View Poll Results: Is the world overpopulated

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  • the more the merrier

    20 39.22%
  • overpopulation is a problem but I am against child quotas

    19 37.25%
  • overpopulation is a problem and we need child quotas

    11 21.57%
  • but but but, my kid may be the one to save the world

    1 1.96%
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Thread: is the population bomb real

  1. #51
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    Re: is the population bomb real

    Quote Originally Posted by marduc View Post
    This is from the United Nations Food and Agricultural Organization - which you cited as being one of the sources that says we have "more than enough food", and it is a projection looking into the future:



    and



    http://www.fao.org/fileadmin/templat...ld_in_2050.pdf

    "more than enough" no matter how emphasized describes the situation at present.
    From the link:
    In developing countries, 80 percent of the necessary production increases would come from
    increases in yields and cropping intensity and only 20 percent from expansion of arable land.
    There's plenty of land to farm.

    Some places will face a problem with lack of sustainable agriculture. That is why there is a need to move towards a global trading system that is fair and competitive; and that contributes to a dependable market for food.

    We are more than capable of supporting our population, assuming we take the necessary steps.
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  2. #52
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    Re: is the population bomb real

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    "Soon" is important in terms of food costs affecting quality of life.

    Yes.

    Ever seen what it takes to feed 7 billion people? It's amazing there's not a bigger problem already.
    I have a rough image in my head.
    "Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough."
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  3. #53
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    Re: is the population bomb real

    no vote
    The selections are too limited ,biased, and controlling.
    Where is "other" ?
    Eventually we will need population control (other than abortion).
    China is decades ahead of us, this is not the first time, either.

  4. #54
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    Re: is the population bomb real

    The population problem is not so much of a problem as long as we have abundant cheap energy. Our slightly waning fertility rates do not prove that population is no big deal. We have already blown by the number that would be sustained in a world without cheap oil.

  5. #55
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    Re: is the population bomb real

    Quote Originally Posted by Jredbaron96 View Post
    From the link:


    Some places will face a problem with lack of sustainable agriculture. That is why there is a need to move towards a global trading system that is fair and competitive; and that contributes to a
    dependable market for food.

    We are more than capable of supporting our population, assuming we take the necessary steps.
    Yes, what you quoted from the link underscores my point.. we have to have a continuation in increased agricultural yields from the present farmed acreage. We have to hope that the rate of advancement in yields per acre continues at or around the pace that it has .. but from what I have quoted earlier it is slowing.

    this is the point I have been making, and continue to make:

    But the fact is that globally the rate of growth in yields of the major cereal crops has been
    steadily declining, it dropped from 3.2 percent per year in 1960 to 1.5 percent in 2000. The
    challenge for technology is to reverse this decline, since a continuous linear increase in
    yields at a global level following the pattern established over the past five decades will not be
    sufficient to meet food needs.
    The assumption we have to make is that advances in agriculture keep pace with the demand for food, this is not a given, and IF it does not then we could be in for a forced adjustment at some point in the future when we hit carrying capacity.
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  6. #56
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    Re: is the population bomb real

    Quote Originally Posted by Jredbaron96 View Post
    Yes.



    I have a rough image in my head.

    I think we have the land and ability but I believe when the costs of producing food begin to outweigh the profit we'll see shortages.

    I saw a documentary showing just a fraction of the food it takes to feed the US and it was mind boggling. It was literally enough to cover a small desert on a daily basis. It made me think we're also going to start seeing stories about some pretty gross things being done to cut costs. Worse than bacteria tainted food, pink slime or drugged up horse meat.
    Einstein, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

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    Re: is the population bomb real

    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post
    Check this link out and you may change your mind.

    World Population Clock: 7 Billion People - Worldometers
    That web site seems to exist only for selling tee shirts.
    Nothing but numbers, that well represented.
    Not one word on the human condition.

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    Re: is the population bomb real

    Quote Originally Posted by JayDubya View Post
    What a horrible phrase.

    "Giving people the right." We don't need to be given what we already have innately.
    There is a fear, IMO, of China's one child per family.

  9. #59
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    Re: is the population bomb real

    Quote Originally Posted by Jredbaron96 View Post
    From the link:


    There's plenty of land to farm.

    Some places will face a problem with lack of sustainable agriculture. That is why there is a need to move towards a global trading system that is fair and competitive; and that contributes to a dependable market for food.

    We are more than capable of supporting our population, assuming we take the necessary steps.
    Do you ever factor in anything besides humanity? You talk about 3rd world countries expanding agriculture but ignore the consequences of this on other species.

    Human Elephant Conflict










    "Human-elephant conflict (HEC) is dramatically on the rise and has become one of the major issues in the fight to save Asia's endangered elephants. In fact in most countries across the Asian elephant's range, it has replaced poaching as the major human cause of elephant mortality.

    The rise in HEC has been the result of the relentless increase of the human population in Asia and the resulting loss and fragmentation of elephant habitat. Under pressure from higher population densities and lack of fodder, elephant populations are increasingly turning to crop raiding for sustenance.

    Wild elephants can destroy a farmer's livelihood and a year of hard work in just a few short hours. These farmers are normally poor smallholders and the damage caused by elephants can be financially ruinous for them and their families. The fight to protect their fields can lead to the mobilisation of entire communities, particularly when harvest time approaches. Many techniques are used; lighting fires, banging drums and making noise, setting off firearms and fire crackers, digging trenches, putting up electric fences. Unfortunately often these methods are to no avail - hungry elephants are difficult to frighten off and they become acclimatised to the techniques.

    Human Elephant Conflict

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    Re: is the population bomb real

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Invisible View Post
    Wow! That's funny! For some reason I remember that Europe colonized all of Africa and then was forced to leave due to democratic uprisings, but they still had a strangle hold on the economy. (Neo-Colonialism, Subversion in Africa and Global Conflict | nsnbc ́nternational) (http://www.stanford.edu/class/e297a/...n%20Africa.pdf)

    You act like those investments are coming from a place of love and compassion, but it isn't. European nations are grabbing up land in Africa and using it to produce biofuels and GMOS, which prevent food production. (Land acquired over past decade could have produced food for a billion people | Global development | The Guardian) (GRAIN — Land grabbing for biofuels must stop)

    This also hurts employment, something that would give people the ability to, you know, take care of the kids they already have.

    "When not displaced, the conversion of local farmers into laborers holds numerous negative consequences for local populations. Most deals are based on the eventual formation of plantation-style farming, whereupon the investing company will own the land and employ locals as laborers in large-scale agricultural plots. The number of jobs created varies greatly dependent on commodity type and style of farming planned.In spite of this volatility, guarantees of job creation are rarely, if ever, addressed in contracts. This fact, combined with the intrinsic incentives towards mechanization in plantation-style production, can lead to much lower employment than originally planned for." (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Land_grabbing#Employment)

    EDIT: Actually it is about whether or not people have the right to have children, seeing as how that's what the thread is about.
    The colonization of Africa lasted for less than a century. In most cases, only around 70 years since the scramble for Africa has only stated in the 1880s. The only colony at that time was South Africa, colonized by the British. Occupations between Europeans lasted longer. During that time, they had railworks, hospitals and cities built, as well research done to cure malaria and other diseases to which, until that time, there was no cure. And yes, the voodoo, medicine man BS is not real medicine. It was a joke.

    Say what you will, but it was the colonization of africa that allowed real progress to be made there, skipping centuries of development in a few decades. This of course, is not necessarily a good thing, but make of it as you will.

    Of course the interest of the companies, which again, are not just European, but from all corners of the world, is self-interest. It is not charity. But it is self-interest that allows for progress and the economy to exist. Again, each government of each country has more power in their pen than the companies that exist there. If they choose so, they can nationalize all assets. It will be interesting to see what will happen then. I assume it will happen something similar to shooting yourself in your legs. Like it or not, the foreign investments in those countries are all that keeps those countries afloat.

    Next off, automatization is desirable. It should be done everywhere as fast as possible, in Europe, the US and in Africa where industrialization occurs. New generations of kids should not be taught that their future lies on the production line, but managing an automatized line.

    And about the children, again, the fact that they have outrageously high fertility rates contributes to the state of their nations. If they stopped having so many children, and instead, focused on taking care of 1-2 kids/family, there could be less, better schools to prepare those kids for life and in the span of 2 generations, the face of Africa could change dramatically, from an impoverished continent to one of the fastest and smartest growing economic regions of the world. And in doing so, we will be addressing a part of the overpopulation business. I am not saying that I have any power to dictate how many kids they have. I am just saying that it would be wise of those governments to address the issue of population growth in their nations as a threat to the welfare of the nation. And I mean welfare as it the well doing of the nation, not welfare programs.

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