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Thread: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

  1. #451
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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dooble View Post
    That integrity never left with those who matter. Polluting marriage with homosexuality is not the answer.
    And the integrity of those marriages will not be "polluted" or harmed in any way. Promulgating the fear that same-sex marriage will somehow destroy heterosexual marriage is nonsensical homophobic propaganda.
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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    In theory I have no problem with any group of individuals freely entering into a marriage contract. The problem is that this is an area where abuse could become rife both in terms of defrauding federal and state governments with volumnous plural marriages that are aimed solely at gaining benefits (how would the military deal with BAH and other benefits for example) and on what basis could you deny peoples right to marry once you make it legal? Then of course you have the fact that polygamy is largely the domain of extreme religious communities like the FLDS, Islamic fundamentalists, and even some Sephardi Jewish groups. The history of abuse, pressured marriage, etc is enough to warrant concern about how this process could be regulated.

    Legalizing polygamy is filled with practical problems that marriage between single individuals is not. That doesn't mean it should be banned on its face, but it requires lengthier study of its consequences.

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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    In theory I have no problem with any group of individuals freely entering into a marriage contract. The problem is that this is an area where abuse could become rife both in terms of defrauding federal and state governments with volumnous plural marriages that are aimed solely at gaining benefits (how would the military deal with BAH and other benefits for example) and on what basis could you deny peoples right to marry once you make it legal? Then of course you have the fact that polygamy is largely the domain of extreme religious communities like the FLDS, Islamic fundamentalists, and even some Sephardi Jewish groups. The history of abuse, pressured marriage, etc is enough to warrant concern about how this process could be regulated.

    Legalizing polygamy is filled with practical problems that marriage between single individuals is not. That doesn't mean it should be banned on its face, but it requires lengthier study of its consequences.
    I agree with the part in bold. That might be a problem. As far as the religious fanatics and abuse and such things, what makes a person who is marrying multiple people more apt to abuse than one who just marries one person?

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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    I agree with the part in bold. That might be a problem. As far as the religious fanatics and abuse and such things, what makes a person who is marrying multiple people more apt to abuse than one who just marries one person?
    Sorry I should have been more clear. What I meant is that forbidding plural marriages has been a useful tool in keeping a clamp on these organizations and a pretext for rescuing women and girls forced into these marriages. The tendency towards polygamy is also obviously highest in these groups.

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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    Sorry I should have been more clear. What I meant is that forbidding plural marriages has been a useful tool in keeping a clamp on these organizations and a pretext for rescuing women and girls forced into these marriages. The tendency towards polygamy is also obviously highest in these groups.
    It's what age of consent is supposed to be for. Unfortunately, age of consent is set MUCH too young in many states with parental consent, and sadly some parents will marry off their young daughters, especially the religious fanatic types. That is a problem I also see. There are a few problems with it, but I wonder if those problems could be worked out with some simple measures or precautions. That's why, earlier in this thread, I was saying that marriage licenses ARE important.

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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    its not arguable at all to anybody honest and objective.

    the integrity of marriage is up to the people in a marriage, period.

    my marriage has integrity based on what me and my spouse do and believe about our marriage. Other marriages have ZERO impact on our marriage and cant do anything to its integrity.

    thats way the integrity of marriage is factually in ZERO danger and that strawman argument always fails
    This probably comes down to a semantic/interpretation issue. Since we're talking about marriage in a general sense, then yes right now I have to worry about the integrity of marriage as a whole in this country. Naturally, that still allows for individual marriages to remain intact, and I agree that one's marriage does not affect anyone else's marriage, save by however that other person imagines it to.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    In theory I have no problem with any group of individuals freely entering into a marriage contract. The problem is that this is an area where abuse could become rife both in terms of defrauding federal and state governments with volumnous plural marriages that are aimed solely at gaining benefits (how would the military deal with BAH and other benefits for example) and on what basis could you deny peoples right to marry once you make it legal? Then of course you have the fact that polygamy is largely the domain of extreme religious communities like the FLDS, Islamic fundamentalists, and even some Sephardi Jewish groups. The history of abuse, pressured marriage, etc is enough to warrant concern about how this process could be regulated.

    Legalizing polygamy is filled with practical problems that marriage between single individuals is not. That doesn't mean it should be banned on its face, but it requires lengthier study of its consequences.
    Let me correct this to "...is largely seen through the domain of extreme religious communities..." as there are many of us out here living effectively polygamous marriages, sans the legal recognitions and benefits, without all the problems that the extremist religious groups suffer from.


    Most of the community that I am aware of understands the logistical issues that would need to be dealt with prior to any actual instigation of polygamy. While it was legal at on time in our history, we didn't have all the other legal issues that are now tie

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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    This probably comes down to a semantic/interpretation issue. Since we're talking about marriage in a general sense, then yes right now I have to worry about the integrity of marriage as a whole in this country. Naturally, that still allows for individual marriages to remain intact, and I agree that one's marriage does not affect anyone else's marriage, save by however that other person imagines it to.
    then that would be your problem, the integrity of marriage is factually not in jeopardy on bit
    if you are worried about it thats your issue to deal with but its meaningless to reality.

    Granting equal rights does nothign to the itegrity of marriage.
    if you disagree by all means give me examples that factually put it at risk.
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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    then that would be your problem, the integrity of marriage is factually not in jeopardy on bit
    if you are worried about it thats [sic] your issue to deal with but its meaningless to reality.

    Granting equal rights does nothign [sic] to the itegrity [sic] of marriage.
    if you disagree by all means give me examples that factually put it at risk.
    You're wrong. The integrity of marriage has been in grave jeopardy for a generation or more, starting with the “sexual revolution” of the 1960s. The massively-increased rates of divorce and of bastardy since that time are the direct manifestation of the integrity of marriage having been severely undermined. And this was long before anyone started throwing out the idea of “same sex marriage”, which is the biggest and most blatant attack yet against the integrity of marriage.

    When we have about half of all marriages failing in divorce, and roughly a third to a half of all children being born out of wedlock (with these rates being even worse among certain significant minority groups—up to 60% to 75% illegitimacy among blacks); how blind must one be to think that the integrity of marriage is not in danger, or that society itself is not in danger as a result?
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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    You're wrong. The integrity of marriage has been in grave jeopardy for a generation or more, starting with the “sexual revolution” of the 1960s. The massively-increased rates of divorce and of bastardy since that time are the direct manifestation of the integrity of marriage having been severely undermined. And this was long before anyone started throwing out the idea of “same sex marriage”, which is the biggest and most blatant attack yet against the integrity of marriage.

    When we have about half of all marriages failing in divorce, and roughly a third to a half of all children being born out of wedlock (with these rates being even worse among certain significant minority groups—up to 60% to 75% illegitimacy among blacks); how blind must one be to think that the integrity of marriage is not in danger, or that society itself is not in danger as a result?
    So in your opinion a good benchmark for how stable a society is marriage

    Okay


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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    1.)You're wrong.
    2.) The integrity of marriage has been in grave jeopardy for a generation or more, starting with the “sexual revolution” of the 1960s. The massively-increased rates of divorce and of bastardy since that time are the direct manifestation of the integrity of marriage having been severely undermined.
    3.) And this was long before anyone started throwing out the idea of “same sex marriage”, which is the biggest and most blatant attack yet against the integrity of marriage.
    4.) When we have about half of all marriages failing in divorce
    5.) and roughly a third to a half of all children being born out of wedlock (with these rates being even worse among certain significant minority groups—up to 60% to 75% illegitimacy among blacks);
    6.) how blind must one be to think that the integrity of marriage is not in danger, or that society itself is not in danger as a result?
    1.) nope and as usual you have ZERO facts to back up your claim. You are welcome to have that opinion but thats all it is, an opinion backed up by zero logic and zero facts.
    2.) not factually meaningful to the integrity of marriage
    3.) not factually meaningful to the integrity of marriage
    4.) not factually meaningful to the integrity of marriage
    5.) not factually meaningful to the integrity of marriage
    6.) not blind, just educated enough to know the difference between reality and fantasy and facts and opinion. You have stated zero things that factually harm the integrity or marriage.

    ley me know when you have something that FACTUALLY harms the integrity and not just your meaningless opinion.

    now with that said you are free to have your unsupported opinion but trying to push it as fact will fail and nobody honest and objective will buy it.

    Marriage is in ZERO danger.
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