View Poll Results: Should reciprication of permits be mandatory?

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  • Constitutionally, yes

    12 46.15%
  • Constitutionally, no

    7 26.92%
  • Personally, yes

    15 57.69%
  • Personally, no

    3 11.54%
  • Other

    3 11.54%
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Thread: Concealled Carry Permits and state borders

  1. #51
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    Re: Concealled Carry Permits and state borders

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    I disagree. Open carry offers a much better chance for a "bad guy" to preplan either taking you out first or to attempt to take your handgun from you. Just as it is wiser to conceal valuables in a parked vehicle, it is better to not advertise that you are armed. I like the option of either, since with our 100 degree weather my OWB holster may not always be covered well.
    I want the "bad guy" to attack me first. Give others the opportunity run, or call 911, or help me out. Better he attack me then someone with an injury, recent surgery or with children in tow.

    I want the "bad guy" to try to take my gun. Give me clear cause to put a bullet in you, and put a fingerprint or two on my gun to help my legal case, if you have a second. You cannot take my gun off me from behind, even if I stand there and let you, and I won't just stand there and let you. Your wrist will be the first thing I brake.

  2. #52
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    Re: Concealled Carry Permits and state borders

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    1. Open-carry allows for safer holsters. Most concealed-carry holsters are only level-1 retention. Open carry holsters are retention level-2 & 3.
    The need for the added "safety" of the holster is because the gun is in plain sight. One could leave valuables in plain view inside of their vehicle and add expensive security features or simply leave the valuables out of sight as to not temp thieves.

    2. It's easier to draw an openly carried gun.
    First of all, you need a reason to draw, that may become very difficult if you being shot (because the bad guy noticed your gun) is the reason.

    3. Like a poisonous frog with bright skin, I like to let would-be criminals know that attacking me can result in their death. In the service we call openly carried weapons "show of force". When someone attacks me knowing I have a gun, I can safely assume they intend to inflict grave bodily harm. This makes for a cleaner legal case.
    I grant you that criminals are basically a lazy sort and prefer soft targets, so that may make them decide not to make their move if they see any armed resistance. However there are those crimianls that will accept a challange and who are also armed, thus guess who gets shot first to show all others that they mean business?

    4. Some people still freak out when they see a gay couple holding hands. Would you tell gays that they shouldn't express affection in public so that those rare few won't freak out? Don't gays still have a right to be affectionate in public? Do you also support concealing political and religious views; would you have Christians tuck in that cross, or Buddhist monks leave the orange robe at the temple? IMO it's the person freaking out who is in the wrong.
    It is your life, your right and thus your call, you should be able to carry as you see fit- this I can completely agree with.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Concealled Carry Permits and state borders

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    But it says this:

    So wouldn't that indicate that they DO recognize an out of state permit, but only under specific circumstances?
    If they tell everyone "no" then they miss out on all that tax money.

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    Re: Concealled Carry Permits and state borders

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    If they tell everyone "no" then they miss out on all that tax money.
    Is that the real reason, or just your educated guess?

  5. #55
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    Re: Concealled Carry Permits and state borders

    Quote Originally Posted by Lachean View Post
    IMO we shouldn't even need permits to carry and all permits should be "shall-issue" not "may-issue" like Maryland and their stupid "Good and Substantial Reason" to exercise your right.

    But yes, every state that has permits should recognize other states' permits.
    You should have stopped there.

    “Shall issue” permits are still permits. We do not need permits to exercise a basic Constitutional right. Period. There is no valid basis for permits to even exist, nor to discuss whether states should respect other states' permits. All states are required by the Constitution to respect our right to keep and bear arms; and there is no legitimate place for any concept of a “permit” to even enter the discussion. By discussing any details of how such permitting should occur, or what states should be required to recognize other states' permits, only gives credence to the completely-illegitimate notion that states have any authority to openly the Second Amendment.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

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    Re: Concealled Carry Permits and state borders

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    The need for the added "safety" of the holster is because the gun is in plain sight.
    It's actually because the carrier is more likely to be in fist fights than gun fights and doesn't want to be disarmed while wrestling with someone. Also, you cannot conceal carry an M9 or most other full-size handguns.

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    First of all, you need a reason to draw.....
    As a person who has drawn on people, I am intimately aware of this, and uncertain why you feel that's something which needs to be pointed out.

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    I grant you that criminals are basically a lazy sort and prefer soft targets, so that may make them decide not to make their move if they see any armed resistance. However there are those crimianls that will accept a challange and who are also armed, thus guess who gets shot first to show all others that they mean business?
    Well there's my reason to draw right there.

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    It is your life, your right and thus your call, you should be able to carry as you see fit- this I can completely agree with.
    I don't personally agree with SSM, either, but all options should be available and let mother nature's bad ideas be eaten by her good ones.
    Last edited by Jerry; 06-26-13 at 09:00 PM.

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    Re: Concealled Carry Permits and state borders

    My state has a ton of requirements for a concealed carry permit, but we also have a castle doctrine, which I was very surprised at.

    Requirements:

    Required Documents:
    1. Approved training course given by a Massachusetts state certified instructor within the last year

    2. Completed application
    3. Copy of driver’s license or ID card
    4. Copy of birth certificate or passport
    5. You will be required to justify your request in writing. Make your request as detailed and specific as possible. Valid reasons for requesting a concealed handgun include personal threats, being in a high-risk profession or routinely carrying large amounts of cash.
    6. Two passport photographs
    7. 2 Fingerprint cards
    8. Proof of residency ( may be a utility or cable bill)
    9. Report from your home state Bureau of Criminal Records listing your arrest record

    10. To receive a Non-Resident LTC you must already possess a permit from your home state
    or a permit from another state
    11. If you’re a Vermont resident, you must get a letter from the Police Chief in your town attesting to your good character
    Castle Doctrine:

    Section 8A. In the prosecution of a person who is an occupant of a dwelling charged with killing or injuring one who was unlawfully in said dwelling, it shall be a defense that the occupant was in his dwelling at the time of the offense and that he acted in the reasonable belief that the person unlawfully in said dwelling was about to inflict great bodily injury or death upon said occupant or upon another person lawfully in said dwelling, and that said occupant used reasonable means to defend himself or such other person lawfully in said dwelling. There shall be no duty on said occupant to retreat from such person unlawfully in said dwelling.

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    Re: Concealled Carry Permits and state borders

    Quote Originally Posted by molten_dragon View Post
    I do think that someone who has gotten a CCW should be allowed to use it anywhere in the country. But I also see how it's really unfair for people who live in a state that doesn't allow CCW, or makes them very hard to get, that visitors can carry concealed, but residents cannot.

    The better solution would be to simply have national shall-issue CCW laws.
    A better solution (in fact the only legitimate one) is to obey the Second Amendment, and for the federal government and all state or lower governments to just keep their filthy hands off of the people's right to keep and bear arms.

    We all have this right, explicitly affirmed in the Constitution. No government has any legitimate authority to require us to get its permission to exercise this right.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  9. #59
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    Re: Concealled Carry Permits and state borders

    if the constitution had not been raped so many times (especially under the turd FDR) I would say each state has the proper power to determine its own firearms laws

    but its idiotic to prohibit law abiding citizens from carry concealed weapons in any state



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    Re: Concealled Carry Permits and state borders

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    My state has a ton of requirements for a concealed carry permit, but we also have a castle doctrine, which I was very surprised at.
    5. You will be required to justify your request in writing. Make your request as detailed and specific as possible. Valid reasons for requesting a concealed handgun include personal threats, being in a high-risk profession or routinely carrying large amounts of cash.
    :
    The correct answer: "I have the Constitutional Right under Amendment 2 to own and carry a personal firearm without any undue burden placed on me by the State."

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