View Poll Results: Is Bradley Manning a Whistleblower or Traitor?

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  • Traitor

    7 35.00%
  • Hero

    9 45.00%
  • Whistleblower

    9 45.00%
  • Manning deserves a medal.

    8 40.00%
  • Military classification is for cover ups.

    4 20.00%
  • Time to try the military.

    3 15.00%
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Thread: Bradley Manning: Patriotic Whistleblower or Traitor? [W:64]

  1. #51
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    Re: Bradley Manning: Patriotic Whistleblower or Traitor?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dapper Andy View Post
    No but at 250,000+ documents I have a very difficult time believing he read just one word from each.
    Granted, which is a big reason why I am not going to pass judgment that his intentions were completely righteous. But I still think what he did pales in comparison to the crimes that many of those documents mention.
    "Men did not make the earth ... it is the value of the improvement only, and not the earth itself, that is individual property... Every proprietor owes to the community a ground rent for the land which he holds." -- Thomas Paine, Agrarian Justice
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  2. #52
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    Re: Bradley Manning: Patriotic Whistleblower or Traitor?

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoist View Post
    Granted, which is a big reason why I am not going to pass judgment that his intentions were completely righteous. But I still think what he did pales in comparison to the crimes that many of those documents mention.
    But it's not like he committed his crime to expose other crimes.

  3. #53
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    Re: Bradley Manning: Patriotic Whistleblower or Traitor?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    It is kinda nice to know that the law of the land is something he considers worth following isn't it?
    Certainly is. Where is the outrage over the murders of hundreds/thousands of Afghans/Iraqis who were murdered by the US military?

    I think we would also agree that soldiers guilty of murdering any one and found guilty of such in court should likewise be punished to the full extent of the law.
    If a member of the military has evidence of a criminal act, they can safely take action as outlined here: 10 USC 1034 - Protected communications; prohibition of retaliatory personnel actions | Title 10 - Armed Forces | U.S. Code | LII / Legal Information Institute . They are protected then from reprisals. Note that what Manning did is completely different. Mass release of confidential documents, or even the release of any confidential document to the media is not protected and is a criminal act. There is good reason for this.
    I am not denying that Manning went about this the wrong way, or that his intentions were totally noble. I think there are actions that should be taken but I do not go as far as to call him a traitor or think he should be executed/imprisoned for life. But that is besides the point. We get more outraged over a man releasing document detailing crimes than the actual crimes (murders) themselves. Do you not see how messed up that is?
    "Men did not make the earth ... it is the value of the improvement only, and not the earth itself, that is individual property... Every proprietor owes to the community a ground rent for the land which he holds." -- Thomas Paine, Agrarian Justice
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  4. #54
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    Re: Bradley Manning: Patriotic Whistleblower or Traitor?

    Quote Originally Posted by APACHERAT View Post
    Did I hurt your feelings ?
    Be a man.
    Seems like you are more offended by how people choose to live their own lives than anyone could be of your comments. Perhaps you should take your own advice.
    "Men did not make the earth ... it is the value of the improvement only, and not the earth itself, that is individual property... Every proprietor owes to the community a ground rent for the land which he holds." -- Thomas Paine, Agrarian Justice
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    Re: Bradley Manning: Patriotic Whistleblower or Traitor?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dapper Andy View Post
    But it's not like he committed his crime to expose other crimes.
    I don't know his intentions. Maybe. Maybe not. I just think it is outrageous people get more passionately angry over Manning's crime over the military's crimes.
    "Men did not make the earth ... it is the value of the improvement only, and not the earth itself, that is individual property... Every proprietor owes to the community a ground rent for the land which he holds." -- Thomas Paine, Agrarian Justice
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  6. #56
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    Re: Bradley Manning: Patriotic Whistleblower or Traitor?

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoist View Post
    I don't know his intentions. Maybe. Maybe not. I just think it is outrageous people get more passionately angry over Manning's crime over the military's crimes.
    I get the impression this is more about you being anti-military than anything else.

  7. #57
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    Re: Bradley Manning: Patriotic Whistleblower or Traitor?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dapper Andy View Post
    I get the impression this is more about you being anti-military than anything else.
    I am anti-murder. I don't care who does it.
    "Men did not make the earth ... it is the value of the improvement only, and not the earth itself, that is individual property... Every proprietor owes to the community a ground rent for the land which he holds." -- Thomas Paine, Agrarian Justice
    http://www.wealthandwant.com/

  8. #58
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    Re: Bradley Manning: Patriotic Whistleblower or Traitor?

    Quote Originally Posted by HumanBeing View Post
    I'd like to stay largely out of this conversation, but fwiw I think the Collateral Murder video was very important, I'm glad people got to see it, and I think those involved in decrypting it (which manning isn't even alleged to have done) should be damn proud of themselves.

    Collateral Murder - Wikileaks - Iraq - YouTube
    I watched the entire video. What is it that the Americans are alleged to have done wrong? It looked good to me.

    I've never heard of friendly journalists being embedded with enemy troops before. Did the enemy think that hiding among journalists and children would protect them or is the truth that those journalists are NOT friendly to us, regardless of what they would have us believe?

    The American soldiers seemed to disregard their own safety to carry those children as fast as they could, as opposed to the enemy who brought children right into the danger zone.

    Our guys did a good job. I just wish they were home with us. Nobody loves children more than Americans.
    Last edited by Ray410; 06-07-13 at 03:50 PM.

  9. #59
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    Re: Bradley Manning: Patriotic Whistleblower or Traitor?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ray410 View Post
    I watched the entire video. What is it that the Americans are alleged to have done wrong? It looked good to me.
    The main issue was that they lied about it after, specifically they lied to Reuters about how the journalists died. The official report from Lieutenant Colonel Scott Bleichwehl on the incident stated "There is no question that coalition forces were clearly engaged in combat operations against a hostile force". It simply isn't true. They were begging for permission to open fire on people who were standing around chatting, and a car with kids and a doctor.

    Anyway, I'm going to stay out of this. I appreciate that everyone is entitled to their own opinion on it, and simply wanted to express mine.
    If you hate capitalism so much, then just write everything in lower case. Problem solved.

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    Re: Bradley Manning: Patriotic Whistleblower or Traitor?

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoist View Post
    Seems like you are more offended by how people choose to live their own lives than anyone could be of your comments. Perhaps you should take your own advice.
    I can care less how people choose to live their own lives as long as they don't force their life style upon me or force me to openly acknowledge my approval of their life style. That's been the problem that many have.

    You don't see me demanding special protections or special privileges or demanding that society except my life style do you ?

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