View Poll Results: Israel or Palestine?

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  • Israel. The UN created it for a reason

    23 31.51%
  • Palestine. It was their land.

    18 24.66%
  • Israel, but the land the UN gave them when first made.

    15 20.55%
  • Other (post below)

    17 23.29%
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Thread: Israel and Palestine

  1. #81
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    Re: Israel and Palestine

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah
    I do realize that and appreciate your support Fantasea.
    Thanx for the education.

  2. #82
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    Re: Israel and Palestine

    I voted Palestine because they've been abused since day 1 they had to go up against tanks with rocks. But I truly believe that they should make Jeruselum a U.N. controled area and split the rest equally.
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  3. #83
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    Re: Israel and Palestine

    Quote Originally Posted by Che
    I voted Palestine because they've been abused since day 1 they had to go up against tanks with rocks. But I truly believe that they should make Jeruselum a U.N. controled area and split the rest equally.
    And with what would the UN control Israel?
    I will let no man drag me down so low as to make me hate him. - Booker T. Washington

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  4. #84
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    Re: Israel and Palestine

    Quote Originally Posted by V.I. Lenin
    Which one should own the land?


    It is amazing that some people cannot ever accept the; "right by conquest" to settle such matters, ..unless the ones who are victorious happen to be whom THEY want to see as legal owners.

    Ancient Assryia, Babylon, Persia, The Medes, The Romans etc....right up the the Ottoman Turks all controlled the area at one time, or another.

    We KNOW that Israel had a country, a government etc...& a real documented history, & a golden age, & was a MAJORITY in that area of land up until roughly 70 A.D. when the last great jewish diaspora at the hands of Rome's general Titus ended Israeli identity forever. As centuries before by Assryia, Babylon, & Persia who did the very same thing, ..only that Israel WAS able to recover itself.

    Jews were forcibly enslaved,..if not put to the sword first, & scattered throughtout many of those conquering countries as was the custom of those times, ..& many lost their identity through the ages, & were absorbed into other cultures. Many "illegally" remembered their heritage though, & the fortunes of war, which countries rose & fell gave them an opportunity to go back to the land of Israel, & re-settle.

    Unfortunatley for them, ..Rome did such a complete & thorough job of dismembering, & destroying Israel in 70 A.D., ..it basically became desolate, & the area was repopulated by non-jewish arab nomadic wandering tribes.

    The validity, or question of whether or not there ever was a legitimate nation, or country called; "Israel" is not even open to debate because those who conquered Israel were not shy about publicizing their conquests of Israel, ..& it is a fact of many of their ancient histories!

    In Israel today....many arabs resent Israeli archaeology from doing digs, because it only re-inforces the fact of Israeli existence which proves the ancient historical link of israeli existence in the land; ..something that misplaced nomadic non-jews do NOT want to be reminded of as it only reinforces Israeli claims by their roots!

    If anybody wishes to read a few excerpts of how distant relatives of the jews, (Idumeans)...treated their israeli relatives when Israel had suffered many invasions by foreign invaders, ..please refer to the old testament in "Obadiah" which was written well before the first century A.D.
    There is absolutely NO question as to whether or not Israel had a history, a territory & government & existence.

    Of course this was LONG before the existence of the religion of ISLAM which UNITED the arab peoples in their hate for Israel since its founding by Mohammed in the 7th century A.D., & its spreading to other ARab nations which only compounded the hate, & utter contempt that the arab countries continue to have towards their semetic brothers called; "Israel"!

    Truly....Ishmael has had his finger in Issac's eye since the time of Abraham. God had blessed the seed of Ishmael, ..BUT made his "covenant" with Issac's seed (Jacob); something that angers the Mohammedites to this very day.

    What we know about the word; "palestinian" is that it was an invented word overused by Arafat, ..among other jew hating muslims that was meant to imply that a people called "palestinians" were disposessed of their land, ..which of course is PURE FICTION as NOBODY'S land was taken away by any Israeli in 1948.

    The arab lust to destroy the new nation of Israel in 1948 called for the arabs living within palestine to leave the area so the surrounding arab nations could commence their wars upon Israel within 24 hours of the United Nations declaring statehood for Israel in may of 1948, ..which in fact DID HAPPEN as the very next day Israel WAS invaded.

    Israel wanted to live with all its neighbors in peace, & in fact welcomed any & all to live among them, ..& to this day ALLOWS any arab to be members of its "knesset", ...which SHOULD dispell any notions & charges of Israel seeking to destroy arab identity, or arab representation within the land of Israel.

    Israel is guilty of nothing, except where their remnant of their ancestors want to survive in their ''Promised" land in a sea of millions & millions of arab peoples in their former land whereas they made their covenant with their God millennia ago, LONG before Islam came along to mark them for death, destruction & world condemnation.
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  5. #85
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    Re: Israel and Palestine

    Quote Originally Posted by V.I. Lenin View Post
    Which one should own the land?
    Hi Lenin, where's your faggat lover? You can't throw me off this blog like you did yours. You quote from Troskii, bet you didn't know that his grand children learn in Israeli Yeshivas! British puke.

  6. #86
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    Re: Israel and Palestine

    Quote Originally Posted by Gandhi>Bush View Post
    And with what would the UN control Israel?
    The '48 vote only declared that a majority of member states favored Jewish Self Determination. The UN did not establish the Jewish State, Jews earned the state by fighting a winning their war of Independence. This absurd notion that the UN established the Jewish State makes about as much sense as the British burning the American Capital in the war of 1812 made the White House.
    True they Americans painted the burnt building which became their seat of public administration white. But the White House would mean nothing had the Americans lost the war of 1812 to the British.

  7. #87
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    Re: Israel and Palestine

    Quote Originally Posted by Gandhi>Bush View Post
    And with what would the UN control Israel?
    Quote Originally Posted by LeftyHenry View Post
    I voted Palestine because they've been abused since day 1 they had to go up against tanks with rocks. But I truly believe that they should make Jeruselum a U.N. controled area and split the rest equally.
    Another right wing reactionary who gets his info from newspapers. Makes a person just want to vomit, such ignorance. Poochy had the Arabs thrown the Jews into the Sea in '48 do you think those Arab states would have established a "Palestinian State"? Funny thing about these so called "Palestinians", they gained public recognition with Arafat's propaganda! Where's their historic currency. How come no such people existed when the Ottomans ruled the middle east!

    But this does not stop Poochy's like your self barking and linking all humanity of mankind unto the poor pathetic and abused Palestinians. Poochy right now a major world war which has killed some 6 million Africans is being fought in the Congo. The Congo, that's the same place where the Belgian King Leopold murdered countless millions in his day so he could profit from rubber production. Dog where's your bark.

  8. #88
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    Re: Israel and Palestine

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah View Post
    I do realize that and appreciate your support Fantasea.

    I expounded on your post mainly for the purpose of explaining that what on the surface may seem to be an unyielding principle (that high Arab birth rates will dilute and eventually abolish Jewish control of Israel via population demographics), is neither a viable truism nor an absolute commodity.

    Rather than being a democracy in the true ideological sense, Israel is actually a quasi-democracy and has no written Constitution. The guiding principles of Israel's conception and realization were deliniated in its initial statement of independence and soverignty. Israel is a Jewish state and shall remain a Jewish state. If additional legislation is required to ensure its ethnic composition and its longevity... then that shall be addressed in due course.


    Arabs and Palestinians cannot simply 'move in' to Israel. The border control points are highly regulated. I'll share with you a pertinint story...

    I have a personal and professional friend who lives in the United States and is an American citizen. Her name is Rana and she is of Palestinian decent. Rana has a Ph.D. in Religious Studies and holds the Religious Department chair at a major American university.

    A few months ago, Rana flew to Israel to visit extended family in the territories and spend a few days with me in Tel Aviv. Despite the fact that Rana is a highly educated American citizen and traveling on a valid American passport, she was subjected to intense scrutiny by Israeli security at Ben Gurion International Airport. The main problem was that she listed visiting family in Samaria (the West Bank) as her reason for visiting Israel. To make a long story short, my personal and direct intervention was required for Rana to negotiate the Israeli airport security, border control, and customs apparatus.

    As you can plainly deduce from this, Israel does not at all resemble France in this regard and does not extend either 'colonial citizenship' or 'right of return' status to ethnic Arabs and Palestinians. Although it may seem logical to assume that population demographics will eventually win the day for Arabists who harbor the illusion of victory through the Israeli electorate, it is precisely this electorate that precludes this notion from becoming a reality.
    Rather than being a democracy in the true ideological sense, Israel is actually a quasi-democracy and has no written Constitution.

    Establishing a Constitutional Government thats the focus of my political group.

  9. #89
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    Re: Israel and Palestine

    Quote Originally Posted by Fantasea View Post
    None of what you write is lost on the Arabs. But, their movement need not take the form of war.

    However, their goal remains, as does their patience. Simply encouraging and supporting a more rapid population growth among Palestinians, coupled with a 'relaxed' attitude toward peace could, in several generations, produce an imbalance which would simply overwhelm the Israeli populace by dilution.

    As the Japanese gained, through peaceful means, the share of the US that they could not gain by war, the Arabs may try the same tactic.
    Bad comparison. The Arabs view the Jewish state in the same vein as they did the Crusaders which they eventually expelled. Feudal european barbarians were aliens to the middle east. The comparison breaks down completely with the Jews. 3 Jewish kingdoms have ruled these lands. We as a people have a much stronger claim than do the post Mohamadean invaders who conquored a huge empire in times now dead. What offends the Arabs is their blatant hypocracy; its fine for them to conquor but evil for the Jews to do the same.

  10. #90
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    Re: Israel and Palestine

    Aleem poochy sit play dead roll over bark. That's a good pooch. Mohammed is really funny, his "Angel" was unaware that the Apostle Paul was a Jewish secret agent sent by the Sanhedrin to undermine the polytheistic Roman Empire. The "Angel" who dicktated the Koran was un-aware that Jesus was an imaginary man; the same technique was employed in the T'nach with the Book Of Job! Job also being an imaginary man. This technique of literature comes under "Aggaditah".
    Divide forment domestic political unrest, this technique the Maccabees employed against the Syrian Greeks when the Jews successfully rebeled against their attempts to impose a Greek Poltis culture upon Jerusalem. So when the Jews sought to revolt against the Romans, well one does not argue against success! Injecting a monotheistic religion into Roman polytheistic society society. Getting Romans to swear alligiance unto the "king of the Jews" rather than Ceasar as god.

    Ignorant fishermen not learned in the finer subtle Talmudic techniques of literature "believed" Stefens aggadatah of an imaginary man who died on the cross and who made atonement for sin and believe this aggadatah as occuring literally. The simple reading of the text, in hebrew called "Pashat", this root of this word is 3 letters. By re ordering these same three letters the word "fool" t'pesh is written. The ignorant fishermen of Galilee "believed" a t'pesh pashat of Stephen's aggaditah, originally designed to teach a key pharisee teaching: the resurrection of the dead, and to console the Jewish people who were enduring the political oppression of the Roman plebean governors. These villians sought to steal wealth from their conquored subjects so as to eventually return to Rome and buy their way into the patrician class.

    That Gabriel that enlightened Angel was unaware of this diplomatic strategem, reading the Koran makes me laugh at the Arab ignorance of believe in Mohammed's fantacies and visions.

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