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Ideological Support for Political Spending Transparency

Do you support public exposure of non-profit activities?

  • I am a liberal, and I support public exposure of non-profit donations and/or spending.

    Votes: 3 42.9%
  • I am a liberal, and I do not support public exposure of non-profit donations and/or spending.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • I am a conservative, and I support public exposure of non-profit donations and/or spending.

    Votes: 3 42.9%
  • I am a conservative, and I do not support public exposure of non-profit donations and/or spending.

    Votes: 1 14.3%

  • Total voters
    7

jonny5

DP Veteran
Joined
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Republic of Florida
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Libertarian
In light of the scandal regarding the IRS deciding who gets scrutinized for tax exemption, im curious as to whether there is even support for the taxation of any non profit, and specifically the exposure of who gives money to these groups, and how these groups spend their money. As a libertarian, I dont care who wants to give money to a group, or how that group spends its money. Its none of my business. Your thoughts?
 
As a libertarian, I dont care who wants to give money to a group, or how that group spends its money. Its none of my business. Your thoughts?

It only becomes my business when they are given a tax exemption status and their political contributions thereby become tax-deductible, so to speak.

Our tax codes are a mess. Let's all just admit that. And Congress?? They bemoan, bitch and complain about the very regulations they put in place.
 
It only becomes my business when they are given a tax exemption status and their political contributions thereby become tax-deductible, so to speak.

Our tax codes are a mess. Let's all just admit that. And Congress?? They bemoan, bitch and complain about the very regulations they put in place.

But if they are a non profit, why shouldnt they be tax exempt? Or rather, why should polticial advocacy be taxed?
 
But if they are a non profit, why shouldnt they be tax exempt? Or rather, why should polticial advocacy be taxed?

Political advocacy in the form of cash and in-kind donations is taxed. I run a charity that feeds and cares for stray dogs. It's tax-exempt because I'm doing good works, right? Well, what if my donations amount to $5 billion a year? $200,000 goes towards caring for strays and the other $4.8 billion goes to the Republican Party tax-free. Hmmmm.....
 
It only becomes my business when they are given a tax exemption status and their political contributions thereby become tax-deductible, so to speak.

Our tax codes are a mess. Let's all just admit that. And Congress?? They bemoan, bitch and complain about the very regulations they put in place.

Contributions to 501(c)(4) organizations generally aren't deductible. If you're a business you can buy advertising on their site or a poster at one of their events and deduct that but you can't just hand them a check and deduct it.
Donations to Section 501(c)(4) Organizations
 
Political advocacy in the form of cash and in-kind donations is taxed. I run a charity that feeds and cares for stray dogs. It's tax-exempt because I'm doing good works, right? Well, what if my donations amount to $5 billion a year? $200,000 goes towards caring for strays and the other $4.8 billion goes to the Republican Party tax-free. Hmmmm.....

If you did that you would no longer be operating in your stated charitable function and you would lose your non-profit status.
 
Where is the poll for independents who aren't partisans?
 
Political advocacy in the form of cash and in-kind donations is taxed. I run a charity that feeds and cares for stray dogs. It's tax-exempt because I'm doing good works, right? Well, what if my donations amount to $5 billion a year? $200,000 goes towards caring for strays and the other $4.8 billion goes to the Republican Party tax-free. Hmmmm.....

Right, what is wrong with that? Why should donating money to a non profit be taxed, and why should the public be able to see who you donated money to?
 
Where is the poll for independents who aren't partisans?

Im attempting to determine whether there is a ideological difference in how liberals vs conservatives feel about public exposure of political activities.
 
Right, what is wrong with that? Why should donating money to a non profit be taxed, and why should the public be able to see who you donated money to?

Basically, campaign contributions are limited, to reduce corruption.

What FAR too many 501(c)(4)s do is perform the EXACT SAME ACTIVITIES formerly done by campaigns themselves. With no reporting of donor names. So its just a loophole to get around campaign finance laws.

So the campaign gets the same services performed, it just doesn't pay for them directly, and those who wish to invest in politicians are no longer prevented from doing so by the law.

501(c)(4)s also provide the benefit of deniability. "That wasn't me, it was that PAC."

If you don't think money has an undue influence on our politics, and is at the heart of a lot of the country's problems, you aren't thinking clearly.

Money is SO concentrated that the "impossible" isn't even difficult.

Just the couple trillion sidelined in the economy recently could have handed a billion a piece to the 700 or so on capital hill and STILL had a couple of trillion.

And I doubt ANYBODY could TRULY resist a billion. Justification would be EASY.
 
Basically, campaign contributions are limited, to reduce corruption.

What FAR too many 501(c)(4)s do is perform the EXACT SAME ACTIVITIES formerly done by campaigns themselves. With no reporting of donor names. So its just a loophole to get around campaign finance laws.

So the campaign gets the same services performed, it just doesn't pay for them directly, and those who wish to invest in politicians are no longer prevented from doing so by the law.

501(c)(4)s also provide the benefit of deniability. "That wasn't me, it was that PAC."

If you don't think money has an undue influence on our politics, and is at the heart of a lot of the country's problems, you aren't thinking clearly.

Money is SO concentrated that the "impossible" isn't even difficult.

Just the couple trillion sidelined in the economy recently could have handed a billion a piece to the 700 or so on capital hill and STILL had a couple of trillion.

And I doubt ANYBODY could TRULY resist a billion. Justification would be EASY.

That would be bribery, and I never suggested doing away with transparency in the money elected politicians receive. Im asking why the public needs to know if I give $100 to the NRA.
 
That would be bribery, and I never suggested doing away with transparency in the money elected politicians receive. Im asking why the public needs to know if I give $100 to the NRA.

That's where the problems arise.

There are geoups like the NRA or AARP, that do work which furthers a GROUPS causes.

Then there are groups which are simply "fronts" for partisan politics. Formed solely to allow enormous anonymous campaign investments.

Fraud is RAMPANT in non-profits. Fake churches, charities, campaign money.laundering.

So what're you gonna do?
 
That's where the problems arise.

There are geoups like the NRA or AARP, that do work which furthers a GROUPS causes.

Then there are groups which are simply "fronts" for partisan politics. Formed solely to allow enormous anonymous campaign investments.

Fraud is RAMPANT in non-profits. Fake churches, charities, campaign money.laundering.

So what're you gonna do?


I'm under the impression that it is currently completely legal to bribe politicians as long as the bribe is referred to as a campaign donation. I always want to know who has legal title to my Congressman's vote. Monsanto or JPMorganChase or Exxon/Mobil and without transparency I don't know who is really pulling my chain. The big Corporations don't want transparency because they might be targetted by types such as the recent Boston bombers who might take offense to the fact that the vote can be bought and sold. But that is our contemporary circumstance. Bummer!
 
That's where the problems arise.

There are geoups like the NRA or AARP, that do work which furthers a GROUPS causes.

Then there are groups which are simply "fronts" for partisan politics. Formed solely to allow enormous anonymous campaign investments.

Fraud is RAMPANT in non-profits. Fake churches, charities, campaign money.laundering.

So what're you gonna do?

Investigate invividuals and ignore groups. The purpose of taxation is to collect money to pay for govt services, not to decide who and who isnt legitimate.
 
Investigate invividuals and ignore groups. The purpose of taxation is to collect money to pay for govt services, not to decide who and who isnt legitimate.
Time to found the Church of Me! :D
 
Investigate invividuals and ignore groups. The purpose of taxation is to collect money to pay for govt services, not to decide who and who isnt legitimate.

Look up "universal life church".

They would(will?) ordain anybody.

Then you could declare yourself a church and pay not taxes.

They've clamped down now, but the point is, the IRS has to figure out who is legitimate and who isn't. Otherwise, EVERYBODY will just declare themselves tax exempt.

Unless you do away.with tax exemption altogether.
 
Look up "universal life church".

They would(will?) ordain anybody.

Then you could declare yourself a church and pay not taxes.

They've clamped down now, but the point is, the IRS has to figure out who is legitimate and who isn't. Otherwise, EVERYBODY will just declare themselves tax exempt.

Unless you do away.with tax exemption altogether.

I
would do away
with corporate taxes
altogether. If you declare
yourself a church
and collect a salary or wage,
you pay taxes on it.
 
In light of the scandal regarding the IRS deciding who gets scrutinized for tax exemption, im curious as to whether there is even support for the taxation of any non profit, and specifically the exposure of who gives money to these groups, and how these groups spend their money. As a libertarian, I dont care who wants to give money to a group, or how that group spends its money. Its none of my business. Your thoughts?

As a libertarian, you could have added more options to the list, for us non-schizophrenic folks who do not understand how one can be "liberal" or "conservative", in the modern American sense, without splitting in half and walking in two different directions.

To answer the question, anonymity of political speech is at the very root of our national experience. The Federalist Papers had no signatures.
 
I
would do away
with corporate taxes
altogether. If you declare
yourself a church
and collect a salary or wage,
you pay taxes on it.

Nah, if yer gonna get the benefits/protections of incorporation, you gotta pay for it.

No government freebies, right?
 
As a libertarian, you could have added more options to the list, for us non-schizophrenic folks who do not understand how one can be "liberal" or "conservative", in the modern American sense, without splitting in half and walking in two different directions.

To answer the question, anonymity of political speech is at the very root of our national experience. The Federalist Papers had no signatures.

The federalist papers were controversial wisdom.

Campaign investments are legal bribery.

See the difference?
 
The federalist papers were controversial wisdom.

Campaign investments are legal bribery.

See the difference?

Direct contributions to political campaigns are strictly limited. And the names of contributors are in the public domain.
(I wish they were not: my better half will never forgive me for giving money to the Giuliani campaign - even though I gave much more to Ron Paul and a bunch of local libertarian-Republican candidates in that sordid year).
 
Direct contributions to political campaigns are strictly limited. And the names of contributors are in the public domain.
(I wish they were not: my better half will never forgive me for giving money to the Giuliani campaign - even though I gave much more to Ron Paul and a bunch of local libertarian-Republican candidates in that sordid year).

And they contribute a huge amount more anonymously.

By contributing to various tax exempt groups who perform EXACTLY the same activitites as campaigns, ads for instance.

So its a simple workaround of donation limits.

So we limit DIRECT contributions but allow unlimited anonymous "INDIRECT" contributions, rendering the limits irrelevant.
 
So we limit DIRECT contributions but allow unlimited anonymous "INDIRECT" contributions, rendering the limits irrelevant.

And how are going to draw the line? Say, I want to say something. About that overfilling Dumpster next door. Oops, it is the election season. You cannot possibly buy a page in the local paper and criticize the Mayor, you right-wing extremist. Just sit back and smell...the roses.
 
And how are going to draw the line? Say, I want to say something. About that overfilling Dumpster next door. Oops, it is the election season. You cannot possibly buy a page in the local paper and criticize the Mayor, you right-wing extremist. Just sit back and smell...the roses.

Flip the coin.

I buy as many ads as I want smearing a competitor, anonymously and speciously, convincing low information voters a saint is an asshole, when its really my guy who is the asshole, I just want him in for my development permit or whatever. (Which is how it works now)
 
I'm all for non-profits claiming and receiving tax exempt status. However, the requirement should be for ANYONE with such status to make public where every single non-taxed cent comes from. Don't like it, pay your taxes and we'll stop asking.

End runs around the political contribution laws by the tax exempt orgs should be whacked down and lose their status as soon as they're revealed.
 
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