View Poll Results: Does institutional racism currently exist in America?

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  • Yes, and it is rampant.

    14 22.95%
  • Yes, in quite a few places, but not everywhere.

    30 49.18%
  • For the most part, no. It exists but is rare.

    15 24.59%
  • Absolutely not.

    2 3.28%
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Thread: Institutional Racism [W:344]

  1. #91
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    Now, you're not talking about music anymore. You're talking about people's lives. You keep changing the goal posts and the topic, in general. Please explain how commercial rap MUSIC is more anti-intellectual than other forms of commercial MUSIC.
    I don't exactly consider "**** bitches get money" intellectual in any genre of music. I have just noticed that rap seems to contain this theme far more often then other genres.

  2. #92
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by ReformCollege View Post
    I don't exactly consider "**** bitches get money" intellectual in any genre of music. I have just noticed that rap seems to contain this theme far more often then other genres.
    I don't consider it intellectual either. And you're correct, "bitches get money" is a type of line that is more in rap music. "LOL, that boy is cute" is a type of line that is more in pop music. Both lines are equally as stupid which was my point. So what's yours again?

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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    Nope. Lil B rapping, "Bitches suck my dick because I look like J.K. Rowling," is just as stupid as Katy Perry singing, "I kissed a girl and I liked it." They both are not only just dumb lyrics, but they both perpetuate ignorance surrounding women and sexuality. The only difference is that Lil B uses more explicit language which is only means that it offends some people's sensibilities.
    You have to stretch Katy Perry's lyrics to even make that comparison, whereas Lil B's lyrics require no stretch of the imagination at all. The former may or may not reflect slight ignorance about the nature of sexuality, but the latter is down right disrespectful and misogynist. Your comparison here is a complete and utter failure, and I think you should know that.

  4. #94
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    Actually, yes. In that case, their lives are still separate from their music.
    I'm not even surew where to begin with this. Clearly if their music is based on their lifestyle, it's strange to claim they are separate and one doesn't have a bearing over the other when we are discussing musical content here

    Now, at the start of our conversation, you were talking about music. Then, you started talking about musician's lives.
    If you want to ignore they are rapping about their lifestyle, and how their lifestyle obviously then becomes entwined with the content and themes of their music, I don't know what to tell you. because the relationship is rather obvious at that point


    Since I like to stay focused in discussions and since you apparently don't, we probably don't have anything else to talk about.
    My position has been clear from the beginning

  5. #95
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    I don't consider it intellectual either. And you're correct, "bitches get money" is a type of line that is more in rap music. "LOL, that boy is cute" is a type of line that is more in pop music. Both lines are equally as stupid which was my point. So what's yours again?
    They may be equally stupid, but one is far more offensive and harmful. And I didn't realize that pop music was the only form of music besides rap? I'd argue that rock as a whole is far more intelligently produced music than either of those genres. Point is, not all genres are created equal.

  6. #96
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    Not if their rapping about their lifestyle, crimes, and criminal activities ....
    Lil Wayne is a perfect example. I sure as heck had no sympathy when it recently appeared his stupid lifestyle he sings about had taken a toll on him.

    Lil Wayne hospitalized; sizzurp's powerful high, deadly side effects - Los Angeles Times
    "With me everything turns into mathematics."
    "It is not enough to have a good mind. The main thing is to use it well."
    "It is truth very certain that, when it is not in one's power to determine what is true, we ought to follow what is more probable." -- Rene Descartes

  7. #97
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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by ReformCollege View Post
    They may be equally stupid, but one is far more offensive and harmful. And I didn't realize that pop music was the only form of music besides rap? I'd argue that rock as a whole is far more intelligently produced music than either of those genres. Point is, not all genres are created equal.
    I didn't realize I said that pop was the only form of music besides rap. Weird.

    As for the rest of your post, I don't consider either line to be "offensive" or "harmful". I consider them both to just be stupid.

    I'd argue that rap, pop, rock and other forms of music all have merits that reflect different attitudes, lifestyles, et al.. I would also argue that people rank genres of music solely according to their subjective perceptions of quality which are valuable for nothing other than outlining their own preferences.

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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    Nah, I'm going to have to agree with Dr. King on this one: "A society that has done something special against the Negro for hundreds of years must now do something special for the Negro."

    The fact is that the sort of colorblindness you're advocating isn't really practical if you want to achieve equality. You have to acknowledge that certain races are starting at a disadvantaged position and, in turn, develop means of targeting those race based disadvantages.
    Let me ask you a question. Is a middle class black student less likely to succeed then a poor inner city white? Is a poor inner city black student less likely to succeed then a poor inner city white student?

    To me equality isn't some rigid standard where literally everyone has the same results. We have done things to help poor blacks for the 50 something years since Dr. King made such a statement. I'd argue that such racism isn't the primary roadblock for the black community as a whole, and if anything such affirmative action may be harmful by creating resentment by individuals who had nothing to do with the racism that persisted in the 1960s. Rather, I think a better solution is to improve the success rate of black Americans as a whole by reducing crime, improving schools, and reinstitutionalizing the family. Not only will this help blacks succeed, but my bet is that it will most likely improve their perception as well, which will reduce instances of actual racism. Irish, Eastern European, and Jewish immigrants were all treated hostilely at one point in American history, and I don't think that was solved by singling those groups out and giving them extra benefits to make up for it.

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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    I didn't realize I said that pop was the only form of music besides rap. Weird.

    As for the rest of your post, I don't consider either line to be "offensive" or "harmful". I consider them both to just be stupid.

    I'd argue that rap, pop, rock and other forms of music all have merits that reflect different attitudes, lifestyles, et al.. I would also argue that people rank genres of music solely according to their subjective perceptions of quality which are valuable for nothing other than outlining their own preferences.
    I consider "**** bitches" to be slightly offensive. I consider it more offensive when I actually see people adopting that attitude. I don't think the attitude "that boy is cute" is particularly all that harmful in its own right. But to each their own.

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    re: Institutional Racism [W:344]

    Quote Originally Posted by ReformCollege View Post
    You have to stretch Katy Perry's lyrics to even make that comparison, whereas Lil B's lyrics require no stretch of the imagination at all. The former may or may not reflect slight ignorance about the nature of sexuality, but the latter is down right disrespectful and misogynist. Your comparison here is a complete and utter failure, and I think you should know that.
    That's why I said "The only difference is that Lil B uses more explicit language." Thank you for repeating what I said as if it was your own thought. As for the rest of your post, your analysis is just a surface one just like most analyses of rap music in comparison to other genres. Most people who denigrate rap, in particular, do so on the basis that rap is more explicit in its problematic content. The implication of such superficial analyses is that music is only a problem when it is overt with its problematic features. I don't agree with that so your comment that my position is an "utter failure" is meaningless to me. It's hard for me to take critics of rap seriously when they've only shown that they are capable of superficial analyses of music and when they don't adequately acknowledge problems in other genres. /shrug

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