View Poll Results: What is morality/

Voters
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  • a false concept

    5 7.04%
  • the laws of a particular society

    20 28.17%
  • the laws of God

    10 14.08%
  • the laws of nature

    9 12.68%
  • other

    27 38.03%
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Thread: morality

  1. #261
    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: morality

    had to vote other because its different for everybody

    the fact is morals are subjective

    for me it may be MY god, society,nature
    for you it might be, YOUR god, nature
    for someone else it might be Family, Nature , Society
    and then all those things are different to everyone
    etc etc etc

    they are made up based on where you choose or were taught to recognize them from
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  2. #262
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post
    Can you present any kind of evidence where something is and always has been morally wrong throughout all of human history? My bet is, you can't. Somewhere at some time whatever it might be you think is universal was against the "natural order of things" for some culture.
    Some things boil down to core values. What I feel in my heart doesn't require evidence. I feel in my heart that objective morality exists. If your morals apply to others, they aren't just your morals.
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

  3. #263
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyrylek View Post
    No, I don't. I am saying that "fairness" is subjective, and cannot be a cornerstone of morality. Let's stick with the axiomatic value of life and of freedom of choice.
    Of course fairness is subjective but no more than the concept of law, morality or freedom of choice. Fairness implies equitable treatment dictated by reason, conscience, and free from self-interest, or preference in judgment. Almost all of society is based on the concept of fair treatment enforced by the legal system.
    Einstein, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

  4. #264
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    Re: morality

    I messed up this thread by not distinguishing between subjective and objective morality, so I started a new thread.

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/philos...-morality.html
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

  5. #265
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    Re: morality

    "Death: Humans need fantasy to *be* human. To be the place where the falling angel meets the rising ape.

    Susan: With tooth fairies? Hogfathers?

    Death: Yes. As practice, you have to start out learning to believe the little lies.

    Susan: So we can believe the big ones?

    Death: Yes. Justice, mercy, duty. That sort of thing.

    Susan: They're not the same at all.

    Death: You think so? Then take the universe and grind it down to the finest powder, and sieve it through the finest sieve, and then show me one atom of justice, one molecule of mercy. And yet, you try to act as if there is some ideal order in the world. As if there is some, some rightness in the universe, by which it may be judged."

    That about sums it up.
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    scientific by itself isn't enough of course.
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  6. #266
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by MoSurveyor View Post
    Can you present any kind of evidence where something is and always has been morally wrong throughout all of human history?.
    Do we agree that humans - objectively, universally and distinctively - are sentient, and possess volition and the ability to make choices?

    Do we agree that whatever particulars one or the other moral system may embrace, making choices is central to the very notion of morality - and to the very fabric of human experience?

    Do we agree that an individual (a grown, mentally competent adult, at any rate) who is denied his freedom of choice is being wronged, whatever his choices are, if they do no harm to other individuals?

    If you answer yes to all three - there you go. Coercion is and always had been morally wrong, ever since the dawn of human sapience.

  7. #267
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyrylek View Post
    Do we agree that humans - objectively, universally and distinctively - are sentient, and possess volition and the ability to make choices
    No.

    Do we agree that whatever particulars one or the other moral system may embrace, making choices is central to the very notion of morality - and to the very fabric of human experience?
    I suppose.

    Do we agree that an individual (a grown, mentally competent adult, at any rate) who is denied his freedom of choice is being wronged, whatever his choices are, if they do no harm to other individuals?
    No.

    If you answer yes to all three - there you go. Coercion is and always had been morally wrong, ever since the dawn of human sapience.
    Just because it was doesn't mean it is and vice versa.
    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    I've never denied my own hackish tendencies
    Quote Originally Posted by Pin dÁr View Post
    scientific by itself isn't enough of course.
    Quote Originally Posted by blaxshep View Post
    Not all Nazis were bad people

  8. #268
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    Of course fairness is subjective but no more than the concept of law, morality or freedom of choice..
    Freedom of choice is not subjective at all. It is an observable reality of human condition, along with such features as memory, instinctual urges or ability for abstract thinking. Morality centered on freedom of choice is not subjective either.

  9. #269
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by zgoldsmith23 View Post
    No.



    I suppose.
    You don't believe that humans have the ability to make choices, but agree that making choices is central to the human experience?

    Fascinating.

  10. #270
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    Re: morality

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyrylek View Post
    You don't believe that humans have the ability to make choices, but agree that making choices is central to the human experience?

    Fascinating.
    They don't objectively have the ability to make choices. It's also not distinctive. Other animals make choices, too.
    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    I've never denied my own hackish tendencies
    Quote Originally Posted by Pin dÁr View Post
    scientific by itself isn't enough of course.
    Quote Originally Posted by blaxshep View Post
    Not all Nazis were bad people

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