View Poll Results: Is Homosexuality A Choice?

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  • Yes

    44 16.99%
  • No

    171 66.02%
  • Maybe/Don't Know

    44 16.99%
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Thread: Is Homosexuality A Choice?

  1. #971
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    Re: Is Homosexuality A Choice?

    It is always so cute when hysterical people project their delusional fears on to others by calling them mentally ill.

    It's like listening to a Sumo wrestler calling somebody fat.
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

  2. #972
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    Re: Is Homosexuality A Choice?

    Quote Originally Posted by USNavySquid View Post
    There are many reasons why I don't choose homosexuality. I described my fear of social consequences and my fear of an identity crisis (also a social consequence) in an earlier post. I know, I know. You would say that I MUST be a bisexual or maybe a closet homosexual, living as a heterosexual. I would agree with the former, because as I said before, I *believe* we can change orientation/attraction... and that makes us bisexuals.
    No...because again bisexuals cannot change their orientation either. A bisexual is someone who is attracted to both men and women. They cannot change their orientation to be attracted to only men or only women. They can, however, choose to be in relationships with only men or women--but who you are in a relationship with does not define your orientation.

    That is based on the unproven premise that orientation can't be chosen. But what if it can? Then more of that line of logic collapses. I'm not trying to say that you are wrong and I am right. I'm only discussing what I believe and questioning what you believe.
    Fair enough. But I see no reason to believe it is a choice, and I see plenty of reason to believe it is not.

    Before posting, I re-read the APA's blurbs on orientation and its causes. Regarding cause, the APA reports that there is no consensus regarding factor(s) that may lead to orientation. The APA also states that "most people experience little or no sense of choice" in the matter. This last sentence, of course is not conclusive proof.

    I'm sticking to this topic as long as I have people who read and respond to my ideas. Here's another idea....

    Gender equality is on the rise in America. Activities in school that were once segregated are now not. Boys can play dress up and doll house in kindergarten and girls can build block towers and knock 'em down. High school sports are becoming more desegregated. Female place kickers and quarterbacks on the football team. Even if the teams are not integrated, more schools are creating leagues for the girls to play the same sports as the boys, such as lacrosse.

    Those are just a few examples. There are plenty of non-examples. But I believe that the trend is toward equality.

    Now, assuming that girls can do what boys can do, and vice versa, (Oh! and females are now allowed on navy submarines and their role in combat is expanding) the obvious gender differences (gender, not sex, not biology) are getting smaller. What are some other gender differences besides clothing, haircuts, sports, and toys? Here is my idea...

    The romantic love that a man feels for a woman and vice versa was based in large part on gender differences. This romantic love was defined in part by the fact that it was different from male-male camaraderie/loyalty and female-female camaraderie/loyalty. Traditionally speaking, male-male camaraderie is not romantic; is not love. Or is it?

    If the gender differences listed above are disappearing/getting smaller, then why can't the same be said of the difference b/w male-male (heterosexual) camaraderie and female-female (heterosexual) camaraderie as compared to male-female romantic love?
    How would that explain the prevalence of homosexuality in the past? I think the modern more equal society we are living in is making it easier for gay people to be honest about being gay--I do not think more people are gay as a percentage of a population now than any other time in history.

    Here's an example. BTW I'm sorry if I'm not making myself clear. This is a new idea and I'm hearing it for the first time myself. Example: I have a few close friends in life. Male friends. My buds, my bros. Guys I tell every secret to, guys with whom I feel no shame because we know each other for so long and so well. Guys I served with, was deployed with, guys I went to college and grew up with. I am loyal to these guys. I am there when they need me, I do not hesitate to ask them for help. When I walk into a room full of strangers and one of my bros is there, I immediately feel better/relieved. This feeling of relief is very similar to the feeling I get when I meet my wife in a room full of strangers. Likewise, the devotion and loyalty and sacrifices I would make to these guy friends are the same (as far as I can tell) that I would make for my wife.

    Can it then be concluded that my love for my guy friends the same as my love for my wife? Now, with gender differences taken into account, you would say no. Guys are just buddies, life-long, throw-theirselves-on-a-grenade-for-you buddies. While women/wives are the ones we get intimate with, write poetry for, go through embarrassing situations with her friends/relatives for, have children with, grow old and die with. Afterall, we are men and they are women and THAT is the difference. But... if gender differences among clothing, haircuts, toys, sports and combat are going away, then shouldn't the distinction b/w feelings for bro's and spouses go away too?

    Furthermore, I would share my writing with my bros and be their wingman in any social occasion no matter how embarrassing. So that distinction b/w bro-love and wife-love also disintegrates.

    In other words, If all or nearly all gender differences b/w men and women disappear, resulting in men and women fulfilling identical roles in both society and relationships (cooking, cleaning, changing the oil, fixing the garbage disposal) then what remains that separates Bro-Love from Wife-Love?
    What remains? Sexual attraction. A straight man will never be turned on by another man's physical appearance. A gay man will never be turned on by a woman's. A lesbian woman will never be turned on by a man's. When a gay man is at a club and sees a hot guy dancing, he does not find him attractive because of some perceived gender role. The gender argument, although interesting and well thought out, does not hold up.
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  3. #973
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    Re: Is Homosexuality A Choice?

    New Hope for the Wretched era

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    Re: Is Homosexuality A Choice?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lakryte View Post
    No...because again bisexuals cannot change their orientation either. A bisexual is someone who is attracted to both men and women. They cannot change their orientation to be attracted to only men or only women. They can, however, choose to be in relationships with only men or women--but who you are in a relationship with does not define your orientation.
    In my opinion, there is only 1 orientation: Bisexual. If this use of the word "orientation" is incorrect, then by all means toss it away. It doesn't have to be used to describe this particular human trait. I'm probably not clear here. What I'm saying is that our definition/use of the word orientation may not apply to the how I believe we really are. Instead, the definition might be reinforcing a misconception and vice versa.

    So, with only 1 orientation, heterosexual and homosexual are not orientations at all. The fact that they have been referred to as orientations is only due to the fact that many believe that orientation is distinct and unchangeable.

    "Well, gee. Since have clear evidence of male-male sexual/romantic relationships, then we should assign an orientation label to describe these relationships." --"Assuming that this "orientation" can not be changed."

    But if it can be changed, then it is no longer an orientation.....? perhaps? Perhaps.




    Fair enough. But I see no reason to believe it is a choice, and I see plenty of reason to believe it is not.


    How would that explain the prevalence of homosexuality in the past? I think the modern more equal society we are living in is making it easier for gay people to be honest about being gay--I do not think more people are gay as a percentage of a population now than any other time in history.
    In America or world-wide?


    What remains? Sexual attraction. A straight man will never be turned on by another man's physical appearance. A gay man will never be turned on by a woman's. A lesbian woman will never be turned on by a man's. When a gay man is at a club and sees a hot guy dancing, he does not find him attractive because of some perceived gender role. The gender argument, although interesting and well thought out, does not hold up.
    No. the APA says that orientation relates to emotional, romantic AND/OR sexual relationships. In accordance with that, I'm talking only about emotional (and maybe romantic too) relationships. In my argument, sexual attraction is not and does not have to be part of the relationship to indicate orientation.

  5. #975
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    Re: Is Homosexuality A Choice?

    Quote Originally Posted by USNavySquid View Post
    In my opinion, there is only 1 orientation: Bisexual. If this use of the word "orientation" is incorrect, then by all means toss it away. It doesn't have to be used to describe this particular human trait. I'm probably not clear here. What I'm saying is that our definition/use of the word orientation may not apply to the how I believe we really are. Instead, the definition might be reinforcing a misconception and vice versa.

    So, with only 1 orientation, heterosexual and homosexual are not orientations at all. The fact that they have been referred to as orientations is only due to the fact that many believe that orientation is distinct and unchangeable.

    "Well, gee. Since have clear evidence of male-male sexual/romantic relationships, then we should assign an orientation label to describe these relationships." --"Assuming that this "orientation" can not be changed."

    But if it can be changed, then it is no longer an orientation.....? perhaps? Perhaps.
    If bisexual is the only orientation, then orientation cannot be changed. What you are saying is that you are bisexual. That is great for you. But to say everyone is bisexual because you are is simply not accurate. There are people who are only attracted to the same sex, and people who are only attracted to the opposite sex.

    In America or world-wide?
    World-wide. Homosexuality is not American-made. It is a part of humanity.

    No. the APA says that orientation relates to emotional, romantic AND/OR sexual relationships. In accordance with that, I'm talking only about emotional (and maybe romantic too) relationships. In my argument, sexual attraction is not and does not have to be part of the relationship to indicate orientation.
    The APA also says there exists the orientations of homosexual and heterosexuals, which you deny. So how can you use it as a source? Furthermore, you cannot ignore sexual attraction as if it is not an important aspect of orientation. What you are assuming in your premise is that only emotional attraction exists, and that is not at all what the APA says.
    "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free."
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  6. #976
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    Re: Is Homosexuality A Choice?

    "Is Homosexuality A Choice?"

    Pay very close attention because most of you probably never heard homosexuality explained quite like this!

    Sex is simply the evolved biological function of most complex organisms for the purpose of reproduction_

    This sexual reproduction evolved exclusively around a female's egg being fertilized by the sperm from a male_

    The reproduction process begins with the sexual arousal and union of a male and female of the same species_

    For this to occur the male and female evolved a physical attraction to each other to stimulate sexual arousal_

    But the minds of complex organisms don't always work the way they're suppose to which creates abnormalities_

    Which is why some people are attracted to animals, children or the same sex, rather than the opposite sex_

    Any and all abnormal sexual attractions, including "homosexuality", is the result of a psychological disorder_

    Acting on an abnormal sexual attraction is a "choice" but deciding what we're sexually attracted to is not_

    Which is why child molesters can't be rehabilitated anymore than a homosexual attraction to the same sex can_

    This may not be the most Politically Correct explanation, but it is the reason I checked the No box in the pole!
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    When a crime is rewarded ~ it becomes epidemic:

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  7. #977
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    Re: Is Homosexuality A Choice?

    Quote Originally Posted by Empirica View Post
    [SIZE=3]
    This sexual reproduction evolved exclusively around a female's egg being fertilized by the sperm from a male_

    !
    Most organisms in the world don't need that

  8. #978
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    Re: Is Homosexuality A Choice?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lysander View Post
    Transgender no longer a mental ‘disorder’ in diagnostic manual | WPMT FOX43

    Now they are doing it for transgenderism. The man that pushed for it is jewish.
    And it was based on research and evidence. I understand that these two things have no meaning for you, but that doesn't alter the fact that evidence is on my side of the issue.
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    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  9. #979
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    Re: Is Homosexuality A Choice?

    Quote Originally Posted by Empirica View Post
    "Is Homosexuality A Choice?"

    Pay very close attention because most of you probably never heard homosexuality explained quite like this!

    Sex is simply the evolved biological function of most complex organisms for the purpose of reproduction_

    This sexual reproduction evolved exclusively around a female's egg being fertilized by the sperm from a male_

    The reproduction process begins with the sexual arousal and union of a male and female of the same species_

    For this to occur the male and female evolved a physical attraction to each other to stimulate sexual arousal_

    But the minds of complex organisms don't always work the way they're suppose to which creates abnormalities_

    Which is why some people are attracted to animals, children or the same sex, rather than the opposite sex_

    Any and all abnormal sexual attractions, including "homosexuality", is the result of a psychological disorder_

    Acting on an abnormal sexual attraction is a "choice" but deciding what we're sexually attracted to is not_

    Which is why child molesters can't be rehabilitated anymore than a homosexual attraction to the same sex can_

    This may not be the most Politically Correct explanation, but it is the reason I checked the No box in the pole!
    Here's the problem with your post, Empirica. Homosexuality has been proven to NOT be a psychological disorder.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  10. #980
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    Re: Is Homosexuality A Choice?

    Quote Originally Posted by AngryOldGuy View Post
    This has nothing to do with homosexuality. Therefore, as usual, you are debunked. It is not a defect.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

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