View Poll Results: Does institutional racism currently exist in America?

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  • Yes, and it is rampant.

    14 22.95%
  • Yes, in quite a few places, but not everywhere.

    30 49.18%
  • For the most part, no. It exists but is rare.

    15 24.59%
  • Absolutely not.

    2 3.28%
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Thread: Institutional Racism [W:344]

  1. #71
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    "Institutional racism" is, as I understand it, racism that is legitimized by law. When blacks were segregated by law, that was institutionalized racism. The only institutionalized discrimination that still exists is against homosexuals, who up until recently were by law not allowed to serve openly in the military, are still by law unable to marry in most states.

    That is not to say that racism itself doesn't exist; it does. But I cannot think of any example of "Institutional racism" that still exists.

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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    In the inner cities, you have more than 50% of students dropping out anyhow, mostly because they know that they don't need an education, they're going to spend their lives dealing drugs, having illegitimate children and in prison or on welfare. That's what their parent(s) and their sub-culture teaches them they should do, but it remains their choice and their fault, you can't blame any of it on institutional racism. Nobody forces them to be idiots. They choose that for themselves.

    All of the things you list are not causes of that kind of behavior, but consequences of it. Teachers get burned out having to deal with a culture that teaches their children to be disrespectful, that doesn't place a priority on education, etc. You have to place the blame on the people who are actually causing the problem and that's not the schools, it's the students.
    For the most part, it's the parents. Secondarily are the schools. Sorry if we don't agree. I don't blame 12-year-olds because they're gang bangers. I blame their parents. They are failures.
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  3. #73
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    What's your point? Are you arguing that violence is the most anti-intellectual form of anti-intellectualism?
    I explained my point. That while all forms of commercial music are largely anti-intellectual, what we see in commercial rap far exceeds what we see in other genre's of music.


    Why are violent lyrics more anti-intellectual than lyrics trivializing sexuality?
    It goes far beyond merely violent lyrics. The musicians are often involved in major drug distribution busts, murder investigations, and a high degree of involvement with street gangs. This is why you have rival musicians shooting each other and ordering physical attacks and robbery, etc.

    If you want to equivocate that with sexualized lyrics and sexist imagery be my guest, but you'll come off as rather silly

  4. #74
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    By this definition yes, it most certainly does

    A form of racial inequality resulting not from conscious discrimination, but from the cumulative effect of subconscious racism and/or from the aggregate inertial discriminatory effect of individuals within a non-diverse group favoring like-minded individuals.
    Essentially what this is saying is you are promoting racism if all your friends are white, all your business partners are white, all your neighbors are white. However, the opposite is true. if you were to make a conscience effort to include people because of their race, if you show favoritism toward them in doing business, in making relationships, in intergrating communities, than you, the one making the conscience effort are the one practicing racism, purposefully and without regret.

    Condemning a group for not mixing races because they have no desire to, notice, having no desire isn't the same as purposeful exclusion, makes those doing the condemnation the racists, not those who are carrying on in their lives as they choose.

    I think it is obvious that the exact opposite is true. If you are including individuals by singling out their racial attributes than you are the racist not the ones who are " individuals within a non-diverse group favoring like-minded individuals"
    Last edited by ChezC3; 05-30-13 at 06:05 PM.

  5. #75
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    Anti-intellectual: that which is opposed to or antithetical to the use of one's intellect

    *rough definition, but it should get the point across
    I don't know... not sure if there is any music, no matter how commercial or trivial, that actively recommends you not to use your intellect (correct me if I'm wrong).

    On the other side, even very sophisticated music can be enjoyed on a non-intellectual level (you can like and love classic music and good jazz, yet not know much about it... that's what I do most of the time when I listen to that kind of music ). Sure, a lot of clasical music and a good part of jazz offer more than just that, unlike generic commercial music, so you can study it deeply and yet find new interesting twists in it amateurs don't recognize. But you don't need to be an expert to love Mozart.

    And then, when jazz music was new, there was a huge outcry by lovers and experts of classical music. I remember having read that one very famous professor and critic for classical music said "it's not music, it's vulgar noise, the sound of uncivilized sexual passions" and "negro music" or something to that extent. There was a similar outcry in the establishment when certain classical music was new, like when ... was it Mendelssohn? made the shift from classicism to romanticism, or when Wagner came up with his pompous operas. Now they're considered titans of classical music, and jazz a sophisticated style. Probably it always takes a generation that grew up with a new style to get old, before a new style is generally accepted.
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  6. #76
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post
    Does institutional racism currently exist in America?
    For the most part, I would say no. Even if it does, federal laws and regulations make actions against others based on racism a punishable offense with crippling penalties, so it's a non-issue.
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    Neither jazz nor classical music has a "commercial" sub-genre.
    As far as I know, there was a lot of very commercial jazz on the height of swing in the 1930s, by many artists frowned upon by the more talented artists.

    And while there was no "commercial" classical music in the modern mass-market-radio sense, there were many commussioned works by composers who worked for nobles and kings, which had the mean focus of being pleasing to the ear, rather than being sophisticated ... just perfect for the king's breakfast or card games as background entertainment.
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  8. #78
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    For the most part, it's the parents. Secondarily are the schools. Sorry if we don't agree. I don't blame 12-year-olds because they're gang bangers. I blame their parents. They are failures.
    But it's still not institutional racism, it's stupid people.
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    I explained my point. That while all forms of commercial music are largely anti-intellectual, what we see in commercial rap far exceeds what we see in other genre's of music.




    It goes far beyond merely violent lyrics. The musicians are often involved in major drug distribution busts, murder investigations, and a high degree of involvement with street gangs. This is why you have rival musicians shooting each other and ordering physical attacks and robbery, etc.

    If you want to equivocate that with sexualized lyrics and sexist imagery be my guest, but you'll come off as rather silly
    You are most definitely correct in your assessment of the overwhelming majority of rap music, so don't let anyone sway you into thinking you are not. Side by side comparison of lyrics between rap music and ANY other genre will show how disgusting it actually is. Children hear this crap on the radio because the FCC is too afraid of censoring it for fear of being accused of discriminating! I can't believe some of the **** people can get away on the radio, its obsurd. Rap music contains all manners of terrible lyrics, and is not limited to just violence or sexually explicit lyrics.

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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    not only doesnt it make sense its broken logic. Music/movies etc are meaningless to this topic, their impact secondary
    Music / movies are both heavily influential on all cultures. To say they are meaningless to this topic is absolutely ridiculous.

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