View Poll Results: Is the world a better place without Saddam Hussein?

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  • Yes

    87 70.16%
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Thread: Is the world a better place without Saddam Hussein?

  1. #1021
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    Re: Is the world a better place without Saddam Hussein?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    Your faith in their accuracy exceeds mine. I have said all I can. I await the eventual public airing of this matter with, in the words of Mark Twain, "the calm confidence of a Christian holding four aces." Be well.

    Umm, the "public airing" of this already occurred. Regrettably, based on the nonsense you've been posting -- it appears you missed it.

    But you are well-armed with talking points, I'll grant you that.

  2. #1022
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    Re: Is the world a better place without Saddam Hussein?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    What a pity that reality doesn't conform to your hallucinations ....

    New team, technology heading to Iraq

    An advance logistical team for the U.N. Monitoring, Verification and Inspection Commission, or UNMOVIC, is scheduled to arrive Monday in Baghdad.
    That is from 2002, just like in my link. So what are you talking about?

    From my link:

    Prior to the March 2003 U.S.-led invasion of Iraq, the UN Security Council adopted Resolution 1441 in November 2002 giving Iraq a “final opportunity” to comply with its disarmament requirements under previous Security Council resolutions. At issue was Iraq’s failure to provide an adequate accounting of its prohibited weapons programs or to convince UN inspectors that its weapons of mass destruction had been destroyed as Baghdad claimed.

    UN weapons inspectors worked in Iraq from November 27, 2002 until March 18, 2003. During that time, inspectors from the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) and the United Nations Monitoring, Verification, and Inspections Commission (UNMOVIC) conducted more than 900 inspections at more than 500 sites. The inspectors did not find that Iraq possessed chemical or biological weapons or that it had reconstituted its nuclear weapons program.

    Although Iraq was cooperative on what inspectors called “process”—allowing inspectors access to suspected weapons sites, for example—it was only marginally cooperative in answering the questions surrounding its weapons programs. Unable to resolve its differences with Security Council members who favored strengthening and continuing weapons inspections, the United States abandoned the inspections process and initiated the invasion of Iraq on March 19.

  3. #1023
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    Re: Is the world a better place without Saddam Hussein?

    Quote Originally Posted by pbrauer View Post
    That is true, but it just points to the fact, that we haven't had any further physical intelligence, all we've had is speculation.

    please watch and listen to the following video:

    Okay, that's one 56-second quote. Here are some more of her quotes. Do you think she was lying? And Colin Powell too? So, the whole administration was lying, except for the democrat politicians right? They didn't know anything right?

    Iraq Statements by Former National Security Advisor Condoleezza Rice - US - Iraq War - ProCon.org

  4. #1024
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    Re: Is the world a better place without Saddam Hussein?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    Not really. Had Hussein really had the WMD for which Bush invaded, the U.N. would have found and destroyed them as they had done years earlier.

    It still would have saved us:

    over 35,000 American casualties

    as much as 2 trillion dollars

    the unjustifiable deaths of at least 100,000 Iraqis
    You would hope anyway.

  5. #1025
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    Re: Is the world a better place without Saddam Hussein?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    Your faith in their accuracy exceeds mine. I have said all I can. I await the eventual public airing of this matter with, in the words of Mark Twain, "the calm confidence of a Christian holding four aces." Be well.
    I also look forward to the public airing of the lead up to this whole sorry affair.

    The Chilcott inquiry, which will be released later this year will provide some interesting reading, and in Australia, only a few weeks ago a former Defence Department Secretary stated that an inquiry into how Australia became involved in the Iraq War would expose the fragility of the decision making process.

    the whistleblowers have already revealed that public opinion was manipulated by those who misrepresented information ... but it looks like there is more ....
    Every political good carried to the extreme must be productive of evil.

  6. #1026
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    Re: Is the world a better place without Saddam Hussein?

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post

    That is from 2002, just like in my link. So what are you talking about?
    You said, "obviously, inspectors had not been there since [2002]."

    I postsed a new article to show what complete and utter bullxit that is. Do you still not understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post

    From my link:

    Prior to the March 2003 U.S.-led invasion of Iraq, the UN Security Council adopted Resolution 1441 in November 2002 giving Iraq a “final opportunity” to comply with its disarmament requirements under previous Security Council resolutions. At issue was Iraq’s failure to provide an adequate accounting of its prohibited weapons programs or to convince UN inspectors that its weapons of mass destruction had been destroyed as Baghdad claimed.

    UN weapons inspectors worked in Iraq from November 27, 2002 until March 18, 2003. During that time, inspectors from the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) and the United Nations Monitoring, Verification, and Inspections Commission (UNMOVIC) conducted more than 900 inspections at more than 500 sites. The inspectors did not find that Iraq possessed chemical or biological weapons or that it had reconstituted its nuclear weapons program.

    Although Iraq was cooperative on what inspectors called “process”—allowing inspectors access to suspected weapons sites, for example—it was only marginally cooperative in answering the questions surrounding its weapons programs. Unable to resolve its differences with Security Council members who favored strengthening and continuing weapons inspections, the United States abandoned the inspections process and initiated the invasion of Iraq on March 19.
    The page you linked only went up to September, 2002. So who knows what page you're reading that from, but it wasn't from the one you linked; which in fact, does not contain any of that.

    what else ya got?

  7. #1027
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    Re: Is the world a better place without Saddam Hussein?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    Better than you, I suspect.
    if so, you may also have a lot invested in dismissing what I say.

    far more than I have invested in this matter.
    Every political good carried to the extreme must be productive of evil.

  8. #1028
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    Re: Is the world a better place without Saddam Hussein?

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    Errors all around then. He underestimated the stupidity of GW Bush. A lot of Americans did that too.
    Yes, we did.

    Cheney, Wolfowitz, and Rumsfeld did knew the president well, however, and had no problems manipulating him and the Congress towards the war that they wanted all along.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

  9. #1029
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    Re: Is the world a better place without Saddam Hussein?

    Is the world a better place without Saddam Hussein?
    “The infrastructure, and the services … were bad, but now it is even worse.”

    Unemployment stands at 15 percent and youth unemployment at 30 percent, according to the United Nations Development Program (UNDP). Twenty-three percent of the population lives in extreme hunger, it adds.


    “Iraq faces considerable challenges in sanitation,” according to a 2010 U.N. report. Only 26 percent of household are covered by the public sewage network, it added.


    About two-thirds of homes depend on the public water supply as their primary source for drinking water, but a quarter of these reported that they got potable water for under two hours per day, according to the Special Inspector General for Iraq Reconstruction’s January 2012 report.


    Electricity is the worst-rated service in Iraq, according to the Iraq Knowledge Network, a monitoring system set up by the country’s planning ministry. Households get on average 7.6 hours of electricity from the national grid per day, it said.

    Medical services leave much to be desired. In the region, only Yemen has a higher infant mortality rate, for example. Malaria, however, has been almost eliminated, according to the U.N.



    “Maybe Iran has benefited more than any other country from what has happened, and some people even say America handed Iraq to Iran. But don’t forget the Iranian regime has had relations with all the Iraqi political forces when they were in the opposition, so this relation has continued after Saddam was toppled.”


    Maria Fantappie, Iraq analyst, International Crisis Group:
    “Iran's influence, and that of other powers, is directly proportional to the level of instability of the Iraqi government. Potential for Iranian influence increases the moment there is an unstable situation in Baghdad.”



    And according to reports, Iran helped persuade the government of Nouri al-Maliki to deny American forces judicial immunity against prosecution. Western countries then canceled plans to maintain a military presence in the country after the 2011 withdrawal.


    The links go beyond the political and military: Iranian companies are increasing market share in Iraq’s booming economy, and streams of Iranian pilgrims regularly visit the Shiite holy sites in Karbala and Najaf.


    This is a far cry from the 1980s, when the two countries fought a war that killed more than a million people

    Peter Batchelor, country director, United Nations Development Program in Iraq:
    “Quality of life and access to services in many areas are worse than they were 30 years ago. Violence has dropped, but it is still high enough that it limits people’s access to services.”

    Meanwhile, Iraq remains one of the most corrupt countries in the world. According to Transparency International’s widely recognized rankings, the country came 169th out of a list of 176."

    Iraq, 10 years on: Did invasion bring 'hope and progress' to millions as Bush vowed? - World News








    Amnesty International Middle East and North Africa Deputy Director Hassiba Hadj Sahraoui:
    “Iraq remains caught in a cycle of torture and impunity that should long ago have been broken.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  10. #1030
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    Re: Is the world a better place without Saddam Hussein?

    [QUOTE=Catawba;1061634122]
    “The infrastructure, and the services … were bad, but now it is even worse.”

    Unemployment stands at 15 percent and youth unemployment at 30 percent, according to the United Nations Development Program (UNDP). Twenty-three percent of the population lives in extreme hunger, it adds.


    “Iraq faces considerable challenges in sanitation,” according to a 2010 U.N. report. Only 26 percent of household are covered by the public sewage network, it added.


    About two-thirds of homes depend on the public water supply as their primary source for drinking water, but a quarter of these reported that they got potable water for under two hours per day, according to the Special Inspector General for Iraq Reconstruction’s January 2012 report.


    Electricity is the worst-rated service in Iraq, according to the Iraq Knowledge Network, a monitoring system set up by the country’s planning ministry. Households get on average 7.6 hours of electricity from the national grid per day, it said.

    Medical services leave much to be desired. In the region, only Yemen has a higher infant mortality rate, for example. Malaria, however, has been almost eliminated, according to the U.N.



    “Maybe Iran has benefited more than any other country from what has happened, and some people even say America handed Iraq to Iran. But don’t forget the Iranian regime has had relations with all the Iraqi political forces when they were in the opposition, so this relation has continued after Saddam was toppled.”


    Maria Fantappie, Iraq analyst, International Crisis Group:
    “Iran's influence, and that of other powers, is directly proportional to the level of instability of the Iraqi government. Potential for Iranian influence increases the moment there is an unstable situation in Baghdad.”
    This is totally normal after a war. Do you honestly think that immediately following a war a country is going to be booming and doing well? PLEASE tell me that you are aware that recovery takes time. If you are not aware of that fact then you probably shouldn't be posting on this subject. You seem very young with a naive world view, so maybe that's what it is with you.


    And according to reports, Iran helped persuade the government of Nouri al-Maliki to deny American forces judicial immunity against prosecution. Western countries then canceled plans to maintain a military presence in the country after the 2011 withdrawal.


    The links go beyond the political and military: Iranian companies are increasing market share in Iraq’s booming economy, and streams of Iranian pilgrims regularly visit the Shiite holy sites in Karbala and Najaf.


    This is a far cry from the 1980s, when the two countries fought a war that killed more than a million people

    Peter Batchelor, country director, United Nations Development Program in Iraq:
    “Quality of life and access to services in many areas are worse than they were 30 years ago. Violence has dropped, but it is still high enough that it limits people’s access to services.”

    Meanwhile, Iraq remains one of the most corrupt countries in the world. According to Transparency International’s widely recognized rankings, the country came 169th out of a list of 176."

    Iraq, 10 years on: Did invasion bring 'hope and progress' to millions as Bush vowed? - World News
    Again, refer to above, and about Iranians making a pilgrimage into Iraq, that's a GOOD thing right? Neighbors getting along and NOT killing one another indiscriminately?

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