View Poll Results: Which is more crucial

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  • Freedom of Religion

    26 56.52%
  • Mandate to Evolve

    10 21.74%
  • Both are equally crucial

    10 21.74%
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Thread: Freedom of Religion vs the Mandate to Evolve [W 65]

  1. #381
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    Re: Freedom of Religion vs the Mandate to Evolve [W 65]

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    So sorry if you're imaginary deity can't stand up to the scientific method.
    Oh, but He can. He just can't stand up to atheism's spin on it.

    4. Did you ever stop to consider that God, being an intelligent personage, might have decided that, in most cases, man should figure out how to come to Him, first?
    Last edited by Dooble; 08-02-13 at 04:17 PM.

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    Re: Freedom of Religion vs the Mandate to Evolve [W 65]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dooble View Post
    Oh, but He can. He just can't stand up to atheism's spin on it.

    4. Did you ever stop to consider that God, being an intelligent personage, might have decided that, in most cases, man should figure out how to come to Him, first?
    What is the atheistic spin on the scientific method? And yes, I've considered that. There are many that are willing, even some of the best scientists in the world, but so far - nothing.
    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    I've never denied my own hackish tendencies
    Quote Originally Posted by Pin dÁr View Post
    scientific by itself isn't enough of course.
    Quote Originally Posted by blaxshep View Post
    Not all Nazis were bad people

  3. #383
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    Re: Freedom of Religion vs the Mandate to Evolve [W 65]

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    What is the atheistic spin on the scientific method?
    Doing nothing (or half assing it) and expecting something in return.

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    And yes, I've considered that. There are many that are willing, even some of the best scientists in the world, but so far - nothing.
    That's because their heart wasn't in it.

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    Re: Freedom of Religion vs the Mandate to Evolve [W 65]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dooble View Post
    Doing nothing (or half assing it) and expecting something in return.

    That's because their heart wasn't in it.
    How do you figure the atheist spin (still haven't addressed this) is doing nothing and expecting something in return?

    Wow so now you're dictating who and who are not "true" believers.
    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    I've never denied my own hackish tendencies
    Quote Originally Posted by Pin dÁr View Post
    scientific by itself isn't enough of course.
    Quote Originally Posted by blaxshep View Post
    Not all Nazis were bad people

  5. #385
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    Re: Freedom of Religion vs the Mandate to Evolve [W 65]

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    the federal government has no authority in education.

    that is the state power.

    the u.s. is suppose to practice federalism.

    just becuase government is doing something and some people like and thinks its the right thing to do, its still not legal.
    Doesn't mean it's illegal either. Remember our brand of federalism stated with a federal government that was too weak. So, we strengthened it.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Freedom of Religion vs the Mandate to Evolve [W 65]

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    How do you figure the atheist spin (still haven't addressed this) is doing nothing and expecting something in return?
    If I tell you God exists, then you ask for proof. If I tell you how you can get proof, you say ________?

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    Wow so now you're dictating who and who are not "true" believers.
    No, I'm saying that I've gotten responses. And since I know I'm not out of my mind, then the disconnect must be on the other end. Either their heart wasn't in it, or they didn't even try.

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    Re: Freedom of Religion vs the Mandate to Evolve [W 65]

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Doesn't mean it's illegal either. Remember our brand of federalism stated with a federal government that was too weak. So, we strengthened it.
    its clear you dont know the constitution, the founders are clear, congress only has 18 powers...education is not in the 18 powers of congress

    according to your logic congress has opened ended powers to do anything they wish and that is simply not true.

    “The powers delegated by the proposed Constitution to the federal government are few and defined . . . to be exercised principally on external objects, as war, peace, negotiation, and foreign commerce.” – James Madison, Federalist 45

    “[Congressional jurisdiction of power] is limited to certain enumerated objects, which concern all the members of the republic, but which are not to be attained by the separate provisions of any.” – James Madison, Federalist 14

    “The Constitution allows only the means which are ‘necessary,’ not those which are merely ‘convenient,’ for effecting the enumerated powers. If such a latitude of construction be allowed to this phrase as to give any non-enumerated power, it will go to every one, for there is not one which ingenuity may not torture into a convenience in some instance or other, to some one of so long a list of enumerated powers. It would swallow up all the delegated powers, and reduce the whole to one power, as before observed” – Thomas Jefferson, 1791

    “Congress has not unlimited powers to provide for the general welfare, but only those specifically enumerated.” – Thomas Jefferson, 1798

    “This specification of particulars [the 18 enumerated powers of Article I, Section 8] evidently excludes all pretension to a general legislative authority, because an affirmative grant of special powers would be absurd as well as useless if a general authority was intended.” – Alexander Hamilton, Federalist 83
    Last edited by Master PO; 08-02-13 at 06:35 PM.

  8. #388
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    Re: Freedom of Religion vs the Mandate to Evolve [W 65]

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    its clear you dont know the constitution, the founders are clear, congress only has 18 powers.

    according to your logic congress has opened ended powers to do anything they wish and that is simply not true.

    “The powers delegated by the proposed Constitution to the federal government are few and defined . . . to be exercised principally on external objects, as war, peace, negotiation, and foreign commerce.” – James Madison, Federalist 45

    “[Congressional jurisdiction of power] is limited to certain enumerated objects, which concern all the members of the republic, but which are not to be attained by the separate provisions of any.” – James Madison, Federalist 14

    “The Constitution allows only the means which are ‘necessary,’ not those which are merely ‘convenient,’ for effecting the enumerated powers. If such a latitude of construction be allowed to this phrase as to give any non-enumerated power, it will go to every one, for there is not one which ingenuity may not torture into a convenience in some instance or other, to some one of so long a list of enumerated powers. It would swallow up all the delegated powers, and reduce the whole to one power, as before observed” – Thomas Jefferson, 1791

    “Congress has not unlimited powers to provide for the general welfare, but only those specifically enumerated.” – Thomas Jefferson, 1798

    “This specification of particulars [the 18 enumerated powers of Article I, Section 8] evidently excludes all pretension to a general legislative authority, because an affirmative grant of special powers would be absurd as well as useless if a general authority was intended.” – Alexander Hamilton, Federalist 83
    yes, I'm familiar with your rant. Show me your Constitutional scholar credentials.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Freedom of Religion vs the Mandate to Evolve [W 65]

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    yes, I'm familiar with your rant. Show me your Constitutional scholar credentials.
    i dont need one to look and see that education in not among congress's powers.

    do you see education anywhere in these 18 powers?


    The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

    To borrow Money on the credit of the United States;

    To regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with the Indian Tribes;

    To establish an uniform Rule of Naturalization, and uniform Laws on the subject of Bankruptcies throughout the United States;

    To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

    To provide for the Punishment of counterfeiting the Securities and current Coin of the United States;

    To establish Post Offices and post Roads;

    To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries;

    To constitute Tribunals inferior to the supreme Court;

    To define and punish Piracies and Felonies committed on the high Seas, and Offences against the Law of Nations;

    To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water;

    To raise and support Armies, but no Appropriation of Money to that Use shall be for a longer Term than two Years;

    To provide and maintain a Navy;

    To make Rules for the Government and Regulation of the land and naval Forces;

    To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

    To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

    To exercise exclusive Legislation in all Cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten Miles square) as may, by Cession of particular States, and the Acceptance of Congress, become the Seat of the Government of the United States, and to exercise like Authority over all Places purchased by the Consent of the Legislature of the State in which the Same shall be, for the Erection of Forts, Magazines, Arsenals, dock-Yards, and other needful Buildings;--And

    To make all Laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into Execution the foregoing Powers, and all other Powers vested by this Constitution in the Government of the United States, or in any Department or Officer thereof.

  10. #390
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    Re: Freedom of Religion vs the Mandate to Evolve [W 65]

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    i dont need one to look and see that education in not among congress's powers.

    do you see education anywhere in these 18 powers?


    The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

    To borrow Money on the credit of the United States;

    To regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with the Indian Tribes;

    To establish an uniform Rule of Naturalization, and uniform Laws on the subject of Bankruptcies throughout the United States;

    To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

    To provide for the Punishment of counterfeiting the Securities and current Coin of the United States;

    To establish Post Offices and post Roads;

    To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries;

    To constitute Tribunals inferior to the supreme Court;

    To define and punish Piracies and Felonies committed on the high Seas, and Offences against the Law of Nations;

    To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water;

    To raise and support Armies, but no Appropriation of Money to that Use shall be for a longer Term than two Years;

    To provide and maintain a Navy;

    To make Rules for the Government and Regulation of the land and naval Forces;

    To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

    To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

    To exercise exclusive Legislation in all Cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten Miles square) as may, by Cession of particular States, and the Acceptance of Congress, become the Seat of the Government of the United States, and to exercise like Authority over all Places purchased by the Consent of the Legislature of the State in which the Same shall be, for the Erection of Forts, Magazines, Arsenals, dock-Yards, and other needful Buildings;--And

    To make all Laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into Execution the foregoing Powers, and all other Powers vested by this Constitution in the Government of the United States, or in any Department or Officer thereof.
    It doesn't have to be. There are sets and subsets of assigned powers. More than one libertarian has misread the Constitution. It helps to consult those who know how it works. Even a mechanic needs to learn from those who already are mechanics. You can't make judgements with that learning. So, that's why we take our cars to mechanics.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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