View Poll Results: HOW MANY IRAQIS DIED?

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  • 1,000-5,000

    2 3.92%
  • 5,000-50,000

    2 3.92%
  • 50,000-100,000

    12 23.53%
  • 100,000-1,000,000+

    35 68.63%
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Thread: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

  1. #121
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    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    I agree that it was a consideration perhaps, but not the main reason for starting war IMO.
    I don't think it was a reason for the war. It was a reason why Iraq was at the top of the priority list, though other things were obviously far more important factors.

  2. #122
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    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    I don't think it was a reason for the war. It was a reason why Iraq was at the top of the priority list, though other things were obviously far more important factors.
    Such as the fact that he couldn't be trusted, that he was always making threats and was a thorn in our sides, he threatened the world with WMD, always starting trouble with neighboring countries and killing his own people, for starters.

  3. #123
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    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Such as the fact that he couldn't be trusted, that he was always making threats and was a thorn in our sides, he threatened the world with WMD, always starting trouble with neighboring countries and killing his own people, for starters.
    I'd put the major factors as such:

    1. Genocide, twice
    2. Violation of 17 Ch7 unscrs
    3. Invaded neighbors, twice
    4. Fake WMD program
    5. Institutionalized rape
    6. Oil to provide for development
    7. Geographic position

    While 6 and 7 are not reasons to go to war, they are important factors.

  4. #124
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    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    I'd put the major factors as such:

    1. Genocide, twice
    2. Violation of 17 Ch7 unscrs
    3. Invaded neighbors, twice
    4. Fake WMD program
    5. Institutionalized rape
    6. Oil to provide for development
    7. Geographic position

    While 6 and 7 are not reasons to go to war, they are important factors.
    Are you referring to the Oil for Food program in #6?

  5. #125
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    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Are you referring to the Oil for Food program in #6?
    No, I should include that (his selling of the food). It would be about #6. The original #6 refers to the country having resources to pay for its own development to a large extent.

  6. #126
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    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    No, I should include that (his selling of the food). It would be about #6. The original #6 refers to the country having resources to pay for its own development to a large extent.
    Yes, I think that should be included. Allowing his own people to starve to line his own pockets should count too.

    The UN Security Council started the Oil-for-Food program in 1996 to allow Iraq to sell enough oil to pay for food and other necessities for its population, which was suffering under strict UN sanctions imposed after the first Gulf War. But Saddam Hussein exploited the program, earning some $1.7 billion through kickbacks and surcharges, and $10.9 billion through illegal oil smuggling, according to a 2004 Central Intelligence Agency investigation. Wide-scale mismanagement and unethical conduct on the part of some UN employees also plagued the program, according to the UN Independent Inquiry Committee.

  7. #127
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    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    I don't think it was a reason for the war. It was a reason why Iraq was at the top of the priority list, though other things were obviously far more important factors.
    Actually, I think they were that high on the priority list because we already had forces engaged there. In particular, the Air Force had several "Low Density, High Utilization" "Combat multiplier" units constantly tied up there since the end of the Gulf War. Iraq was on the list and it would make no sense to remove those units only to bring them back again later while also allowing Saddam free reign to do as he pleased. These systems could not be removed until the Iraq issue was settled, one way or the other.

    Bush gave him a choice, comply or we end you. Since Neither G.H.Bush or Clinton had actually taken steps to end it, So-damned-insane didn't have a reason to believe we would do anything to him at all except maybe bomb a couple of facilities and then things would return to the way they were. G.H. Bush and Clinton bombed him several times, ostensibly over him playing games and kicking out the inspectors who were their to ascertain the status of his chemical weapons programs. However, he eventually kicked them out without Clinton responding (for various reasons). G.W. Bush gave the ultimatum, let them in, let them do their jobs or we end it our way. Saddam made his choice, Bush needed those assets elsewhere and didn't follow the familiar pattern.

    Those assets were there to enforce the Northern and Southern No Fly zones that were established because Saddam liked to go bomb civilians and the UN didn't believe he should be allowed to. Not to mention the fact that the UN also didn't like the fact that he had gassed an unarmed village inside his own country. Saddam didn't like this and would occasionally target and even shoot at forces there to enforce the No-Fly zones. I was a crewmember on one of those assets, hence why I said he would sometimes shoot at me. (There were also zones where his movement of ground troops was also restricted)

    So while oil might have played a role, the simple fact is that we could get far more oil from Iran if that was our goal. We needed to free up assets in order to continue the War on Terror. Unfortunately, while we did indeed free up those assets, we tied up too many of our other assets, so we ground to a halt.
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  8. #128
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    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    You should care because it was a "war of choice" not a defense against a threat or attack. The dead are still dead and We, the USA people are the fingers on the triggers. We took the war to Iraq and Iraq presented no threat, although it does have lots of feedstock for those Tejas refineries. OIL, me bucko, Black Gold and that's a damn good reason to attack and wipeout those slimy, no-good, usin' up my oxygen Iraqis. War is good bidness, and bidness is good, eh? I'm speakin' Texican there.
    Perhaps you should take off your "I hate Bush" glasses and take a closer look at the history leading up to the events. You might also take a closer look at the history of how much oil we actually get from Iraq and the middle east.
    Only a fool measures equality by results and not opportunities.

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    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    The main reason was to try to squelch extremism in the Arab world by creating a model where there was a dictator that everyone could agree needed to go. The strategy was fine, the tactics were horrible. Rumsfeld screwed the pooch by ignoring Shinseki.

    Oil was way, way down the list.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

  10. #130
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    re: How Many Iraqis Died in the Iraq War?[W:496]

    Quote Originally Posted by DVSentinel View Post
    Perhaps you should take off your "I hate Bush" glasses
    Some people are wearin' those badboys like a Member's Only jacket.

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