View Poll Results: McCarthyism should be promoted in America

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  • No

    43 86.00%
  • Yes

    6 12.00%
  • What's McCarthyism?

    1 2.00%
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Thread: McCarthyism

  1. #11
    Count Smackula
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    Re: McCarthyism

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyrylek View Post
    I couldn't agree more.

    But let's have a reality check here: The "victims" of McCarthyism could lose their jobs. The victims of Stalinism were guaranteed to lose their lives - the same goes for their relatives, co-workers and (suspected) sympathizers.

    Don't we 'lose the war' the moment we forget what the 'war' is all about, the moment we abandon the sense of proportion, in our moral judgment?

    No, it is not healthy, not normal, not rational, to look for a Stalinist - or , say, Jihadist - infiltrator under every bed. But if it will save an innocent life - or a hundred of innocent lives - to hell with health, normalcy and rationality, honestly.

    Real people do matter. Abstractions - however noble-sounding - are of limited use.
    The amount of lives saved because of McCarthyism was zero. Fear and prejudice don't protect people, they hurt them. The amount of times in history that a persecuted minority rose up and destroyed a nation are almost non-existent, the amount of time they have been oppressed by majorities (especially once deemed a "threat") are endless.

  2. #12
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    Re: McCarthyism

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    But the 1950s are not the times we face today. Muslims terrorists cannot bring down the West.
    Exactly. Still, aren't you inclined, at least on the emotional level and to some degree, to understand (if not justify) the current "paranoia"? Don't you feel - for a moment at least - that the FBI was not paranoid enough, when it received the Russian warning about Tamerlan Tsarnoev, did a perfunctory interview - and excused itself from the picture?


    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    And fiscal responsibility. And the Constitution. And the thousands of people we infringe upon who pose absolutely no threat..
    You don't have to tell me. I am a libertarian. I "stand with Rand", and I would "stand" with Margaret Chase Smith if it were 1950.

    But before issuing a summary condemnation, we need to understand. Did McCarthyism go too far and do harm? Absolutely. Was it an overreaction to a real, serious threat? Also - yes.

    (By the way, why is it always "McCarthyism", and not "Trumanism" or "Martinism"? The Executive Order 9835 dates to 1947).
    Last edited by Cyrylek; 04-23-13 at 08:56 AM.

  3. #13
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    Re: McCarthyism

    Quote Originally Posted by rathi View Post
    . The amount of times in history that a persecuted minority rose up and destroyed a nation are almost non-existent.
    Almost being the key word. Two "persecuted minorities" - the Bolsheviks in Russia and the Nazis in Germany - representing rare but rather significant exceptions.

  4. #14
    Sage


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    Re: McCarthyism

    Small amounts of certain poisons have a beneficial effect when used to treat specific ailments. Larger amounts of the same substance have predictably fatal results.

  5. #15
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    Re: McCarthyism

    I guess I need to clarify my position:

    Let's deal with our current situation without dragging in the dubious historical parallels.

    Yes, it is appalling that Charlie Chaplin and Paul Robeson were blacklisted. Should not have happened in a free country. But imagine that some public figure in America writes an equivalent of To You My Beloved Comrade (the Robeson's epitaph to Stalin) for Osama bin Laden.

    Your reaction?

    And Osama had killed about as many innocent people as Stalin was killing per day during the Great Terror.

  6. #16
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    Re: McCarthyism

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Recently a poster argued to me that what amounted to McCarthyism was a good thing.

    Who agrees?
    Cripe - why does the one yes vote not surprise me.

    McCarthyism was a prime example where people did not think for themselves, but allowed judgements to be made by others based solely on stupid labeling, fear, paranoia, and ignorance.

    I am embarrassed that many Americans back then did not have the spine to stand up someone who was obviously a bully and a liar, but chose to follow the masses who followed him brainlessly and without question.

    Most folks knew that McCarthy was wrong, but still allowed his power to increase.

    I detest people who do not think for themselves, and allow others to manipulate them - it is pathetic and weak.
    Greatness lies not in being strong, but in the right use of strength - Henry Ward Beecher
    Baby sister, I was born game and I intend to go out that way - Rooster Cogburn

  7. #17
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    Re: McCarthyism

    he was a zealot. zealots deal more in emotion than in logic.

  8. #18
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    Re: McCarthyism

    Absolutely it should.

    However, I think that pursuing it in the methods that McCarthy used would not be a good thing. An anti-socialism campaign highlighting socialism, demonizing what socialism has done/what it can lead to and not protecting socialist if people choose to not employ them or choose to not to give them goods and services would definitely be a good thing. Maybe at least a "social studies" class every two years for school students with a module highlighting the bad of socialism would definitely be a good thing. However, how exactly we could do it when socialist currently control the Senate and the White House, I'm not for sure, maybe good freedom loving communities could start it at the local levels.
    Only a fool measures equality by results and not opportunities.

  9. #19
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    Re: McCarthyism

    McCarthyism is defined as accusations of Communist activities without evidence.

    Liberals start nonsensical, irrelevant threads like this so that they can pursue their anti-American activities without criticism.

    McCarthy was NOT connected with the House Unamerican Activities Committee, which developed the blacklists and exposed the Hollywood Communists.

    Today there is overwhelming evidence of the evil intent and activities of the anti-American socialist globalists throughout our society and government and academia, yet no one speaks out against these destructive forces. If one even hints at such a thing, the loons bleat "McCarthyism" in order to silence their American critics.

    Today there should be no sympathy for the destructive forces of Liberalism leading to it's beloved nanny state Socialism in order to destroy the goodness of the former greatest country in the world. McCarthy would be a hero today now that his worst fears have come true throughout America.

  10. #20
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    Re: McCarthyism

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyrylek View Post
    Exactly. Still, aren't you inclined, at least on the emotional level and to some degree, to understand (if not justify) the current "paranoia"? Don't you feel - for a moment at least - that the FBI was not paranoid enough, when it received the Russian warning about Tamerlan Tsarnoev, did a perfunctory interview - and excused itself from the picture?
    I get it. I just don't feel it's worth trading liberty for security. I do not want a USSR style secret police in America. It disturbs me to a amount I, as a licensed CPA cannot count to, that "conservatives" are promoting. The FBI doesn't have the resources to track everyone who holds beliefs that we may find dangerous. We budget resources based on who has the skills, motive, beliefs and capacity to be a threat. Otherwise, some people here would be on spy lists. Recently a user has made it clear that he believed the state backing of mass raping and murdering of children is less bad (and even necessary) then hanging around decades ago with a low level terrorist who frankly wasn't much of a threat to the country. HOLY ****. That should earn you a spot on the list for domestic spying purely under beliefs. Now, I don't think he should be on the list, even if I think he's arguably the most morally and ethically corrupt person on the board.

    You don't have to tell me. I am a libertarian. I "stand with Rand", and I would "stand" with Margaret Chase Smith if it were 1950.

    But before issuing a summary condemnation, we need to understand. Did McCarthyism go too far and do harm? Absolutely. Was it an overreaction to a real, serious threat? Also - yes.

    (By the way, why is it always "McCarthyism", and not "Trumanism" or "Martinism"? The Executive Order 9835 dates to 1947).
    I dunno. Good question.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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