View Poll Results: I have completed the following formal educations

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  • None or very little

    3 3.53%
  • Attended school, but did not graduate

    1 1.18%
  • GED or graduated from high school

    19 22.35%
  • Some college

    18 21.18%
  • 2 year college degree

    17 20.00%
  • 4 year college degree

    32 37.65%
  • formal education based technical degree/certification

    16 18.82%
  • Military or other past-high school degree

    12 14.12%
  • Lawyer, doctor, other high education degree

    5 5.88%
  • Masters/PhD

    27 31.76%
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Thread: What is your level of formal education?

  1. #111
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    Re: What is your level of formal education?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    yeah we ought to get back on track. For even the most important law jobs (Yale Law professor or US Sup Ct justice) the JD is the terminal degree. same with the MBA for business while a masters in say history is not sufficient to be say the Sterling Professor of History at Yale or a department chair at Stanford
    Yes, I agree. I just got a little perturbed when someone commented a J.D. is merely the equivalent of a Masters. I did some research and found out what the ABA and several state bars think. You might check out my post # 88, page 9.

    Short version, the ABA equates the J.D. with the Ph.D. and also allows lawyers the right to use the title obtained by getting one, especially when working in an academic field (i.e. as an instructor you can be called Doctor). Small wonder when a J.D. takes 3 years and 90 units, but even this MFA one member was touting only requires 45; and all Masters programs require 45 units or less. I'd never use it in legal practice, but if I ever taught I might.

    Okay, rant over! lol
    If I stop responding it doesn't mean I've conceded the point or agree with you. It only means I've made my point and I don't mind you having the last word. Please wait a few minutes before "quoting" me. I often correct errors for a minute or two after I post before the final product is ready.

  2. #112
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    Re: What is your level of formal education?

    Quote Originally Posted by Artevelde View Post
    I heard once that 50%of all attorneys in the world practice in the US. Not really a good thing for the US I feel (no disrespect intended).
    There are a lot. During my last year of law school I was eating at a restaurant I used to frequent about a block away from my school. There was this one waiter there who often served me. This one time he asked about what I was studying and I when told him I was in my last year of law school he said he was a practicing attorney too! I looked at him in surprise and asked why he was waiting tables and he said he was in practice but he needed to make extra cash to pay the bills.

    When I first moved to my new state I bumped into several licensed attorneys doing work other than law. A lot of grads also find themselves working for $22 -$25 an hour on document review jobs contracted through legal temporary agencies. There are definately more lawyers than there are paying jobs available in the field.
    Last edited by Captain Adverse; 08-01-13 at 06:42 PM.
    If I stop responding it doesn't mean I've conceded the point or agree with you. It only means I've made my point and I don't mind you having the last word. Please wait a few minutes before "quoting" me. I often correct errors for a minute or two after I post before the final product is ready.

  3. #113
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    Re: What is your level of formal education?

    Quote Originally Posted by penn1954 View Post
    High school grad here.
    Just enough college to know I didn't want to keep attending!!
    Same here. Did get a bunch of technical certs in the logistics industry though, that was much later on.
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  4. #114
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    Re: What is your level of formal education?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    Sure, but I'm talking in terms of time, effort and prestige.
    Mehhhh...

    I don't always see it as being hard and fast like that.

    I have a great deal of respect for anyone who has earned a PhD (or any doctoral degree), but doing so could sort of force your career in directions you might not sometimes wish it to go.

    I have an MLIS (Library & Information Science) in which I concentrated more along the lines of information science than strict, traditional librarianship.

    I could pursue a PhD in information science, and have been offered the opportunity to do so, but doing so wouldn't do anything for my career prospects and would, essentially, be useless to me.

    Working, as I do, in the competitive intelligence and market analysis sector of the financial services industry I'd be much better served with a second Masters degree.

    An MBA with a concentration in finance (which I intend to pursue once my one-year-old is in kindergarten) would open doors for me (incredibly lucrative doors) that a PhD in my field almost certainly wouldn't.

    Now, to your point, I'd argue that earning an MBA in finance would require at least as much effort as earning a PhD in information science and I think there's a lot to be said in so far as prestige is concerned in having two Masters degrees and knocking back $250,000 a year vurses having an MLIS and a PhD and making $60,000 a year as an adjunct professor somewhere.

    I understand that if you're working in academia there's a certain cachet to holding a PhD than holding any number of assorted Masters degress can't match.

    But in the business world education can sometimes be a very different animal.

  5. #115
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    Re: What is your level of formal education?

    Quote Originally Posted by soot View Post
    h I intend to pursue once my one-year-old is in kindergarten) would open doors for me (incredibly lucrative doors) that a PhD in my field almost certainly wouldn't.

    Now, to your point, I'd argue that earning an MBA in finance would require at least as much effort as earning a PhD in information science and I think there's a lot to be said in so far as prestige is concerned in having two Masters degrees and knocking back $250,000 a year vurses having an MLIS and a PhD and making $60,000 a year as an adjunct professor somewhere.

    I understand that if you're working in academia there's a certain cachet to holding a PhD than holding any number of assorted Masters degress can't match.

    But in the business world education can sometimes be a very different animal.
    Sure. An MBA is different from a PhD or an MS or MFA. That's why it makes sense to separate out the various higher level degrees into their own categories. Although no, an MBA is not as much work as a PhD in basically any field. Speaking as someone with a JD who knows a bunch of joint JD/MBA's, getting an MBA is incredibly easy (at least compared to law school). The hard part is getting into a top tier program. My old undergrad roommate went on to get an MFA in acting from Yale. While she was there she briefly dated a guy getting his MBA, and when he found out what her schedule was like his response was something along the lines of "wow that's way the hell harder than what I have to do." And by contrast, PhD programs take about twice as long to complete and usually require genuinely original academic work. That's much tougher than learning how to read financial spreadsheets and analyze stock offerings.
    Last edited by Aderleth; 08-01-13 at 07:14 PM.

  6. #116
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    What is your level of formal education?

    My question would have been "highest level of education completed," and options would have been less than HS, HS diploma/GED, 2-year associates, bachelors, MBA, other masters, JD, PhD, MD, other doctorate.

    [edit]. Actually I'd probably have combined MBA with masters degrees.
    Last edited by Neomalthusian; 08-01-13 at 07:36 PM.

  7. #117
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    Re: What is your level of formal education?

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    My question would have been "highest level of education completed," and options would have been less than HS, HS diploma/GED, 2-year associates, bachelors, MBA, other masters, JD, PhD, MD, other doctorate.

    [edit]. Actually I'd probably have combined MBA with masters degrees.
    Wait...are you saying in this particular hierarchy that once you got to the doctorate level (above masters) you'd list J.D. lowest, then PhD, then MD, then "other doctorate" whatever that means? Or are you saying you'd list all the doctorates equally?
    If I stop responding it doesn't mean I've conceded the point or agree with you. It only means I've made my point and I don't mind you having the last word. Please wait a few minutes before "quoting" me. I often correct errors for a minute or two after I post before the final product is ready.

  8. #118
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    Re: What is your level of formal education?

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Adverse View Post
    There are a lot. During my last year of law school I was eating at a restaurant I used to frequent about a block away from my school. There was this one waiter there who often served me. This one time he asked about what I was studying and I when told him I was in my last year of law school he said he was a practicing attorney too! I looked at him in surprise and asked why he was waiting tables and he said he was in practice but he needed to make extra cash to pay the bills.

    When I first moved to my new state I bumped into several licensed attorneys doing work other than law. A lot of grads also find themselves working for $22 -$25 an hour on document review jobs contracted through legal temporary agencies. There are definately more lawyers than there are paying jobs available in the field.
    I tell friends' kids that unless you can get into a name law school or your state's best public law school (example UC Berk in california, Boston U in Mass, Ohio State, or UNC-Chaple Hill) its probably not worth going to law school. When I was in lawschool if you were in the top third at an Ivy or equivalent school you could get a job at one of the best wall street firms. middle of the class-some very good NY firms or really good regional firms in Cincinnati, Columbus, Cleveland. Law review at a decent state school about the same. Now its shifted about 50% meaning you better be in the top quarter of your class at Columbia or better for those big NY firms and law review at Ohio State for a top fourth street firm in cincinnati or a top firm in Cleveland



  9. #119
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    Re: What is your level of formal education?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    There are lots of terminal degrees, and they're not all treated equally in terms if prestige. MD's, JD's, MFA's and PhD's all get treated differently in society.
    What is a "terminal degree?"

  10. #120
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    Re: What is your level of formal education?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    Sure. An MBA is different from a PhD or an MS or MFA. That's why it makes sense to separate out the various higher level degrees into their own categories. Although no, an MBA is not as much work as a PhD in basically any field. Speaking as someone with a JD who knows a bunch of joint JD/MBA's, getting an MBA is incredibly easy (at least compared to law school). The hard part is getting into a top tier program. My old undergrad roommate went on to get an MFA in acting from Yale. While she was there she briefly dated a guy getting his MBA, and when he found out what her schedule was like his response was something along the lines of "wow that's way the hell harder than what I have to do." And by contrast, PhD programs take about twice as long to complete and usually require genuinely original academic work. That's much tougher than learning how to read financial spreadsheets and analyze stock offerings.
    I guess my hearing getting a PhD is largely about sucking the over-seer's dick and kissing his/her ass for a few years was wrong.

    Sorry to interrupt. Carry on your debate. .

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