View Poll Results: Does institutional racism currently exist in America?

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  • Yes, and it is rampant.

    14 22.95%
  • Yes, in quite a few places, but not everywhere.

    30 49.18%
  • For the most part, no. It exists but is rare.

    15 24.59%
  • Absolutely not.

    2 3.28%
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Thread: Institutional Racism [W:344]

  1. #161
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by Sig View Post
    1.)Quotas are de jure illegal.
    2.)Obviously, they are a de facto ingredient in the regular application of any Affirmative Action policy.
    3.)Otherwise, there would be no practical way of implementing it.
    4.) I don't suppose you believe that companies and institutions arrive at their minority "target goals" by way of a Ouija board, do you?
    1.) true
    2.) false and if they are then its not AA/EO
    3.) also false since the only requirement is OPPORTUNITY not employment
    4.) if they have target goals then it proves they arent practicing AA/EO thanks for supporting the facts


    My company is advertised as AA/EO and we do government work/contracts, I myself am a key member of recruiting/hiring. We have ZERO qoutas
    this is called practicing FACTUAL AA/EO the right way
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  2. #162
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post

    1.) true
    Thank you for this bit of honesty.

    2.) false and if they are then its not AA/EO
    "No true Scotsman" fallacy.

    3.) also false since the only requirement is OPPORTUNITY not employment
    Maintaining a sense of unreality does not improve your argument.

    4.) if they have target goals then it proves they arent practicing AA/EO thanks for supporting the facts
    "No true Scotsman" again. You'll have to do better than this.

    My company is advertised as AA/EO and we do government work/contracts, I myself am a key member of recruiting/hiring. We have ZERO qoutas
    this is called practicing FACTUAL AA/EO the right way
    Of course you have quotas, you just do not call them quotas. It is annoyingly disingenuous for you to suggest otherwise. Do you expect me to believe that you never conduct a head count of how many minority employees you have on the books?
    It's like you're dreaming of Gorgonzola when it's clearly Brie time, baby. Step into my office.

  3. #163
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by Sig View Post
    1.)Thank you for this bit of honesty.
    2.)"No true Scotsman" fallacy.
    3.)Maintaining a sense of unreality does not improve your argument.
    4.)"No true Scotsman" again. You'll have to do better than this.
    5.)Of course you have quotas, you just do not call them quotas.
    6.)It is annoyingly disingenuous for you to suggest otherwise.
    7.) Do you expect me to believe that you never conduct a head count of how many minority employees you have on the books?
    1.) you're welcome
    2.) facts prove you wrong
    3.) its not my argument im stating facts, this is where you are confused
    4.) again no i dont have to do better facts prove your statement wrong
    5.) no we have ZERO qoutas LMAO
    6.) be annoyed your argument is failing all you want doesnt change the fact we have no qoutas
    its a fact for me to state that, you are the only on with the disingenuous issue in this conversation between us lol
    7.) it doesnt matter what you "believe" the facts dont change
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    1.) you're welcome
    2.) facts prove you wrong
    3.) its not my argument im stating facts, this is where you are confused
    4.) again no i dont have to do better facts prove your statement wrong
    5.) no we have ZERO qoutas LMAO
    6.) be annoyed your argument is failing all you want doesnt change the fact we have no qoutas
    its a fact for me to state that, you are the only on with the disingenuous issue in this conversation between us lol
    7.) it doesnt matter what you "believe" the facts dont change
    What you are doing is dodging the issue.

    Let's cut the crap. You and I both know that what we are really talking about is not "Affirmative Action" in its most literal de jure legal interpretation. What we are talking about is the avoidance of discrimination lawsuits from such entities as the NAACP, as well as the avoidance of heavy fines and penalties from such entities as state and federal government for non-compliance with EOE guidelines. For example: If your company has a work force of, say... 1000 employees, and is located in a racially diverse region of the United States, and not a one of your employees is a "minority," then your company is highly vulnerable to the aforementioned lawsuits and fines and penalties, regardless of how fair and "color blind" your recruitment practices may have been, and especially regardless of whether you have presented the most unbiased and color blind opportunity for employment imaginable.
    It's like you're dreaming of Gorgonzola when it's clearly Brie time, baby. Step into my office.

  5. #165
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by Sig View Post
    1.)What you are doing is dodging the issue.

    2.)Let's cut the crap.
    3.)You and I both know that what we are really talking about is not "Affirmative Action" in its most literal de jure legal interpretation.
    4.) What we are talking about is the avoidance of discrimination lawsuits from such entities as the NAACP,
    5.) as well as the avoidance of heavy fines and penalties from such entities as state and federal government for non-compliance with EOE guidelines.

    6.)For example: If your company has a work force of, say... 1000 employees, and is located in a racially diverse region of the United States, and not a one of your employees is a "minority," then your company is highly vulnerable to the aforementioned lawsuits and fines and penalties, regardless of how fair and "color blind" your recruitment practices may have been, and especially regardless of whether you have presented the most unbiased and color blind opportunity for employment imaginable.
    1.) the reality is im the one focusing on the issue and facts and you dont like it
    2.) you are the only one spewing it
    3.) no what YOU are talking about is not AA/EO and facts prove this, i am actually talking about AA/EO and you are not. This very post PROVES this fact.
    4.) these are NOT the same things and to link them is uneducated and disingenuous. Groups can sue for what ever reason they like.
    This has nothing to do with REAL AA/EO
    5.) actually if a company practiced AA/EO they way you suggest THAT would get them fined and criminally prosecuted. Again i would know since thats where i work.

    6.) 100% false

    they have ZERO vulnerability from EOE guidelines if they are following them
    they have the same vulnerability as getting sued by anybody as any company does


    IF they are in fact practicing unfair policies and discrimination then they are vulnerable to get sued AND LOSE as anybody breaking the law

    again facts simply dont support your opinion, you are greatly misinformed as to what AA/EO is

    Companies get in trouble for doing what you say and thats the bottom line
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    Okay, well my point is that just because a piece of music is superficial does not mean the analysis of it has to be.
    My point is, when you're analyzing something that isn't meant to necessarily be analyzed, it says more about your perception of reality then it does about the song.

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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    That's not evidence that blacks and whites are held to different standards. It's evidence that blacks and whites have different average MCAT scores and GPAs and that med schools take more than MCATs and GPAs into account. The fact is that medical schools eliminate applicants automatically based on minimum GPA and MCAT scores. After that, they look at everything else including race. You're assuming that the only difference between blacks and whites is scores when it's possible that blacks have better recommendations, research experience, internships or other more subjective qualifications. You're just making an assumption based on a surface analysis.

    Also, Asians get better scores than Whites. Does that mean Whites are held to a lower standard too?
    Yes actually. Its pretty well documented that Asians are discriminated against because they are held to much higher standards then any other race. For instance, when Texas switched completely to a top 10% policy for their schools, Asian Americans saw the highest increase in enrollment under the policy.

    Also, I would highly doubt that subjective qualifications differ much between races. But I would be happy for you to prove me wrong. Either way, why don't we just solve the issue and forbid colleges from taking race into consideration. If they aren't hold races to different standards, then whats the purpose of race on an application?

  8. #168
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post

    1.) the reality is im the one focusing on the issue and facts and you dont like it
    No, you are DODGING the issue. This is the reality even if you lack the intellectual honesty to admit it.

    IF they are in fact practicing unfair policies and discrimination then they are vulnerable to get sued AND LOSE as anybody breaking the law
    And what sort of evidence would you present of said unfair policies and discrimination, practiced by a company that has zero minority employees though it operates in a demographically diverse region of the United States?
    It's like you're dreaming of Gorgonzola when it's clearly Brie time, baby. Step into my office.

  9. #169
    I'm kind of a big deal

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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by Sig View Post
    1.)No, you are DODGING the issue. This is the reality even if you lack the intellectual honesty to admit it.

    2.)And what sort of evidence would you present of said unfair policies and discrimination, practiced by a company that has zero minority employees though it operates in a demographically diverse region of the United States?
    1.)no im not dodging anything that is a bold faced lie
    your argument fails and FACTS have already proved you wrong you are trying to deflect and your failed insults show your desperation LOL
    let me know when you are ready to be honest and talk about facts
    2.) that they provided equal OPPORTUNITY exactly what the law requires and exactly what companies do that arent breaking the law lol

    no need to get upset because facts prove you wrong

    if you would like to discuss how some companies do practice unfair hiring policies thats fine, and its true but the fact is thats NOT AA/EO and your opinion wont change that fact

    if you would like to talk about how there are crybaby groups out there that will try to sue for a company not having enough blacks, asians, women, men, older people, young people, gays etc etc that is also true but it also is not AA/EO

    let me know when you are ready
    Last edited by AGENT J; 05-31-13 at 01:58 AM.
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  10. #170
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post

    let me know when you are ready
    Let me know when you are ready to admit that an employer, whether in the private or public sector, can be sued or fined for not having a "sufficient" number of "minority" employees on their payroll. Then I will know that we are on the same page and can continue the discussion.
    It's like you're dreaming of Gorgonzola when it's clearly Brie time, baby. Step into my office.

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