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Institutional Racism [W:344]

Does institutional racism currently exist in America?


  • Total voters
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in essence...the employer is forced to reach out and put plans in place to increase the pool of qualified minority applicants in order to hire them on a non-discriminatory basis. ;)

nope wrong again as the link proves

in "essence" the employer is already supposed to be reaching out and making plans to be as diverse as possible with qualified people PERIOD.

it may be white, old, young, black, people with disabilities etc.

Minority is NOT the only requirement and focusing on it is what makes all these arguments fail.

its to hire ALL PEOPLE on a non-discriminatory practice.
 
nope wrong again as the link proves

in "essence" the employer is already supposed to be reaching out and making plans to be as diverse as possible with qualified people PERIOD.

it may be white, old, young, black, people with disabilities etc.

Minority is NOT the only requirement and focusing on it is what makes all these arguments fail.

its to hire ALL PEOPLE on a non-discriminatory practice.

bull....read your own link. it clearly specifies reaching out to minorities and females if the pool of qualified workers is not sufficiently representative
 
bull....read your own link. it clearly specifies reaching out to minorities and females if the pool of qualified workers is not sufficiently representative

and whites, and age and those with disabilities etc etc etc you

ive read and am required to know it for work

and the order you brought up still refers to government jobs not private/public

facts simply disagree with you and prove you wrong, you fail again
 
1.) nope didnt ignore it at all, making stuff up wont help your case LMAO
2.) no you simply misunderstand it and again you are factually wrong


sorry also the particular order you brought up is the one i deal with directly because its baout GOVERNMENT and GOVERNMENT contractors. Thats exactly what i do.

a company would be in violation or under go review if they local population was 50% black and 50 white, 20% WOMEN (NOT JUST MINORITIES) and the most important part they were all QUALIFIED if it could be proven my company didnt INTERVIEW or REACH OUT TO about those same amounts.

But if i did interview them matching about those same amounts and no wrong doings could be proven with my hiring process its would be fine, there are factually no quotas or force to make the workforce match.

Sorry again facts disagree with you

http://www.dol.gov/ofccp/regs/compliance/aa.htm
Do you not see the writing between the lines?

If the employer does not have a representative workforce, they must spend extra money to try to achieve that goal. It becomes an unwritten quota system, because it is easier to just use quotas.
 
Do you not see the writing between the lines?

If the employer does not have a representative workforce, they must spend extra money to try to achieve that goal. It becomes an unwritten quota system, because it is easier to just use quotas.

No i dont see the made up conspiracy theory because its factually not true.

Like i said i have to directly deal with this stuff at work, there is no quotas and our workforce demographics definitely do not match the local demographics. Neither do the demographics at our HQ.
My company does government contracting so we are under more scrutiny then anybody and nothing ever happens to us.

WHy? because we practice AA/EO. We have been audited, our HQ was even investigated because someone ATTEMPTED to say we werent practicing AA/EO. We won, they lost because we do practice it.

SOrry i simply cant ignore facts and use fantasy and conspiracy theories.

ANy company using qoutas are morons because thats no easier and one they decided to use qoutas they are breaking the law and not practicing AA/EO.
 
No i dont see the made up conspiracy theory because its factually not true.

Like i said i have to directly deal with this stuff at work, there is no quotas and our workforce demographics definitely do not match the local demographics. Neither do the demographics at our HQ.
My company does government contracting so we are under more scrutiny then anybody and nothing ever happens to us.

WHy? because we practice AA/EO. We have been audited, our HQ was even investigated because someone ATTEMPTED to say we werent practicing AA/EO. We won, they lost because we do practice it.

SOrry i simply cant ignore facts and use fantasy and conspiracy theories.

ANy company using qoutas are morons because thats no easier and one they decided to use qoutas they are breaking the law and not practicing AA/EO.

There is obviously something about this issue which is very personal to you, which is creating a debilitatingly blind, biased perspective.
 
There is obviously something about this issue which is very personal to you, which is creating a debilitatingly blind, biased perspective.

he's a minority. of course he doesn't see anything wrong with a policy that gives minorities an advantage. so he will defend/deny to his last breath that such a policy exists. Hell...I wouldn't complain about a policy that forced the NFL and NBA to hire old white guys and pay them millions of $$$$ ;)
 
Mostly no. It's typically cultural discrimination which has its place to a degree.
 
he's a minority. of course he doesn't see anything wrong with a policy that gives minorities an advantage. so he will defend/deny to his last breath that such a policy exists. Hell...I wouldn't complain about a policy that forced the NFL and NBA to hire old white guys and pay them millions of $$$$ ;)

I knew that was the case :shrug:

I saw a segment on ESPN the other day in which the MLB has a guy who monitors the amount of black players in the sport. I don't remember his exact title, but it was something with the word 'Diversity' in it. He was going on about how there aren't enough blacks playing baseball. They then showed the stats for how many blacks play in the NBA (79%) and the NFL (74%). Needless to say, neither of those organizations has hired anyone to monitor the amount of whites in the sport :roll:
 
There is obviously something about this issue which is very personal to you, which is creating a debilitatingly blind, biased perspective.

nope

just a secondary part of my job and i cant ignore facts based on fantasy, hyperbole and opinion.

Are there facts you would like to bring to the table that support your failed arguments?

Facts:
qoutas are illegal
government does not force your workforce demographics to match the population
any company using qoutas is not practicing AA/EO

please feel free to prove any of this wrong
 
he's a minority. of course he doesn't see anything wrong with a policy that gives minorities an advantage. so he will defend/deny to his last breath that such a policy exists. Hell...I wouldn't complain about a policy that forced the NFL and NBA to hire old white guys and pay them millions of $$$$ ;)

wrong, im just going withthe fact and you are going with conspiracy theories.

can you explain why facts and the definition of AA/EO disagree with your failed opinions?
can you explain why my company has not qoutas and why they demographics of are work force doesnt match and we arent forced to match it
can you expalin that even when or HQ was investigated because somebody CLAIMED discrimination that they failed and it didnt even make it to court even thoguh the demographics at HQ are WAY off drom the demographics of the population (large lation population near HQ)

thats right you cant because facts support my posts and you have resorted to lying and making stuff up
 
I knew that was the case :shrug:

I saw a segment on ESPN the other day in which the MLB has a guy who monitors the amount of black players in the sport. I don't remember his exact title, but it was something with the word 'Diversity' in it. He was going on about how there aren't enough blacks playing baseball. They then showed the stats for how many blacks play in the NBA (79%) and the NFL (74%). Needless to say, neither of those organizations has hired anyone to monitor the amount of whites in the sport :roll:


and that makes you wrong again
 
self segration is verry rampet not institutional racism
 
so what about the executive order that mandates employers implement plans to increase the number of minority employee if their workforce is not "representative" of the population?any way you slice it, that's a freakin quota. if blacks make up 13% of the population...you must have 13% black employees or implement a plan to hire more blacks. if females make up 51% of the population...you must have 51% female employees or implement a plan to hire more females.

Depends on the plans. If it's a quota, it's a quota, and that's probably not good (illegal according to AGentJ). If it's a plan to broaden the candidate search to include areas that you were not including before, but that have high percentage minority, for example, and you still only selected the best qualified candidates, this would not be a quota, but might meet the criteria of a plan that will end up increasing the number of minority employees.

Although we use race, IMO it's really culture. No one thinks negatively if Morgan Freeman applies for a job, he's not judged on race. If an ex-gang-baner who is trying to turn his life around, has tats and different accent and mannerisms than the company interviewing him, they may not feel culturally comfortable with him, and reject him. Which to a degree is fine. What it's about understanding that we all have bias, especially cultural bias, and we should at least make some effort to understand that if we are in a position of authority. Not being aware of this is worse than being aware. Compensating some for this is better than no compensation whatsoever (not pay, compensate like make changes). It will never emotionally feel right for most people, that's the entire point. It should be pushed for to *some reasonable* degree though by employers IMO.

If you hire people regularly, you understand that there is no perfect objective standard by which to hire from. Much of it is the feeling you get from the individual, because they typically had to meet the objective resume criteria just to get to the in-person interview...GPA, what school, which classes, work experience, these are fairly objective. But if they meet those, and in the in-person don't seem to be a good team-firt, you may think well, there are others better qualified that are a good team fit. OK, that's understandable, but was the primary determinant their cultural difference that made them not a good fit? If so, you may want to scrutinize that choice a little more.

I have had good results using that personally, I have made some hires that I was to a degree uncomfortable with on culture grounds, along with others in the workplace, and sure we put a little extra effort into making it work. In these particular cases, the individuals ended up being top performers, top 5%, cornerstones of the company. Still different culturally but I think we're all better for it.
 
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nope
please feel free to prove any of this wrong

b1d.jpg
 
Depends on the plans. If it's a quota, it's a quota, and that's probably not good (illegal according to AGentJ). If it's a plan to broaden the candidate search to include areas that you were not including before, but that have high percentage minority, for example, and you still only selected the best qualified candidates, this would not be a quota, but might meet the criteria of a plan that will end up increasing the number of minority employees.

Although we use race, IMO it's really culture. No one thinks negatively if Morgan Freeman applies for a job, he's not judged on race. If an ex-gang-banker who is trying to turn his life around, has tats and different accent and mannerisms than the company interviewing him, they may not feel culturally comfortable with him, and reject him. Which to a degree is fine. What it's about understanding that we all have bias, especially cultural bias, and we should at least make some effort to understand that if we are in a position of authority. Not being aware of this is worse than being aware. Compensating some for this is better than no compensation whatsoever (not pay, compensate like make changes). It will never emotionally feel right for most people, that's the entire point. It should be pushed for to *some reasonable* degree though by employers IMO.

If you hire people regularly, you understand that there is no perfect objective standard by which to hire from. Much of it is the feeling you get from the individual, because they typically had to meet the objective resume criteria just to get to the in-person interview...GPA, what school, which classes, work experience, these are fairly objective. But if they meet them and they seem to not be a good team-first, you may think well, there are others better qualified that are a good team fit. OK, that's understandable, but was the primary determinant their cultural difference that made them not a good fit? If so, you may want to scrutinize that choice a little more.


reasonable post
but its illegal according to the law, not me ;)

and orgs when caught having a quota have faced fines and criminal action :shrug:
 
wrong, im just going withthe fact and you are going with conspiracy theories.

wrong, you are just going with your own biased opinion.

can you explain why facts and the definition of AA/EO disagree with your failed opinions?

I linked and quoted the exact verbage from the Exec Order that supports my opinion

can you explain why my company has not qoutas and why they demographics of are work force doesnt match and we arent forced to match it

no, I cannot explain any claim you have made without any proof to back it up. you could claim your company sold rainbow striped unicorns.

can you expalin that even when or HQ was investigated because somebody CLAIMED discrimination that they failed and it didnt even make it to court even thoguh the demographics at HQ are WAY off drom the demographics of the population (large lation population near HQ)

again..I can't explain any unsupported claims you make

thats right you cant because facts support my posts and you have resorted to lying and making stuff up

except for the pesky little detail of you not providing any "facts" to support your posts. simply claiming "my company does XYZ" is not a fact. for all the "proof" you've provided...you could be the one "making stuff up"
 
1.)wrong, you are just going with your own biased opinion.
2.)I linked and quoted the exact verbage from the Exec Order that supports my opinion
3.)no, I cannot explain any claim you have made without any proof to back it up. you could claim your company sold rainbow striped unicorns.
4.)again..I can't explain any unsupported claims you make



except for the pesky little detail of you not providing any "facts" to support your posts. simply claiming "my company does XYZ" is not a fact. for all the "proof" you've provided...you could be the one "making stuff up"

1.) accept for the facts and links i provided
2.) yes you did and i linked the exact thing you were talking about and quoted what it ACTUALLY Said and what it FACTUALLY means. You make assumption on top of its verbiage that isnt actually said. This is why you failed.
Facts and links prove your opinion wrong, this fact wont change.
3.) deflect all you want you cant explain cause your assumptions and opinions are wrong
4.) see answer 3
5.) oih but i did, links to the order you cried about and links to other AA/EO policies that all prove your opinion wrong. You can deny it if you like but the definition and requirements for AA/EO are not going to change based on your opinion. Then theres also the provided facts that stat qoutas are illegal and if you like i can find cases where a company having qoutas had criminal action taken agains it.

You can keep spinning, posting lies and ignore the facts all you want but they simply prove your opinion wrong. Would you like me to post all the links again and look for the court cases?
 
1.) accept for the facts and links i provided
2.) yes you did and i linked the exact thing you were talking about and quoted what it ACTUALLY Said and what it FACTUALLY means. You make assumption on top of its verbiage that isnt actually said. This is why you failed.
Facts and links prove your opinion wrong, this fact wont change.
3.) deflect all you want you cant explain cause your assumptions and opinions are wrong
4.) see answer 3
5.) oih but i did, links to the order you cried about and links to other AA/EO policies that all prove your opinion wrong. You can deny it if you like but the definition and requirements for AA/EO are not going to change based on your opinion. Then theres also the provided facts that stat qoutas are illegal and if you like i can find cases where a company having qoutas had criminal action taken agains it.

You can keep spinning, posting lies and ignore the facts all you want but they simply prove your opinion wrong. Would you like me to post all the links again and look for the court cases?

and you can't just keep on spinning tall tales about what your company has or has not done.......
 
and you can't just keep on spinning tall tales about what your company has or has not done.......

wow that was a big time dodge
translation: you dont want the links re-posted that prove you wrong. Well you can just read posts 151, 196, 342, and 346 over again until you understand them. Let me know when you are ready to stay on topic and be civil also Nd let me know if you want court cases ill gladly dig them up and post them.
 
Does institutional racism currently exist in America?

Looks like a term invented to make certain that there will never be perfection. Until 100% of all racism is eliminate, we have racism, thus requiring perpetual special programs for the minorities FOREVER. This is the goal, reduction of racism is counterproductive to the Jackson/Sharpton agenda. Once conscious racism is eliminated, then they have sub-conscious racism to lean on. After that some other form will be invented......i.e., move the goal posts.
 
wow that was a big time dodge
translation: you dont want the links re-posted that prove you wrong. Well you can just read posts 151, 196, 342, and 346 over again until you understand them. Let me know when you are ready to stay on topic and be civil also Nd let me know if you want court cases ill gladly dig them up and post them.

no...what I want is some proof of the claims you made about what your company does or does not do. you can't just throw crap out there, claim it is fact, and then squeal "I WIN".
 
Looks like a term invented to make certain that there will never be perfection. Until 100% of all racism is eliminate, we have racism, thus requiring perpetual special programs for the minorities FOREVER. This is the goal, reduction of racism is counterproductive to the Jackson/Sharpton agenda. Once conscious racism is eliminated, then they have sub-conscious racism to lean on. After that some other form will be invented......i.e., move the goal posts.

well....if racism didn't exist....minorities couldn't be "victims"
 
Looks like a term invented to make certain that there will never be perfection. Until 100% of all racism is eliminate, we have racism, thus requiring perpetual special programs for the minorities FOREVER. This is the goal, reduction of racism is counterproductive to the Jackson/Sharpton agenda. Once conscious racism is eliminated, then they have sub-conscious racism to lean on. After that some other form will be invented......i.e., move the goal posts.

Definitely. Those guys THRIVE on racism. They LOVE racism.
 
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