View Poll Results: What is morality/

Voters
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  • a false concept

    5 7.04%
  • the laws of a particular society

    20 28.17%
  • the laws of God

    10 14.08%
  • the laws of nature

    9 12.68%
  • other

    27 38.03%
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Thread: morality

  1. #371
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post

    Libertarian?
    Yes, of course. "Libertarian" is classical liberal. Liberals in Poland or France are still called liberals. In America, the word was hijacked by social democrats.

  2. #372
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyrylek View Post
    Yes, of course. "Libertarian" is classical liberal. Liberals in Poland or France are still called liberals. In America, the word was hijacked by social democrats.
    Not from what I've seen. Maybe you should have a long talk with some of your fellow Libertarians.
    Mt. Rushmore: Three surveyors and some other guy.
    Life goes on within you and without you. -Harrison
    Hear the echoes of the centuries, Power isn't all that money buys. -Peart
    After you learn quantum mechanics you're never really the same again. -Weinberg

  3. #373
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyrylek View Post
    Before bringing its fruits, a project has to be started and has to gain momentum. J.S.Mill wrote The Subjection of Women in 1869 - the same year the Territory of Wyoming became the first polity in the world to grant women their right to vote. (Of course Condorcet advocated it some hundred years earlier)
    And how many centuries ago did some cultures consider slavery improper? It doesn't matter much what small groups do if the larger groups don't recognize it.
    Mt. Rushmore: Three surveyors and some other guy.
    Life goes on within you and without you. -Harrison
    Hear the echoes of the centuries, Power isn't all that money buys. -Peart
    After you learn quantum mechanics you're never really the same again. -Weinberg

  4. #374
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    zgoldsmith23's Avatar
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyrylek View Post
    Nope: because it is nonsensical. The notion of freedom unshared, freedom given to one individual but not another makes no sense. Liberty is not something you can have all to yourself. We could as well say that the Soviet Russia in 1937 was a free country, because the freedom of choice on whatever occasion was pretty much unimpeded - for Comrade Stalin.
    How does it make no sense? You can be have liberty all to yourself, as, by your own example, Stalin.
    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    I've never denied my own hackish tendencies
    Quote Originally Posted by Pin dÁr View Post
    scientific by itself isn't enough of course.
    Quote Originally Posted by blaxshep View Post
    Not all Nazis were bad people

  5. #375
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post
    Not from what I've seen. Maybe you should have a long talk with some of your fellow Libertarians.
    Why are you using the capital letter "L"? Don't tell me you think that all classical liberals in America are affiliated with the Libertarian (rather: Radical Infantile) Party.

  6. #376
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post
    It doesn't matter much what small groups do if the larger groups don't recognize it.
    There is such thing as progress. Slavery was a norm at some point, now we see it as a horror. Kidnapping - sorry, drafting involuntarily - young men for military service was a norm; we don't do it anymore. We are about to end the discrimination of gays, and perhaps persecution for victimless "crimes" will stop in our lifetimes. Coercive taxation will take a bit longer.

    It always starts with "small groups".
    Last edited by Cyrylek; 05-11-13 at 03:23 AM.

  7. #377
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    How does it make no sense? You can be have liberty all to yourself, as, by your own example, Stalin.
    Liberty is a mode of interaction between people. A dictator gets whatever he wants not because he is free, but because he is at the tip of the pyramid of slavery.
    Last edited by Cyrylek; 05-11-13 at 03:23 AM.

  8. #378
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyrylek View Post
    There is such thing as progress. Slavery was a norm at some point, now we see it as a horror. Kidnapping - sorry, drafting involuntarily - young men for military service was a norm; we don't do it anymore. We are about to end the discrimination of gays, and perhaps persecution for victimless "crimes" will stop in our lifetimes. Coercive taxation will take a bit longer.

    It always starts with "small groups".
    The trouble is, it often ends with them, too. I'm not holding my breath on SSM - nor the draft. I've seen that in MY lifetime and was almost in line for it. Luckily, Tricky Dicky & Co decided we'd had enough before I turned 18. Sorry, but I don't call 40 years ago "not doing it anymore". It's not like it couldn't be done again very easily.
    Mt. Rushmore: Three surveyors and some other guy.
    Life goes on within you and without you. -Harrison
    Hear the echoes of the centuries, Power isn't all that money buys. -Peart
    After you learn quantum mechanics you're never really the same again. -Weinberg

  9. #379
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post
    The trouble is, it often ends with them, too.
    For every lasting success, there are many temporary failures. What else is new?

    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post
    Luckily, Tricky Dicky & Co decided we'd had enough before I turned 18.
    See - that's the problem. People remember Nixon, because it "happened under him". And the role libertarians (i.e. actual liberals) had played is for "history buffs".....

    "Milton Friedman? - you mean, the economist?"

    "Melvin Laird? Never heard of him".
    Last edited by Cyrylek; 05-11-13 at 03:42 AM.

  10. #380
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyrylek View Post
    Liberty is a mode of interaction between people. A dictator gets whatever he wants not because he is free, but because he is at the tip of the pyramid of slavery.
    But he still has liberty all to himself.
    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    I've never denied my own hackish tendencies
    Quote Originally Posted by Pin dÁr View Post
    scientific by itself isn't enough of course.
    Quote Originally Posted by blaxshep View Post
    Not all Nazis were bad people

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