View Poll Results: HOW MANY IRAQIS DIED?

Voters
51. You may not vote on this poll
  • 1,000-5,000

    2 3.92%
  • 5,000-50,000

    2 3.92%
  • 50,000-100,000

    12 23.53%
  • 100,000-1,000,000+

    35 68.63%
Page 30 of 60 FirstFirst ... 20282930313240 ... LastLast
Results 291 to 300 of 599

Thread: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

  1. #291
    Sage
    OldWorldOrder's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Last Seen
    10-12-15 @ 12:13 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    5,820

    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    For this war we are. We were reckless, immoral, and dishonest.

    See the second sentence is the problem. That has no bearing on this discussion. If we were careful, moral, and honest, would we have less responsibility for the death there?

    If no, why mention it at all? It certainly makes it appear as if, to you, the level of responsibility it somehow dependent upon justice. The two are two completely separate concepts.

    If yes, you're being astonishingly clear that you're holding a strange double standard: people are responsible for what they do regardless of how careful, moral, and honest they are. Who would think otherwise, and why?

    But it really doesn't matter, you've already admitted to having a double standard anyway, so it's no use having this discussion with you. We're not able to agree on terms. But it's refreshing that you admitted to it.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

  2. #292
    Sage
    Boo Radley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Last Seen
    11-22-17 @ 04:22 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    36,858

    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    See the second sentence is the problem. That has no bearing on this discussion. If we were careful, moral, and honest, would we have less responsibility for the death there?

    If no, why mention it at all? It certainly makes it appear as if, to you, the level of responsibility it somehow dependent upon justice. The two are two completely separate concepts.

    If yes, you're being astonishingly clear that you're holding a strange double standard: people are responsible for what they do regardless of how careful, moral, and honest they are. Who would think otherwise, and why?

    But it really doesn't matter, you've already admitted to having a double standard anyway, so it's no use having this discussion with you. We're not able to agree on terms. But it's refreshing that you admitted to it.
    It has every bearing. Had we not been reckless, we would have put people in the position we. Responsible people are thoughtful and cautious. Had we been moral, we would not have invaded on a pretext, been the aggressor, and thus brought war and harm to a people. And if we had leaders who were honest, we wouldn't have present the deceptions that feed the fever here at hope, gathering support for a war without real justification. Our leaders doing these things makes them responsible. If we were cautious, moral, and honest, we wouldn't have invaded in the first place.

    We and we alone brought he war there. We destabilize. We ignored what was certain to happen. They were plenty if warnings, but we chose war. I'm sorry, but we are responsible for the results of our actions.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  3. #293
    Sage
    OldWorldOrder's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Last Seen
    10-12-15 @ 12:13 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    5,820

    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    No, I don't think you understood what I was saying. But it's very interesting that you think people are less responsible for their actions if they're careful, moral, and honest (or maybe just if you agree with what they're doing?).

    That's very odd, and while it's certainly understandable, it's not very logical. Fascinating that you're so open about different standards. I kinda took it as a article of faith that most people at least aspire to maintain consistency.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

  4. #294
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:08 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,512

    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by RDS View Post
    I have the same problem.
    I thought it was just me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  5. #295
    Sage
    Boo Radley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Last Seen
    11-22-17 @ 04:22 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    36,858

    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    No, I don't think you understood what I was saying. But it's very interesting that you think people are less responsible for their actions if they're careful, moral, and honest (or maybe just if you agree with what they're doing?).

    That's very odd, and while it's certainly understandable, it's not very logical. Fascinating that you're so open about different standards. I kinda took it as a article of faith that most people at least aspire to maintain consistency.
    What your saying has nothing to do with my argument. I made such claim. You're trying to dance around the argument made. The act is what makes them responsible. They brought needless war. Being reckless adds to responsibility. We have a different standard for an accident where everyone was doing what hey should than we do for those who were reckless. This is not a double standard, but proper judgement. We hold those who act immorally to greater disdain than those who behave morally, as we o the honest over the dishonest. Again, proper judgement. The act, reckless, immoral, and dishonest, is what makes us responsible.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  6. #296
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:08 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,512

    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    I think in their body count they choose to add in all the dead caused by the Islomo-extremists that continue to kill people. The rationale of course being that if Bush hadnt gone to war they wouldnt be killing Iraqis. And OK...you can even cede that point, but then you would HAVE to go to door number two which says yes...but if Bush hadnt gone to war with Iraq Saddam Hussein would still be in power and his own personal record of genocide is rather impressive as well. Better to just stick with the talking points about the eeeeevil George Bush killing Iraqis and be done with it.
    Saddam only killed 300,000 and that's OK.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  7. #297
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:08 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,512

    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    How so? Our Corporations are profiting by drilling, processing, transporting, refining, and retailing the Iraqi OIL. The Iraqis are getting paid as guilt money so it doesn't look like we are stealing their OIL.
    The Iraqis are getting paid, because it's their oil.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  8. #298
    Sage
    apdst's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Bagdad, La.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:08 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    76,512

    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    It has every bearing. Had we not been reckless, we would have put people in the position we. Responsible people are thoughtful and cautious. Had we been moral, we would not have invaded on a pretext, been the aggressor, and thus brought war and harm to a people. And if we had leaders who were honest, we wouldn't have present the deceptions that feed the fever here at hope, gathering support for a war without real justification. Our leaders doing these things makes them responsible. If we were cautious, moral, and honest, we wouldn't have invaded in the first place.

    We and we alone brought he war there. We destabilize. We ignored what was certain to happen. They were plenty if warnings, but we chose war. I'm sorry, but we are responsible for the results of our actions.
    A lot fewer people would have died, had we not invaded Germany during The Second World War, too. Was FDR a war criminal? Oh...wait...he was a Libbo...of course he wasn't.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  9. #299
    Sage
    OldWorldOrder's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Last Seen
    10-12-15 @ 12:13 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    5,820

    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    What your saying has nothing to do with my argument. I made such claim. You're trying to dance around the argument made.
    Uhhh...why would I want to do that? You seem very defensive.

    The act is what makes them responsible.
    Yeah. When I said that about insurgents in Iraq being responsible for the people they killed, you just said it was the responsibility of Americans. This would be an opportunity to correct that.

    They brought needless war. Being reckless adds to responsibility.
    Yeah...no, I don't think that has any basis in logic whatsoever.

    We have a different standard for an accident where everyone was doing what hey should than we do for those who were reckless.
    So if the US accidentally went to war....?

    This is not a double standard, but proper judgement.
    Ahh. Your subjective judgment is proper. One of those guys, I see.

    We hold those who act immorally to greater disdain than those who behave morally, as we o the honest over the dishonest. Again, proper judgement. The act, reckless, immoral, and dishonest, is what makes us responsible.
    Right, so inconsistency.

    Do you think there's any chance that you're quicker to ascribe responsibility for all things negative in Iraq on the US because you disagreed with the war? Any chance at all?

    I mean, as we have this conversation, you're having a very difficult time separating those two concepts (responsibility as an idea and the Iraq war) . I wouldn't be surprised at all if in your next post you say you can't separate them because they're part of the same issue. But we were talking about people/organizations being responsible for the acts they do in a general sense, and had gotten away from the specifics. The topic of people/organizations being responsible for the acts they do is something that can be discussed without mentioning Iraq, the US, or even the idea of war at all, you know.

    You seem to have extremely strong feelings for this, and I'm gonna have to suggest that maybe your feelings tint your analysis here. Much like Iraqis I've talked to that blamed everything on Saddam; they hated Saddam, so they found ways to justify in their minds that anything bad ultimately came back on him, and was his responsibility. The similarity is striking.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

  10. #300
    Si vis pacem, para bellum
    Μολὼν λαβέ's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Last Seen
    09-29-17 @ 11:22 PM
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    6,914

    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    A lot fewer people would have died, had we not invaded Germany during The Second World War, too. Was FDR a war criminal? Oh...wait...he was a Libbo...of course he wasn't.
    How many died in LBJ's (Democrat) Vietnam?

    More than 1 million Vietnamese and more than 58,000 Americans.

    No wonder he didn't run for reelection. Washed his hands, sealed his fate.
    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Generalizations are stupid.
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Steel View Post
    The Second Amendment has nothing to do with guns.

Page 30 of 60 FirstFirst ... 20282930313240 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •