View Poll Results: Violent Felons have a 2nd Amendment Right Y/N

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  • No violent felons should have a 2nd Amendment right?

    16 64.00%
  • Any felon after serving time deserves a 2nd Amendment right?

    9 36.00%
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Thread: Should a convicted violent felon be allowed to own guns after release from prison?

  1. #21
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    Re: Should a convicted violent felon be allowed to own guns after release from prison

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    I don't want to put trust on "often." I think after time enhanced consequences are merited, doing the crime forfeits the right to own a gun post release.
    The definition of a right is that it cannot be forfeited.

    You're thinking of priveleges.
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
    The Psychology of Persuasion

  2. #22
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    Re: Should a convicted violent felon be allowed to own guns after release from prison

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    First I think there should certainly be a distinction between violent and non-violent felons. Disarming non-violent felons is absolutely irrational.

    As far as the violent ones go, I tend to lean more towards the belief that once they've completed their prescribed punishment, they should be treated equally. If they are still seen as "violent" or "owing something to society" then their punishment wasn't over.
    To be fair though, if you put non-violent people in jail with violent people, they have to become violent to survive, so they will be violent on release.

  3. #23
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    Re: Should a convicted violent felon be allowed to own guns after release from prison

    Quote Originally Posted by Mason66 View Post
    To be fair though, if you put non-violent people in jail with violent people, they have to become violent to survive, so they will be violent on release.
    This is why I think non-violent offenders should ALWAYS be separated from the violent ones. They should be in minimum security prisons and treated completely differently. These people actually have a real chance of integrating back into society. Putting a tax evader in with murderers and rapists is just insane.

  4. #24
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    Re: Should a convicted violent felon be allowed to own guns after release from prison

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    This is why I think non-violent offenders should ALWAYS be separated from the violent ones. They should be in minimum security prisons and treated completely differently. These people actually have a real chance of integrating back into society. Putting a tax evader in with murderers and rapists is just insane.
    But that is exactly what happens and there are consequences to that.

  5. #25
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    Re: Should a convicted violent felon be allowed to own guns after release from prison

    Quote Originally Posted by Mason66 View Post
    But that is exactly what happens and there are consequences to that.
    I know, that's why I pointed out that I wholeheartedly oppose this policy.

  6. #26
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    Re: Should a convicted violent felon be allowed to own guns after release from prison

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Under our current "legal justice system" I have reservations about restoring all rights to a convicted violent felon.


    First I'd prefer to reform the system, so that the incorrigibles are either executed or put away somewhere secure and unpleasant for life, while those felons who are fixable are incarcerated in rehabilitation facilities and are not released until there is solid evidence of real reform.

    If that were how our system worked, then once released from custody I would expect the reformed felon to have all his rights restored to him.



    Even under our current system, the rule against felons owning guns is something of a bad joke. I've known felons to re-arm themselves within 24 hours after release. Best to assume anyone you cut loose into society WILL re-arm himself if he chooses to do so. The fact that they can't legally buy from a dealer doesn't slow them down in the slightest.
    This. If we had a decent system to begin with, there would be no need to treat felons the way we do in the first place.

    The justification for denying felons their rights, these days, is the high rate of recidivism. But it has been proven over and over again than we can cut our recidivism down to a tiny fraction of what it is, if we focus on two things and two things only:
    1. Can this person be rehabilitated?
    2. If not, how do we keep the public safe?

    Right now, our justice system is focused on vengeance, and it completely forgets to deal with how do we make people safer.

    As another example of this stupid system at work, we shouldn't need a sex offense registry, because true rape and pedophilic criminals should never be released. The guy who streaked at a college football game shouldn't be charged with a sex crime. Voila, no need for a sex offense registry.

    Lkewise, we shouldn't need to ban violent felons from doing anything, because they should either be rehab'ed or they should never be released. Voila, no more need to talk about their rights. They're either in prison or they're free.

    The discussion we're having right now is a discussion about how we should work around a bad system. How about fixing the system instead?

  7. #27
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    Re: Should a convicted violent felon be allowed to own guns after release from prison

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    The definition of a right is that it cannot be forfeited.

    You're thinking of priveleges.
    Not specifically correct. A right is something that belongs to you naturally, but it can be taken away in a figuratively similar way to losing an arm. Just putting someone in prison already loses them a lot of rights, although they can be restored later.

    Privileges are earned and/or bestowed.
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

    St. Benedict

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    Re: Should a convicted violent felon be allowed to own guns after release from prison

    You'd have to probably triple the budget for corrections and incarcerate far more people for life then you and others are willing to pay for; its a nice utopian dream to believe those who shouldn't have their rights restored should just forever remain incarcerated but its just not the reality.

    Years ago CA's supreme court abolished the death penalthy and in about 10 years death row inmates were showing up for parole hearings and getting paroled. The people restored the death penalty and while it rarely happens those sentenced to it never come up for parole - at least.

    There are already 5-10 posts on this thread about "what" the system should be - I suppose by many that don't want to admit rights should not be restored to violent felons who are released.


    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeAndMirrors View Post
    This. If we had a decent system to begin with, there would be no need to treat felons the way we do in the first place.

    The justification for denying felons their rights, these days, is the high rate of recidivism. But it has been proven over and over again than we can cut our recidivism down to a tiny fraction of what it is, if we focus on two things and two things only:
    1. Can this person be rehabilitated?
    2. If not, how do we keep the public safe?

    Right now, our justice system is focused on vengeance, and it completely forgets to deal with how do we make people safer.

    As another example of this stupid system at work, we shouldn't need a sex offense registry, because true rape and pedophilic criminals should never be released. The guy who streaked at a college football game shouldn't be charged with a sex crime. Voila, no need for a sex offense registry.

    Lkewise, we shouldn't need to ban violent felons from doing anything, because they should either be rehab'ed or they should never be released. Voila, no more need to talk about their rights. They're either in prison or they're free.

    The discussion we're having right now is a discussion about how we should work around a bad system. How about fixing the system instead?

  9. #29
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    Re: Should a convicted violent felon be allowed to own guns after release from prison

    Quote Originally Posted by CalGun View Post
    You'd have to probably triple the budget for corrections and incarcerate far more people for life then you and others are willing to pay for; its a nice utopian dream to believe those who shouldn't have their rights restored should just forever remain incarcerated but its just not the reality.

    Years ago CA's supreme court abolished the death penalthy and in about 10 years death row inmates were showing up for parole hearings and getting paroled. The people restored the death penalty and while it rarely happens those sentenced to it never come up for parole - at least.

    There are already 5-10 posts on this thread about "what" the system should be - I suppose by many that don't want to admit rights should not be restored to violent felons who are released.
    Not at all. Our costs would drop dramatically, because we'd have far fewer people in prison.

    It's not a utopian dream. It is the practice of many different countries for decades with quite a bit of success. America, once again, is behind the curve, and therefore maintains the highest prison population in the developed world. And we spend more to maintain it than we do on education.

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    Re: Should a convicted violent felon be allowed to own guns after release from prison


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