View Poll Results: Should the school have banned the reading of the prayer by the student?

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  • Yes

    30 27.27%
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    75 68.18%
  • Undecided

    5 4.55%
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Thread: Valedictorian Defies School District and Recites Lord's Prayer [W:618]

  1. #1111
    Educator AreteCourage's Avatar
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    Re: Valedictorian Defies School District and Recites Lord's Prayer [W:618]

    Of course the school had the right to ban it. It is a religious text spoken at a public event on the tax payer dime.

    If they would have given a disclaimer on the commencement pamphlets claiming that the student's speeches are their own and don't represent the views of the school than it would have been fine.

    You have to be clear when you are in the public sector. No religion should be valued over any other idea when in the public forum (paid by taxpayers).

    It's not just this certain piece of scripture, but any words in any religious text that are not allowed. For good reason too.
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    Re: Valedictorian Defies School District and Recites Lord's Prayer [W:618]

    Quote Originally Posted by AreteCourage View Post
    Of course the school had the right to ban it. It is a religious text spoken at a public event on the tax payer dime.

    If they would have given a disclaimer on the commencement pamphlets claiming that the student's speeches are their own and don't represent the views of the school than it would have been fine.

    You have to be clear when you are in the public sector. No religion should be valued over any other idea when in the public forum (paid by taxpayers).

    It's not just this certain piece of scripture, but any words in any religious text that are not allowed. For good reason too.
    Nice try, but that doesn't hold water. Presidents, Congress, Courts, they all use religious texts on tax payers dimes every day.
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    Re: Valedictorian Defies School District and Recites Lord's Prayer [W:618]

    Quote Originally Posted by davidtaylorjr View Post
    Nice try, but that doesn't hold water. Presidents, Congress, Courts, they all use religious texts on tax payers dimes every day.
    Doesn't make it correct now does it?

    Just because they use it doesn't mean it is right. It is wrong for anyone to use a public funded forum and preach or recite any religious text.

    Freedom of religion and freedom FROM religion.
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    Re: Valedictorian Defies School District and Recites Lord's Prayer [W:618]

    Quote Originally Posted by AreteCourage View Post
    Doesn't make it correct now does it?

    Just because they use it doesn't mean it is right. It is wrong for anyone to use a public funded forum and preach or recite any religious text.

    Freedom of religion and freedom FROM religion.
    The Constitution doesn't say that though. The Constitution says Congress shall make no law regarding the establishment of a religion. Using the text in a speech is not equal with making a law.
    Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same.

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    Re: Valedictorian Defies School District and Recites Lord's Prayer [W:618]

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoist View Post
    Are you saying a teacher should have no control over his/her own classroom (including verbal content)?
    This speach didn't occure in a classroom.

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    Re: Valedictorian Defies School District and Recites Lord's Prayer [W:618]

    Quote Originally Posted by ChezC3 View Post
    Not in the slightest. You're trying to send this down the argumentum ad absurdum route.
    On the contrary, the notion that a school having some control over school functions is anti-first amendment is absurd. It is no different than a teacher having control over his/her classroom.

    I find it disturbing though, considering the level of comportment students show -- which was traditionally a part of their education -- has sunk to unspeakable lows, that the thought of a student praying is what is found to be so offensive, that we find this, this to be a vital topic of contention...
    Who said I was offended by what he said? (btw, I am a Christian myself and have recited the Lord's Prayer on numerous occasions.)
    "Men did not make the earth ... it is the value of the improvement only, and not the earth itself, that is individual property... Every proprietor owes to the community a ground rent for the land which he holds." -- Thomas Paine, Agrarian Justice
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    Re: Valedictorian Defies School District and Recites Lord's Prayer [W:618]

    Quote Originally Posted by davidtaylorjr View Post
    How is a prayer that has no malicious speech offensive? I too don't understand. People are just too sensitive I guess and can't accept the fact that other people have opinions that should be allowed to be given as well. It is just nonsense.
    Please point to me where I said I was offended by the speech.
    "Men did not make the earth ... it is the value of the improvement only, and not the earth itself, that is individual property... Every proprietor owes to the community a ground rent for the land which he holds." -- Thomas Paine, Agrarian Justice
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    Re: Valedictorian Defies School District and Recites Lord's Prayer [W:618]

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoist View Post
    Please point to me where I said I was offended by the speech.
    I wasn't addressing you so I'm not sure why you are asking me this.
    Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same.

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    Re: Valedictorian Defies School District and Recites Lord's Prayer [W:618]

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoist View Post
    Please point to me where I said I was offended by the speech.
    You weren't the one who said the Lord's Prayer means racism?

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    Re: Valedictorian Defies School District and Recites Lord's Prayer [W:618]

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    This speach didn't occure in a classroom.
    So what? It still happened at school. A teacher has control over content in the classroom just as administration has control over school functions. Is the connection that hard to follow?
    "Men did not make the earth ... it is the value of the improvement only, and not the earth itself, that is individual property... Every proprietor owes to the community a ground rent for the land which he holds." -- Thomas Paine, Agrarian Justice
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