View Poll Results: Have Americans become greedy little spoiled scum bags.

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Thread: America land of the glutinous

  1. #41
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    Re: America land of the glutinous

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyrylek View Post
    There was a point in my life when I could easily hire a maid to clean my bathroom - or buy $200 sneakers. Neither thought had ever occured to me. Nothing against quality footware - it's just that I would rather have books and tools, for the same money. And I am perfectly capable of handling a brush and a Chlorox bottle, whether I make $10/hr or $1000/hr...

    Granted, I may be not a typical upper-middle class American - a first-generation immigrant, as a matter of fact, naturalized in 1988.

    But in all my American experience, I haven't actually met too many native-born Americans who would fit the "greedy little spoiled scum bags" label.

    Mostly I've met decent, hardworking people. Sure, many of them are easy marks for cynical politicians, many of them are pretty ignorant (especially those who think that having some formal education means automatically that they are not), many of them appear to be conditioned to worship the collectivist idols...all true.

    But this is nothing like a truly ruined, mortally wounded society. Trust me, it is not. I've lived there.
    To the last sentence, do you think we're on our way soon or far from it?
    Einstein, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

  2. #42
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    Re: America land of the glutinous

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    It wasn't just domestic corporations but many that started here are international with offices in every major city. Unfortunately free trade was the next market evolution for continued growth. Any country that tries to become an island like Russia and China did, stagnate. Our politicians knew we'd take a hit but we also prospered some from larger trade agreements. I've said it before and will again we're a victim of our own success. We heated up the worlds economy to a pace of unsustainable growth, largely due to excessive credit that came back and bit us when the inevitable defaults started.

    If we don't allow the markets to realize a closer to real value instead of a hyper inflated, nominal one the interest rates are going to go up and cause another crash. They're just kicking the can further and further down the road for now.
    It's not a choice between globalism or island. To begin with, a fiscally responsible approach to globalism would have required the wealthy to pay higher taxes directly in proportion to the acquired profits (because maintaining the military and diplomatic corps that enables globalism is expensive, both privately and publicly) while relaxing the tax burden on the lower and middle incomes to compensate for the loss of jobs and wages, which would have assisted in keeping some lower middle class families above the poverty line and away from dependence on welfare. Common sense that should have been a huge part of our approach to globalism from the very beginning, but something that in thirty years we have gotten barely any traction on, due to whatever pretense the economic elite could trot out to discourage the public from demanding it and the government from implementing it.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 02-27-13 at 10:03 PM.
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

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  3. #43
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    Re: America land of the glutinous

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    To the last sentence, do you think we're on our way soon or far from it?
    The slippery slope is always there. Are we , as a society, passively sliding down, to hell? No, we are not. All the ridicule apart (much of it well-deserved), the tea-party movement is something pretty much unimaginable in a society of spolied brats and brainwashed zombies. And (although I cannot help but cringe at the sheer stupidity of most of its manifestations) the Occupy-this-and-that carnival is also a sign of life - perhaps not "intelligent life", but life nevertheless.

    We'll be OK. America is resilient. We will figure it out.

  4. #44
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    Re: America land of the glutinous

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    It's not a choice between globalism or island. To begin with, a fiscally responsible approach to globalism would have required the wealthy to pay higher taxes directly in proportion to the acquired profits (because maintaining the military and diplomatic corps that enables globalism is expensive, both privately and publicly) while relaxing the tax burden on the lower and middle incomes to compensate for the loss of jobs and wages, which would have assisted in keeping some lower middle class families above the poverty line and away from dependence on welfare. Common sense that should have been a huge part of our approach to globalism from the very beginning, but something that in thirty years we have gotten barely any traction on, due to whatever pretense the economic elite could trot out to discourage the public from demanding it and the government from implementing it.

    I agree it could've been done different but today's elite have not learned a valuable lesson that their predecessors knew, which is you shouldn't take too much or there's not enough left for things to keep running. They take the "bottom line" to the degree of insanity. Too me it's similar to how they raise kids today with very little manners and no discipline. The parents simply don't understand the wisdom in teaching their children social etiquette that later translates into impulse control, patience and maturity.

    Rome wasn't built in a day but it burned over night
    Einstein, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

  5. #45
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    Re: America land of the glutinous

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyrylek View Post
    The slippery slope is always there. Are we , as a society, passively sliding down, to hell? No, we are not. All the ridicule apart (much of it well-deserved), the tea-party movement is something pretty much unimaginable in a society of spolied brats and brainwashed zombies. And (although I cannot help but cringe at the sheer stupidity of most of its manifestations) the Occupy-this-and-that carnival is also a sign of life - perhaps not "intelligent life", but life nevertheless.

    We'll be OK. America is resilient. We will figure it out.
    I think you're spot on. We've got some serious political and economic wrangling to hash out, especially since the near collapse of 2008. But overall I believe we're still the best game in town and too invested into the rest of the world to fall completely.
    Einstein, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

  6. #46
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    Re: America land of the glutinous

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    I think you're spot on. We've got some serious political and economic wrangling to hash out, especially since the near collapse of 2008. But overall I believe we're still the best game in town and too invested into the rest of the world to fall completely.
    We are dangerously close to the point that there are more gov't benefit getting voters than taxpaying voters. All of the campaign cash in the world will not fix that. Just as the last presidential election gave us a choice between Obama and Obama-lite, we may well face those choices in most federal office elections from now on. We have seen a huge separation developing between the income of that top 1 or 2% and the rest of us, but also a huge co-joining of big money and political office holders - is that simply coorelation or causation?
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  7. #47
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    Re: America land of the glutinous

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    We are dangerously close to the point that there are more gov't benefit getting voters than taxpaying voters. All of the campaign cash in the world will not fix that. Just as the last presidential election gave us a choice between Obama and Obama-lite, we may well face those choices in most federal office elections from now on. We have seen a huge separation developing between the income of that top 1 or 2% and the rest of us, but also a huge co-joining of big money and political office holders - is that simply coorelation or causation?
    Big money and politicians is a result of being blinded by emotion (selfishness) and coalescing forces. And as Alexander Hamilton famously said, "When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end ." Nobody wants to compromise to make things work for everyone and that is the real problem.
    Einstein, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

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    Re: America land of the glutinous

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    Part of it is inflation. Part of it is the rampant consumerism that started exactly from those 50's kids when they started making lots of money in the 70's and 80's. That's where the idea that greed is good came from. That's where Wall Street became more important than Main Street. That's where the idea that "he who dies with the most toys wins" came from.

    Kids right now are not nearly as bad as you think, and the ones that are... they're merely emulating their parents.
    So it would all just be better if people weren't making money, right?

  9. #49
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    Re: America land of the glutinous

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Sorry but there are over 2 million Americans that do farm work every year. To say that they won't is just simply wrong.

    Also you should note that the people that are on welfare and don't work are a small percentage compared to the amount of people on welfare that DO work.
    Farmers have been trying to recruit from inner city areas that have high unemployment and welfare, they are desperate for workers and Amaricans refuse the jobs.

    "Just raise the wage, you say, and an American would take the job? Not necessarily, and very unlikely if it's a farm job. Farmers have been trying that — for decades. They raise the wage. They recruit in inner cities. They offer housing and transport and countless other benefits. Still, no one shows — or stays on the job, which is outdoors and grueling and must get done, no matter how hot or cold or otherwise unpleasant the weatherare with little or no luck."



    Without Immigrant Labor, the Economy Would Crumble - Room for Debate - NYTimes.com





    "Peach farms in the Marysville region -- in particular, the peach farm of one Dalvir Gill -- are covered in rotting fruit, according to a report last Friday from Fox40 News. It seems there aren't enough workers to harvest the crops -- even though unemployment in the region is between 16 and 18 percent, more than twice the national rate."


    Marysville, California Farms Are Desperate For Workers, Despite High Unemployment

  10. #50
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    Re: America land of the glutinous

    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post
    When I was a kid in the 50s everyone except movie stars and Randolph Hearst lived in modest homes, drove modest cars and took modest vacations. Mom and dad loaded all 4 of us kids in the station wagon with the 16 ft Terry behind us and we went camping. Now you see people in 200K motor homes "camping". Houses are now huge and having a maid to clean it and a gardener to mow the lawn is common. Kids wear $200.00 tennis shoes, I wore PF Fliers. I could go on and on and give example after example but I think you get the point. IMO opinion Americans have become greedy, spoiled,voracious, rapacious consumers and I get sick of hearing people whine about not having enough. We have developed an entitlement mentality, "I am an American and I deserve to have everything I want". Makes me sick.
    I grew up on a cotton farm in the 50's. It wasn't until I was in 7th-8th grade that we went to machinery cotton pickers. During the years we had our cotton picked by hand it was done mostly by blacks and hispanics and only a few whites. Biggest reason was even back then the best worker was the blacks and hispanics.

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