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Should we open the borders?

Should We open the borders?


  • Total voters
    60
  • Poll closed .

Peter Grimm

Banned
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The anals of history
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Progressive
We should abandon our silly and futile notion of trying to "seal the borders" and just "let the markets work," so to speak.

I think there should be two conditions that, if satisfied, should allow anyone and everyone to enter or exit the United States at will. First, do they have a job? If yes, then they are productive, and they should be allowed to stay. If not, is there someone willing to claim them as a dependent? Is there someone willing to feed, clothe, school them? If so, there is no reason to keep them out of the country. The second condition is that they don't have a criminal record.

Why not seal the border? Well, for one, futility. No matter what we do, people find ways to enter the country. So really, we're kicking and screaming, we're pouring countless resources in to fight a "problem" that is probably never going to be resolved.

Second, aside from pure xenophobia and/or racism, I haven't heard a good argument yet for why we should try to stem the tide of immigrants in to this vast country of ours. You have to admit, that's part of the equation. Nobody would complain if a bunch of blond hair, blue eyed, English speaking Canadians were crossing the border en masse. So I think we need to be mature and ask ourselves if xenophobia is really a good enough reason to literally build a fence between ourselves and our neighbors.

No. Population migrations are a natural phenomenon. It's been going on forever. Massive governments and their laws and walls are artificial phenomenon. Nature will find a way.
 
We should abandon our silly and futile notion of trying to "seal the borders" and just "let the markets work," so to speak.
No. There should be a moratorium on immigration at least until every American who wants a job or education can get one. There should be no more work or student visas issued until we have full employment for our young people (~18-25) who are suffering the most from our current economic predicament.
 
Should we loosen the law, make it easier to get a visa, make it easier to become a citizen? Yes.
Should we just open the border? No.
 
No. There should be a moratorium on immigration at least until every American who wants a job or education can get one. There should be no more work or student visas issued until we have full employment for our young people (~18-25) who are suffering the most from our current economic predicament.

Why should Americans be entitled to such special treatment? If someone is smarter, hungrier, harder working, then they should be able to come in to this country and take the job. That's what keeps us on top.

We are a country of immigrants.
 
Should we loosen the law, make it easier to get a visa, make it easier to become a citizen? Yes.
Should we just open the border? No.
I can support that to a certain extent, such as letting illegal immigrants who came here when they were children who have lived here most of their lives get on the fast track to citizenship if they don't have any felonies on their record. I just think we should stop more new immigration for now.
 
Should we loosen the law, make it easier to get a visa, make it easier to become a citizen? Yes.
Should we just open the border? No.

I went to a top college, Duke, and there were many there who came from overseas. Many of the best and the brightest from around the world attend Duke. Many of my friends from overseas would have loved to have stayed and planted their roots in the United States, but, without corporate sponsorship, they were unable and had to return home.

That, my friend, is a travesty. A complete waste. We need smart and talented people, or simply people willing to work hard (and you don't get in to Duke unless you're willing to work hard), and what do we do? We send them home.
 
In theory I am for open borders. However, I just don't see it working if other countries don't open their borders as well.
 
People create jobs. And plus, immigrants are peaceful.

Jobs are not infinite. And, most immigrants may be peaceful, that doesn't mean ALL immigrants are peaceful. Try and avoid generalizations?
 
Jobs are not infinite. And, most immigrants may be peaceful, that doesn't mean ALL immigrants are peaceful. Try and avoid generalizations?

Actually, the job market is not fixed, but grows depending on demand. The idea is that we take useful people and don't take the bums.
 
Yes open your borders to us and let me in already, darn it!
 
I think at very least, if someone is willing and able to sustain themselves and provide one or two jobs for other Americans, they should be allowed in. The EB-5 visa (which requires a $1 million business investment plus the hiring of at least 10 staff) is simply unreasonable and impractical. I base the number of staff that I hire on the profitability of my business. If I have to hire 10 people now until I get a citizenship (even if the business can't sustain that many employees), by the time I get it I'll be broke and living off US welfare like my 10 newly unemployed staff members. Why not let me just hire 2 or 3 people, at least until we start to turn a profit, then take things from there? That way the jobs will be sustainable long after I get my citizenship, and I'm still contributing more to the economy than the average American in either scenario.
 
I think at very least, if someone is willing and able to sustain themselves and provide one or two jobs for other Americans, they should be allowed in. The EB-5 visa (which requires a $1 million business investment plus the hiring of at least 10 staff) is simply unreasonable and impractical. I base the number of staff that I hire on the profitability of my business. If I have to hire 10 people now until I get a citizenship (even if the business can't sustain that many employees), by the time I get it I'll be broke and living off US welfare like my 10 newly unemployed staff members. Why not let me just hire 2 or 3 people, at least until we start to turn a profit, then take things from there? That way the jobs will be sustainable long after I get my citizenship, and I'm still contributing more to the economy than the average American in either scenario.

We need people like you in this country. This is exactly why I take the position that I do, which is to say that anyone who is a net-contributor should be allowed permanent residency.
 
If we could trade some of our dregs for some people who actually want to do something with their lives...I'd be more willing to increase legal immigration.

Literally opening the borders would induce way too many security concerns.
 
We should abandon our silly and futile notion of trying to "seal the borders" and just "let the markets work," so to speak.

I stopped reading after that sentence.

It is plainly clear that you have no such position to speak from in regards to immigration, nor security for the American people for that matter, given your "profound" opening declaration.
 
We should abandon our silly and futile notion of trying to "seal the borders" and just "let the markets work," so to speak.

I think there should be two conditions that, if satisfied, should allow anyone and everyone to enter or exit the United States at will. First, do they have a job? If yes, then they are productive, and they should be allowed to stay. If not, is there someone willing to claim them as a dependent? Is there someone willing to feed, clothe, school them? If so, there is no reason to keep them out of the country. The second condition is that they don't have a criminal record.

Why not seal the border? Well, for one, futility. No matter what we do, people find ways to enter the country. So really, we're kicking and screaming, we're pouring countless resources in to fight a "problem" that is probably never going to be resolved.

Second, aside from pure xenophobia and/or racism, I haven't heard a good argument yet for why we should try to stem the tide of immigrants in to this vast country of ours. You have to admit, that's part of the equation. Nobody would complain if a bunch of blond hair, blue eyed, English speaking Canadians were crossing the border en masse. So I think we need to be mature and ask ourselves if xenophobia is really a good enough reason to literally build a fence between ourselves and our neighbors.

No. Population migrations are a natural phenomenon. It's been going on forever. Massive governments and their laws and walls are artificial phenomenon. Nature will find a way.
Way to go, Mr. Grimm! You're right on the money.
 
Why wouldn't they? More power and money for us, then.

People are a valuable resource.

It's like the people opposed to immigration don't get that. We are the direct beneficiaries of the brain drain going on in the rest of the world. And I'm not merely talking about the highly educated. I heartily welcome anybody with enough get-up-and-go to make the harrowing journey from gautemala or southern Mexico to come here and do back breaking labor. We need as many of those types of people as we can get!
 
We should abandon our silly and futile notion of trying to "seal the borders" and just "let the markets work," so to speak.

I think there should be two conditions that, if satisfied, should allow anyone and everyone to enter or exit the United States at will. First, do they have a job? If yes, then they are productive, and they should be allowed to stay. If not, is there someone willing to claim them as a dependent? Is there someone willing to feed, clothe, school them? If so, there is no reason to keep them out of the country. The second condition is that they don't have a criminal record.

Why not seal the border? Well, for one, futility. No matter what we do, people find ways to enter the country. So really, we're kicking and screaming, we're pouring countless resources in to fight a "problem" that is probably never going to be resolved.

Second, aside from pure xenophobia and/or racism, I haven't heard a good argument yet for why we should try to stem the tide of immigrants in to this vast country of ours. You have to admit, that's part of the equation. Nobody would complain if a bunch of blond hair, blue eyed, English speaking Canadians were crossing the border en masse. So I think we need to be mature and ask ourselves if xenophobia is really a good enough reason to literally build a fence between ourselves and our neighbors.

No. Population migrations are a natural phenomenon. It's been going on forever. Massive governments and their laws and walls are artificial phenomenon. Nature will find a way.

Its a national security hazard to have open borders. There are more then just people looking for jobs coming across the border. Drug smugglers, and potentially terrorists, are also free to sneak across an open border. Not to mention, its a case of respectability. No other country in the world lets citizens from another country walk all over the law like we do. Its appalling, illegal immigrants are well.... illegal. We should have a better system for allowing people to come here legally yes, but that's no reason to let people kick mud on the laws on the books.
 
We should abandon our silly and futile notion of trying to "seal the borders" and just "let the markets work," so to speak.

I think there should be two conditions that, if satisfied, should allow anyone and everyone to enter or exit the United States at will. First, do they have a job? If yes, then they are productive, and they should be allowed to stay. If not, is there someone willing to claim them as a dependent? Is there someone willing to feed, clothe, school them? If so, there is no reason to keep them out of the country. The second condition is that they don't have a criminal record.

Why not seal the border? Well, for one, futility. No matter what we do, people find ways to enter the country. So really, we're kicking and screaming, we're pouring countless resources in to fight a "problem" that is probably never going to be resolved.

Second, aside from pure xenophobia and/or racism, I haven't heard a good argument yet for why we should try to stem the tide of immigrants in to this vast country of ours. You have to admit, that's part of the equation. Nobody would complain if a bunch of blond hair, blue eyed, English speaking Canadians were crossing the border en masse. So I think we need to be mature and ask ourselves if xenophobia is really a good enough reason to literally build a fence between ourselves and our neighbors.

No. Population migrations are a natural phenomenon. It's been going on forever. Massive governments and their laws and walls are artificial phenomenon. Nature will find a way.

When e US CITIZENS can get a job in mexico, japan, CHina, and all the other places. THEN you can have your BS non-existant nation state.

But see when I was in Mexico, they deported the PROSTITUTES that were foreigners and replaced them with Mexicans..............now that is job security

Becasue it is ILLEGAL for any foreigner to work in mexico at ALL.
 
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Zero USA immigration
Deport all current foreign criminals
it is 100% ILLEGAL for any foreigner to work in USA
All USA tech at collages is a national security concern, all foreigners are banned from USA education.
you will remember that 10+ people building the CHina bomb were educated in USA, besides the current crop stealing our jobs.


That or USA CITIZENSHIP is meaning less.

oh, and enforce SECTION 274 of the INA to jail all the traitors that support "open borders" for supporting and encouraging
illegals in USA.
 
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We should abandon our silly and futile notion of trying to "seal the borders" and just "let the markets work," so to speak.

I think there should be two conditions that, if satisfied, should allow anyone and everyone to enter or exit the United States at will. First, do they have a job? If yes, then they are productive, and they should be allowed to stay. If not, is there someone willing to claim them as a dependent? Is there someone willing to feed, clothe, school them? If so, there is no reason to keep them out of the country. The second condition is that they don't have a criminal record.

Why not seal the border? Well, for one, futility. No matter what we do, people find ways to enter the country. So really, we're kicking and screaming, we're pouring countless resources in to fight a "problem" that is probably never going to be resolved.

Second, aside from pure xenophobia and/or racism, I haven't heard a good argument yet for why we should try to stem the tide of immigrants in to this vast country of ours. You have to admit, that's part of the equation. Nobody would complain if a bunch of blond hair, blue eyed, English speaking Canadians were crossing the border en masse. So I think we need to be mature and ask ourselves if xenophobia is really a good enough reason to literally build a fence between ourselves and our neighbors.

No. Population migrations are a natural phenomenon. It's been going on forever. Massive governments and their laws and walls are artificial phenomenon. Nature will find a way.

Because having a defined border and limited legal access to be considered a member of the country is what defined THE PHYSICAL COUNTRY.

Having no defined border - or one that is ignored entirely - is completely senseless.

And I don't think you realize that our border DOES provide us with the mean of protecting our selves - a line, on map or otherwise, of defined 'offense' - - and I"m not referring to 'regular old people' - I'm referring to larger entities such as businesses, government, militaries, and drug cartels.

You're thinking ONLY in regard to the regular old guys who want to do no harm - not everyone is a regular old guy doing no harm.
 
I think we should have more secure borders to control the flow of immigrants and smuggling, but otherwise I would be fine with anything that adds access to our nation to foreigners be they coming to visit, work, go to school, sight see, live, have their babies, get medical care, invest, breath free, etc. While it might drive down wages in certain industries like manufacturing, I think it would be a net positive in the long term for us and the world. I doubt politicians would ever do what I would do--remove the quota caps--but anything that moves in that direction is welcome to me.
 
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