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Thread: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

  1. #331
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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Why related?
    Do you really have to ask?

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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    I'm wrong on what? That people used to argue that being attracted to one's own gender was considered a sickness? Try again, it was in the DSM at one point as a mental illness. Go back and look at some of the protest against interracial marriage. It was called "sick, "perverted", "against nature" and so much more.
    The bottom line is that being sexually attracted to one's own blood relatives should be a CLUE that you should seek psychiatric help.

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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    No they're not. The arguments are very much different for why the legal restrictions in the laws further a state interest and what state interest is being furthered.

    No rational person would argue that allowing two people of the same sex or of two different races to marry would cause legitimate legal issues or would change legally how marriage/spousal recognition operated. No rational person would try to argue legitimately that same sex restrictions or different race restrictions are in place to protect women and children from abuse that is seen in the most prevalent instances of polygamy. These are the legal reasons being argued for why there are restrictions on how many people are allowed to enter into a marriage/be considered spouses. These do match the legal reasons argued for why either race or sex/gender were/are restrictions on marriage. Race was argued as being about the children and the fact that the children of mixed race couples faced problems due to their mixed race and same sex restrictions are being legally argued as a procreation is the reason for marriage.
    I'm going to disagree with your word selection. Airplane accidents are not the most prevalent form of travel accident, yet they get the most attention. Likewise, the actions of these mormon wanna-bes in Utah and Arizona and such end up the most viewed forms of polygamy. But there are so many of us in the real world who are responsible polygamists (even if they are not legally recognized marriages), practicing polygyny and polyandry or even a combination of both. Tying their actions to the rest of the poly community is like saying that NAMBLA is representative of gay men (which sadly some do). Or we could go in the opposite direction and note how even in monogamous relationships women and children were regularly abused, and still are for that matter. There are still people we haven't reached as for as getting them to understand that such abuse is not acceptable. But such abuse is not an inherent feature of polygamy, any more than it is/was an inherent feature of monogamy. Or boil it all down; correlation is not causation.

    Abuse is abuse and I am in no way trying to down play it. But abuse happens in all kinds of currently accepted domestic arrangements, from living together, to monogamous marriage to divorced to single parent. Polygamous marriages is/would be no different in that aspect, but likewise it is true that all the successful traits would occur as well.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    The argument against interracial marriage was to preserve racial purity and prevent a mongrel breed. Where do you see that argument applied against SSM or polygamy?
    Do note that I said for the most part. Each issues does indeed have some arguments unique to itself. However, when the most common arguments that I hear/heard are "sick", "perverted", "not natural", "mental illness" and so on, and they keep cropping up regardless of issue....you do the math. Interracial is probably about the only true "choice", but still to be able to choose to engage or not engage in interracial marriage, SSM or polygamy are all running on the same basis, the right to form familial and legal bond with whomever one wishes (that is a consenting adult) and all should be equally allowed. It comes down to two key words. Consenting adults. No other qualifiers needed. Now as to whether or not marriage should even be a legal institution is a different argument. What the benefits of a legal marriage should be is also a different argument. But if the legal marriage exists, then it needs to be available to all in whatever combination (keeping in mind the consenting adult part).

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    The bottom line is that being sexually attracted to one's own blood relatives should be a CLUE that you should seek psychiatric help.
    We're not going there so as to not thread jack. I kept up arguments so far because the same arguments you were putting out were the ones also used against interracial marriage, SSM and polygamy and I used them to point out that these are invalid arguments. If they are invalid for one they are invalid for them all and for the same reasons.

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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Do you really have to ask?
    This is a debate site.

    Why related?

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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    Do note that I said for the most part.
    And I note that's not even true.

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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    This is a debate site.

    Why related?
    because unlike gay sex...incest is "icky" .....
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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Incest usually occurs in abusive households where child molestation is occurring, unlike "gay" sex or "interracial" sex. Most cases of incest are between father and daughter, so it's easy to see how a father could "groom" his daughter into marrying him and making it a legal thing if incest were ever to be legal. Incest and being attracted to your family members is a sign of mental illness.

    Gay sex and interracial sex have ALWAYS happened and have not always been socially unacceptable in all cultures. The same cannot be said of incest, which is taboo for a good reason. Anyone who can't understand that should speak to a shrink ASAP.

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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dooble View Post
    Should Plural Marriage be legalized too?
    if polygamist want to fight for a new right to be married id support it 100% as long as it follows the contractual standards.

    sound mind consenting adults

    however this has no legal parallels to equal rights for gays
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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post

    Gay sex and interracial sex have ALWAYS happened and have not always been socially unacceptable in all cultures. The same cannot be said of incest, which is taboo for a good reason. Anyone who can't understand that should speak to a shrink ASAP.
    this is just untrue. there have been many cultures in the past where incest was socially acceptable and even promoted.
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    re: What about the polygamists!?! [W:693]

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    this is just untrue. there have been many cultures in the past where incest was socially acceptable and even promoted.
    BS. Name some with links. I have work, but I'm going to be checking back.

    So basically, you are supportive of incest, is what you're saying?

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