View Poll Results: Is the phrase "Creepy Ass Cracker" Racist?

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  • Yes!

    127 76.51%
  • No!

    20 12.05%
  • I blame Whitey!

    12 7.23%
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Thread: Creepy Ass Cracker.... Racist or no? [W:329/550]

  1. #361
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    re: Creepy Ass Cracker.... Racist or no? [W:329/550]

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoist View Post
    Do you think I think am not familiar with your definition? I've taken sociology courses. There are some who accept it and many who don't.
    In grad school everyone accepts it as a necessity of conversation. You see, common bigotry without societal implications is not really that interesting. What's interesting (and bad for society) is when a group has and exercises power to their advantage. Insisting on continuing to ignore the oppression and privilege aspects of racism is being intentionally simple and not useful in intellectual discussion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoist View Post
    Nothing in there about "institutional backing." Nothing about minorities not being able to be racist.
    Regarding your not understanding or noticing what the quote says, I'll post it again:

    Some sociologists have defined racism as a system of group privilege. In Portraits of White Racism, David Wellman has defined racism as “culturally sanctioned beliefs, which, regardless of intentions involved, defend the advantages whites have because of the subordinated position of racial minorities”.[23] Sociologists NoŽl A. Cazenave and Darlene Alvarez Maddern define racism as “...a highly organized system of 'race'-based group privilege that operates at every level of society and is held together by a sophisticated ideology of color/'race' supremacy.
    Do you understand how the bolded parts obliterate both of your "Nothing..." claims?

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoist View Post
    Eco, you never responded to post #352. Do you think racism no longer exists, or do you think the State sanctions racism?
    I've already answered that within the thread. See Mr.Invisible's post(s) herein if you don't understand what institutional racism in the US means.

  2. #362
    Educator HumanBeing's Avatar
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    re: Creepy Ass Cracker.... Racist or no? [W:329/550]

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoist View Post
    And yet he thinks we must accept the definition given by some sociologists, lol.
    No, just him. Even the sociological definition he supplied didn't create the same requirements for something to qualify as racism that he's stating (though he does keep changing the goalposts). At one point he claimed that racism can only be racism if it's backed by a state institution, but the sociological definition he gave didn't list state backing as a requirement.

    The Nazi's don't have a state anymore, so by his definition even they aren't racists. It's a bizarre way to define racism in any context.
    If you hate capitalism so much, then just write everything in lower case. Problem solved.

  3. #363
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    re: Creepy Ass Cracker.... Racist or no? [W:329/550]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    In grad school everyone accepts it as a necessity of conversation.
    Then why does it say SOME sociologists if everyone accepts your definition?


    Regarding your not understanding or noticing what the quote says, I'll post it again:



    Do you understand how the bolded parts obliterate both of your "Nothing..." claims?
    Do you understand how a minority of people do not dictate the definition of words for the majority?

    And I was right, there was nothing in that quote about institutional backing. Maybe if you included my entire quote for context...

    I've already answered that within the thread. See Mr.Invisible's post(s) herein if you don't understand what institutional racism in the US means.
    You said it only becomes racISM when the State backs it up. So either you are saying racISM no longer exists or it is still sanctioned by the State. Which is it?
    "Men did not make the earth ... it is the value of the improvement only, and not the earth itself, that is individual property... Every proprietor owes to the community a ground rent for the land which he holds." -- Thomas Paine, Agrarian Justice
    http://www.wealthandwant.com/

  4. #364
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    re: Creepy Ass Cracker.... Racist or no? [W:329/550]

    Quote Originally Posted by HumanBeing View Post
    No, just him. Even the sociological definition he supplied didn't create the same requirements for something to qualify as racism that he's stating (though he does keep changing the goalposts). At one point he claimed that racism can only be racism if it's backed by a state institution, but the sociological definition he gave didn't list state backing as a requirement.
    You are wrong.

    Some sociologists have defined racism as a system of group privilege. In Portraits of White Racism, David Wellman has defined racism as “culturally sanctioned beliefs, which, regardless of intentions involved, defend the advantages whites have because of the subordinated position of racial minorities”.[23] Sociologists NoŽl A. Cazenave and Darlene Alvarez Maddern define racism as “...a highly organized system of 'race'-based group privilege that operates at every level of society and is held together by a sophisticated ideology of color/'race' supremacy.
    Racism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    In case you do not understand what 'institutionalized racism' means in US context, this post should explain that for you:

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Invisible View Post
    Gladly

    "One historic example of institutional racism is the barring of African-American students from attending certain public schools, which limited the students' educational opportunities and helped prevent them from achieving a status equal to that of others. Institutional racism need not involve intentional racial discrimination. For example, individual judges might intend to impose similar sentences for similar crimes; yet if Caucasian people tend to receive lighter punishments, plausibly institutional racism occurs." (Definition of Institutional Racism | Chegg.com) [In regards to that last sentence, think the crack-cocaine sentencing disparity.)

    Look also:

    Racism in Schools: Unintentional But No Less Damaging

    Examples of Institutional Racism | Educational Leadership Development Resource Library

    Institutional Racism in US Health Care

    http://webmedia.unmc.edu/community/c...cismReport.pdf

    If you have any further misunderstandings, feel free to re-read the thread.

  5. #365
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    re: Creepy Ass Cracker.... Racist or no? [W:329/550]

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoist View Post
    You said it only becomes racISM when the State backs it up. So either you are saying racISM no longer exists or it is still sanctioned by the State. Which is it?
    You obviously do not understand institutionalized (institution backed) racism in US context. See my post above, quoting Mr.Invisible's information about that.

  6. #366
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    re: Creepy Ass Cracker.... Racist or no? [W:329/550]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    You are wrong.



    Racism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    In case you do not understand what 'institutionalized racism' means in US context, this post should explain that for you:




    If you have any further misunderstandings, feel free to re-read the thread.
    Again, you're just making up your own definition, first of racism, and now of institutional racism. Not all institutions are state backed, and it does nothing for your ridiculous idea that institutional racism is the only kind of racism that exists. And again, even your own quotes that you keep spewing are contradicting your argument. They don't make any requirement of state backing for something to qualify as institutional racism, let alone racism in general.

    You also haven't said how you can simultaneously claim that the Nazi's are racist, while claiming that racism can't exist without institutionalized state backing and can't be committed by minorities, even though the Nazis don't have a state anymore, and they are clearly a minority.

    Clearly they are racist, and clearly your personalized definition doesn't work.
    Last edited by HumanBeing; 06-28-13 at 05:35 AM.
    If you hate capitalism so much, then just write everything in lower case. Problem solved.

  7. #367
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    re: Creepy Ass Cracker.... Racist or no? [W:329/550]

    Quote Originally Posted by HumanBeing View Post
    Again, you're just making up your own definition, first of racism, and now of institutional racism. Not all institutions are state backed, and it does nothing for your ridiculous idea that institutional racism is the only kind of racism that exists. And again, even your own quotes that you keep spewing are contradicting your argument. They don't make any requirement of state backing for something to qualify as institutional racism, let alone racism in general.
    I cited the sociological definition, from wikipedia. It clearly states that a system establishing privilege must be present. Such a system can only be present throughout society for the majority or those with majority power. It's impossible for a minority (lacking majority power) to establish a system of privilege throughout society, as there is no inherent mechanism of enforcement via a belief in racial superiority.

    This is obvious, I'm not explaining it to you again. If you don't get it yet, just re-read the thread.

    Good day.

  8. #368
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    re: Creepy Ass Cracker.... Racist or no? [W:329/550]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    You obviously do not understand institutionalized (institution backed) racism in US context. See my post above, quoting Mr.Invisible's information about that.
    I was not about to read all of those articles, but I did read the one on health care. What the article describes relates more to poverty rather than race. There are many impoverished caucasians who face the same problems that article describes (lack of insurance, underserved staff, low wage jobs w/ few benefits, etc.)
    "Men did not make the earth ... it is the value of the improvement only, and not the earth itself, that is individual property... Every proprietor owes to the community a ground rent for the land which he holds." -- Thomas Paine, Agrarian Justice
    http://www.wealthandwant.com/

  9. #369
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    re: Creepy Ass Cracker.... Racist or no? [W:329/550]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    I cited the sociological definition, from wikipedia. It clearly states that a system establishing privilege must be present. Such a system can only be present throughout society for the majority or those with majority power. It's impossible for a minority (lacking majority power) to establish a system of privilege throughout society, as there is no inherent mechanism of enforcement via a belief in racial superiority.

    This is obvious, I'm not explaining it to you again. If you don't get it yet, just re-read the thread.

    Good day.
    You aren't making any sense. Seriously, read what I wrote again. How can you possibly claim that neo Nazis aren't racist? This whole thing is just absurd.
    If you hate capitalism so much, then just write everything in lower case. Problem solved.

  10. #370
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    re: Creepy Ass Cracker.... Racist or no? [W:329/550]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    I cited the sociological definition, from wikipedia. It clearly states that a system establishing privilege must be present. Such a system can only be present throughout society for the majority or those with majority power. It's impossible for a minority (lacking majority power) to establish a system of privilege throughout society, as there is no inherent mechanism of enforcement via a belief in racial superiority.

    This is obvious, I'm not explaining it to you again. If you don't get it yet, just re-read the thread.

    Good day.
    Then as HumanBeing stated, by your definition neo-nazis cannot be considered "racist."
    "Men did not make the earth ... it is the value of the improvement only, and not the earth itself, that is individual property... Every proprietor owes to the community a ground rent for the land which he holds." -- Thomas Paine, Agrarian Justice
    http://www.wealthandwant.com/

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