Yes. Having children is a moral obligation to God/society/family/etc.
No, they are free not to have children. They don't have to answer to anybody
Not if they have reproductive problems.
Yes, even if they have reproductive problems. They can adopt, you know.
They should get a medal for lowering world population.
I don't know.
I'm a little too late in the years to regret having the kids. They are grown and out of the house. And I will say honestly that there has always been some regret on them but it was more directed at the years wasted with their mother and not the kids themselves. However, I will won't ever say that it is an impossibility for that deep terrible regret to descend upon me. While I doubt it, much as I doubt that Ocean will change her mind, it is still possible. I at least can acknowledge the difference between possibility and probability. Logan's Law #1: Nothing is impossible, merely highly improbable. So then the question remains, can you and/or Ocean accept that it is possible, while being highly improbable, that something could occur that might cause you to change your minds?
Bi, Poly, Switch. I'm not indecisive, I'm greedy!
"Inferior" and "superior" are not the right words.
I believe it is fair to state that GOOD parents do more for the long term future of the country than those who do not have children, but BAD parents can do more harm.
The future of the country depends upon GOOD parents as their children are the future of the country.
"The hand that rocks the cradle rules the world."
You're not "in the next tribe", you're part of this tribe (American society) as you've just admitted. But if you want to follow that logic, why would "some random chick from the next tribe over" give a **** about what the people in this tribe are saying? Yet here you are, complaining about the things people say.
"Murder" (as in unacceptable killing) may have been rare but not killing or violence in general. Your "gentle savage" is an illusion. There were DMZ's between tribes long before modern warfare. They go clear back to when we were using sticks with fire hardened points as weapons.
Our unique and main survival mechanism is tool making. If you can't skin an animal and figure a way to wear it's pelt, then you don't survive the cold of the North. If you don't know how to carry some kind of shade around with you, then you don't survive the desert. If you don't have a weapon of some kind, the cat stands a much better chance of killing you. You just might be able to drive him away with a sharp stick or fire. Tool making is why we inhabit the huge variety of climates and ecosystems we do. Your "social flexibility" (what little we have, if any) is useless without it.
Normally we get along fine and we agree on virtually everything in this area of conversation (we agree now, too, for that matter) but this time you've gone over the edge. It's obvious that, for whatever reason, you're very emotionally involved in this topic - even more so than normal. I can understand that (I'm not making an excuse for you, either) but it does nothing to promote rational conversation. I'm sure we'll still be on the same side the next time, too, I just hope you'll keep your cool a little better and not throw around baseless accusations.
Last edited by MoSurveyor; 03-21-14 at 12:50 AM.
Mt. Rushmore: Three surveyors and some other guy.
Life goes on within you and without you. -Harrison
Hear the echoes of the centuries, Power isn't all that money buys. -Peart
After you learn quantum mechanics you're never really the same again. -Weinberg
And since you have probably only 'experienced' a tiny fraction of them, then you cannot know how 'rewarding and satisfying' they all are.
You maybe right, but you cannot know it, you can only believe it.
'What kind of sick and twisted toy factory is this?'
'We are all the sum of our tears. Too little and the ground is not fertile, and nothing can grow there. Too much, the best of us is washed away.'
"Better to be dead and cool, than alive and uncool."
Childfree women can get some really abusive **** hurled at them. And it takes something that used to just kind of be background noise to us (we realized one day we won't have kids, and there ya go) and turns it into something that makes us feel like we're constantly under attack -- because some of us actually are. I've had people wish ill health on me and had a family member I was being punished by god for not wanting kids.
If you read Ocean's posts, she indicates she's in her 40's or so. She's not a spring chicken. I'm actually the youngest childfree person in this thread, if not the youngest on DP.
I do not think there is anything that would change my mind that would not also change my personality. And like I said, in such a case, I am glad I am already sterile.
Last edited by SmokeAndMirrors; 03-21-14 at 04:09 AM.
It isn't that I care what people say. It's that I view it as an outgrowth of oppressive social control and sometimes misogyny, so I make an effort to advocate against it simply on the principle of the matter.
Actually violence was relatively rare. We don't see it spike until the earlier forms of agriculture appear. I actually saw a documentary about one of these tribes that still exists, and it was interesting because one of the main women being interviewed was cheating on her husband and everyone knew it. What did he do? Nothing.
What little social flexibility we have? You're kidding, right? Human societies can't even agree on how many genders there are, or whether eating animals is right. We have as much social flexibility as it is possible for any organism to have.
There is nothing rational about this weird form of social darwinism promoted by people who know nothing about sociology or anthropology.
I've lost count of how many times I pointed out that I enjoy my life more BECAUSE I don't have children -- or husband either -- so why would I want to change that? The answer is simple; I DON'T want to change it, and have no intention of doing so. Since I have no intention of getting married either, the idea that I would "meet someone who could change my attitude about kids" is just a WISH in those people's minds. And as we all know, just because someone makes a wish doesn't mean that wish will come true.