View Poll Results: Is the age of a dead burglar,assailant,armed robber, attempted rapist/murder relavent

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Thread: Is the age of a dead burglar,assailant,armed robber, attempted rapist/murder relavent

  1. #231
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    Re: Is the age of a dead burglar,assailant,armed robber, attempted rapist/murder rela

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Because, you can't hold them criminally responsible as an adult and yet not consider them adults with adult rights. Yes, they can drive, and that is where the automobile accident statistics come in.
    Again.... Why can't you?
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

  2. #232
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    Re: Is the age of a dead burglar,assailant,armed robber, attempted rapist/murder rela

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    Again.... Why can't you?
    Because if they are to be considered adults, then they are entitled to all the rights or privileges of adults.

  3. #233
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    Re: Is the age of a dead burglar,assailant,armed robber, attempted rapist/murder rela

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Because if they are to be considered adults, then they are entitled to all the rights or privileges of adults.
    Punishment for the purposes of the criminal justice system and privileges as adults have two completely separate set of parameters and purposes......

    Why do you think they should be as one?
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

  4. #234
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    Re: Is the age of a dead burglar,assailant,armed robber, attempted rapist/murder rela

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    Punishment for the purposes of the criminal justice system and privileges as adults have two completely separate set of parameters and purposes......

    Why do you think they should be as one?
    Because how can you call someone an adult just when it's convenient for you and when it becomes inconvenient call that same person a child? It doesn't make sense and is too arbitrary. A person is either an adult or a child, not going in between both for purposes of convenience.

  5. #235
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    Re: Is the age of a dead burglar,assailant,armed robber, attempted rapist/murder rela

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Because how can you call someone an adult just when it's convenient for you and when it becomes inconvenient call that same person a child? It doesn't make sense and is too arbitrary. A person is either an adult or a child, not going in between both for purposes of convenience.
    I am starting to wonder if you are an adult, if you are, you obviously know NOTHING about criminal justice.
    If you don't charge someone as an adult, they go virtually unpunished. Do you know what the "Juvenile Justice" system is?
    You are aware that it does absolutely NOTHING for serious crimes right? What you are advocating is that 16 year old murderers get a 2 year sentence and be set free?
    Serious crimes are not the place for the juvenile justice system.

    What age group is being recruited into violent gangs? Do you know why?

    Do you honestly think that 14,15,16 year olds do not know right from wrong when it comes to murder, robbery, rape, etc? If your answer is that they do, then they belong in the regular criminal justice system... not the "juvenile" one.

    To understand what being "tried as an adult" is..... you have to understand the difference between the Juvenile Justice System and the regular Justice System.

    Do you?

    As for convenience......... Its not what is convenient for me, it is what is necessary for society.


    As per your comment about being either an adult or a child...... that is about the most assinine thing I have ever heard. One doesn't suddenly "become" a being capable of knowing right from wrong at an arbitrary age. Thus the purpose of trying "minors" in the regular justice system for particularly serious felonies.
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

  6. #236
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    Re: Is the age of a dead burglar,assailant,armed robber, attempted rapist/murder rela

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    I am starting to wonder if you are an adult, if you are, you obviously know NOTHING about criminal justice.
    If you don't charge someone as an adult, they go virtually unpunished. Do you know what the "Juvenile Justice" system is?
    You are aware that it does absolutely NOTHING for serious crimes right? What you are advocating is that 16 year old murderers get a 2 year sentence and be set free?
    Serious crimes are not the place for the juvenile justice system.

    What age group is being recruited into violent gangs? Do you know why?

    Do you honestly think that 14,15,16 year olds do not know right from wrong when it comes to murder, robbery, rape, etc? If your answer is that they do, then they belong in the regular criminal justice system... not the "juvenile" one.

    To understand what being "tried as an adult" is..... you have to understand the difference between the Juvenile Justice System and the regular Justice System.

    Do you?

    As for convenience......... Its not what is convenient for me, it is what is necessary for society.


    As per your comment about being either an adult or a child...... that is about the most assinine thing I have ever heard. One doesn't suddenly "become" a being capable of knowing right from wrong at an arbitrary age. Thus the purpose of trying "minors" in the regular justice system for particularly serious felonies.
    You have to draw a line between adult and child somewhere.

    Also, in my earlier posts on this thread I said that if it was a crime of a violent or serious nature that they should be able to extend their sentencing so that they do have to serve more than say 2 years for a murder or something like that.

    There was a killer Craig Price in the state next to mine who was committed as a juvenile but because he was so violent and uncooperative during his time in juvie (I think he might have killed someone in prison - not sure - I'd have to look it up), he was tried for those crimes as an adult and is still in jail now I believe, so there are things that could be done in cases of serious and violent crimes besides just trying them as an adult off the bat.

    I also mentioned that it should be dependent upon whether or not they have priors and what those would consist of. Sorry, but I just don't believe in trying a 12-year-old as an adult.

  7. #237
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    Re: Is the age of a dead burglar,assailant,armed robber, attempted rapist/murder rela

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    You have to draw a line between adult and child somewhere.

    Also, in my earlier posts on this thread I said that if it was a crime of a violent or serious nature that they should be able to extend their sentencing so that they do have to serve more than say 2 years for a murder or something like that.

    There was a killer Craig Price in the state next to mine who was committed as a juvenile but because he was so violent and uncooperative during his time in juvie (I think he might have killed someone in prison - not sure - I'd have to look it up), he was tried for those crimes as an adult and is still in jail now I believe, so there are things that could be done in cases of serious and violent crimes besides just trying them as an adult off the bat.

    I also mentioned that it should be dependent upon whether or not they have priors and what those would consist of. Sorry, but I just don't believe in trying a 12-year-old as an adult.
    There are no such things as "Priors" when you are charged in the Juvenile Justice System and then turn adult.

    A 12 year old is pushing it I agree.

    But a 16 year old? Even a 15 year old...... You betcha.
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

  8. #238
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    Re: Is the age of a dead burglar,assailant,armed robber, attempted rapist/murder rela

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    There are no such things as "Priors" when you are charged in the Juvenile Justice System and then turn adult.

    A 12 year old is pushing it I agree.

    But a 16 year old? Even a 15 year old...... You betcha.
    The thing is though that juveniles are capable of being rehabilitated. Sometimes they're violent because of an abusive home situation or whatever, and they ARE young enough that rehabilitation apparently works VERY well, so if we could rehabilitate a minor to become a productive member of society rather than a leach in the prison system, I think that would work out well. Of course, this all would be dependent on the level of violence and other such factors. If it is a person who is of 15 or 16 years of age and they are involved in crime (yes, they can have "priors" as long as they aren't actually an adult yet - juvenile record isn't sealed until you are 18 in most places I believe), say this particular person is a gang member and has priors, then perhaps that person should be tried as an adult if only to protect society.

    Of course these are just my opinions. I'm not a lawmaker or anything so . . .

  9. #239
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    Re: Is the age of a dead burglar,assailant,armed robber, attempted rapist/murder rela

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    We didn't hear or see the kid breaking into our house because we were sound asleep. I only started asking questions when I couldn't find my purse.
    now if you had rigged up a trip wire with a flare or better yet a claymore mine, not only would you have heard the little miscreant breaking in, you'd still have your purse



  10. #240
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    Re: Is the age of a dead burglar,assailant,armed robber, attempted rapist/murder rela

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    The thing is though that juveniles are capable of being rehabilitated. Sometimes they're violent because of an abusive home situation or whatever, and they ARE young enough that rehabilitation apparently works VERY well, so if we could rehabilitate a minor to become a productive member of society rather than a leach in the prison system, I think that would work out well. Of course, this all would be dependent on the level of violence and other such factors. If it is a person who is of 15 or 16 years of age and they are involved in crime (yes, they can have "priors" as long as they aren't actually an adult yet - juvenile record isn't sealed until you are 18 in most places I believe), say this particular person is a gang member and has priors, then perhaps that person should be tried as an adult if only to protect society.

    Of course these are just my opinions. I'm not a lawmaker or anything so . . .
    You are a mom, that is plenty of qualification



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