late 1800s, probably if you dig deep enough, from the very beginning.

    Lets see, in history, there has never been a particularly successful attempt at socialism and the top economy has always been a market/capitalist based system. Name a single attempt at socialism in a whole society that was ever been "successful" and did anything but impoverish everyone in that society, except those leading the socialism.
    Only a fool measures equality by results and not opportunities.

  7. #197
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    Re: Is communism possible in the USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by AngryOldGuy View Post
    oh sry DV my bad
    if someone declares themselves as left or right it helps (as a very shorthand method)
    to try and quickly figger out 'where they're coming from'
    since you've listed other I'm bereft of that avenue

    yup a mixed economy doesn't stay that way for long
    and sadly history shows it always goes in only one direction
    I'm other, because the whole of my political beliefs don't really fit left or right. Economically, I consider the extremes left socialist/communist and the right corporatist, neither of which I support. I'm more towards Libertarian on the economy, that is, keep the government out of it as much as possible/practical.
    Only a fool measures equality by results and not opportunities.

  8. #198
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    Re: Is communism possible in the USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by DVSentinel View Post
    Apparently you have confused the current/past US economy with some form of unregulated capitalism. The government has been screwing with it for a very long time. Industrialist/corporatist started trying to control the market and limit competition at least as early as the late 1800s, probably if you dig deep enough, from the very beginning.

    Lets see, in history, there has never been a particularly successful attempt at socialism and the top economy has always been a market/capitalist based system. Name a single attempt at socialism in a whole society that was ever been "successful" and did anything but impoverish everyone in that society, except those leading the socialism.
    I can't name a single time anyone actually really tried socialism. The prominent examples you're thinking of were fascist dictatorships that falsely labeled themselves socialist. But you're entirely wrong if you think that the problem is "government screwing with the marketplace". Real liberty in this country disappeared the moment that government was put up for sale on the market. We certainly regulate our capitalism, but not for the benefit of anyone but the most powerful capitalists. They remain wholly unregulated, and they have the bought and paid for congress to prove it.
    Liberté. Égalité. Fraternité.

  9. #199
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    Re: Is communism possible in the USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    I can't name a single time anyone actually really tried socialism. The prominent examples you're thinking of were fascist dictatorships that falsely labeled themselves socialist.
    It's so great and we know so much about it, yet no one every actually tried it? I'm not sure if you realize this but that's about the most damning evidence vs socialism presented so far.

    Second, most of us understand that socialism has of course actually been tried, but reality ensures that it immediately becomes corrupted and power is grabbed by a few, who then use the façade of socialist propaganda and ideals to continue their regime for as long as it lasts, which typically hasn't been all that long. It's like those elementary particles that exist, but it's nearly impossible to observe them independently because the picoseond they come into existence, they decay or react into some other form.

  10. #200
    double secret probation AngryOldGuy's Avatar
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    Re: Is communism possible in the USA?

    "the economy, that is, keep the government out of it as much as possible/practical" ?

    well hootenanny n hawt dang we've got ourselves a closet Conservative here folks!

    "bought and paid for congress to prove it"

    trust me buddy no business man would spend that kinda money if there wasn't going to be a return on investment.
    two reasons to pay for the politicians
    either one: to gain some unfair advantage through the use of the government against your competition
    (there can never be a monopoly without government intervention)
    or
    two: keep the government from coming is and wrecking your business
    kinda like paying protection money to the mafia

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