View Poll Results: Who to Blame for Obamacares' Failures?

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  • They wil blame Republicans, claiming Obamacare was their idea

    57 44.19%
  • They will blame themselves for not pushing single payer

    29 22.48%
  • They will blame providers and insurers for attempting to survive

    60 46.51%
  • IT WAS THAT VILLIAN, GEORGE BUSH!

    63 48.84%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Who will Democrats blame for the failure of Obamacare?

  1. #371
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    Re: Who will Democrats blame for the failure of Obamacare?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    I'm curious as to what "failure" is in this context. The goal of the law is to get more people covered. It is certainly going to achieve that.
    maybe. So far hundreds of thousands are losing their insurance, but only a handful of thousands have been able to get new insurance through the exchanges.

    The doom and gloom naysayers claim that it will bankrupt the nation or some such, but neglect to say how.
    The way the system is designed is going to cause health insurance prices to accelerate, meaning that the cost of the subsidies will skyrocket, and the inability of the actual money to actually be spent twice means that we will have to come up with an additional $500Bn for Medicare as well.

    We'll all be unemployed because business owners are apparently only barely scraping by and will all have to close their doors if they have to pay a little more for health insurance, but it's vitally important that we keep making them shoulder this cost and not decouple insurance from employment.
    no, coupling insurance and employment is stupid - an idiotic idea foisted upon us by the FDR administration. But decoupling insurance from employment no more requires that it be government run than the fact that I do not get auto insurance from my employer does.

    The whole argument stops making sense pretty quickly. But it is extremely conservative. Change bad!! Even obviously good changes.
    Interesting. Remind me again what the debate over the Ryan Budget was about?

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    Re: Who will Democrats blame for the failure of Obamacare?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Right, so. Obamacare is now bending the cost-curve up, millions are going to lose their health insurance, the IRS is saying that the cheapest plan under Obamacares' exchanges will cost $20,000 for a family of five by 2016 and increase out of pocket costs even AFTER the subsidies, the hundreds of billions in cuts to Medicare to fund the program will cause many doctors to stop taking Medicare patients, and if we don't make those cuts to providers, then the costs of Obamacare, which are already rising, to explode. 26 States are refusing to work with HHS, and Obamacare's implementation, already well behind track threatens to fall further and further behind even as it is announced that they will not, actually, technically, so-to-speak, be able to help the people the bill was purported to aid.




    So. As this disaster of a behemoth of a bill continues to flail and fail, who are the Democrats going to blame? How far down the rabbit hole are they willing to go, ears plugged, eyes closed?
    The option I would have chosen if it had been there is they will blame the Republicans and Fox News in particular for mis-informing the public that the program was bad and that is why it failed.

    They have done this before and it worked.

  3. #373
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    Re: Who will Democrats blame for the failure of Obamacare?

    Quote Originally Posted by Heebie Jeebie View Post
    It will fail because there aren't enough doctors to handle millions of new patients. The only thing it will be successful at is providing less healthcare.
    It will fail because there are not enough Young healthy people stupid enough to pay for the rest of the country.

  4. #374
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    Re: Who will Democrats blame for the failure of Obamacare?

    What will happen when the first person dies because they lost their insurance and couldn't get a new policy fast enough?

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    Re: Who will Democrats blame for the failure of Obamacare?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mason66 View Post
    The option I would have chosen if it had been there is they will blame the Republicans and Fox News in particular for mis-informing the public that the program was bad and that is why it failed.

    They have done this before and it worked.
    I can't believe I didn't think of that. The Bonnie Prince Charlie of Policies.

  6. #376
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    Re: Who will Democrats blame for the failure of Obamacare?

    Quote Originally Posted by DVSentinel View Post
    None of the above.

    Obamacare was designed to fail intentionally. The whole thing was supposed to have an option to allow the government to seize control of healthcare but it got cut out. However, they continued with the rest, knowing it would fail, in order to re-address socialized medicine later with a better chance of getting it through. So, no need to blame anyone when it is working as designed.
    Although this is a bit hysterical, I'm not sure there isn't a grain of truth in it. The DNC couldn't push through the whole package, including single payer, so they went along with a fractional package. It seemed kind of pointless to me, when they did it, but it's not unlikely that they are planning to do partial implementation, because that's all they could get at the time, and then re-float single payer once people are on it and used to it. I think the single-payer modification will to through easily in a couple of years.

    As for the original question, like others have said, it's too late to start grinding the tombstone for OC. Most of the predictions of certain doom are based on either hysteria about death panels, or on the bad interface, but the whole system is a hell of a lot more than just a web-interface. If the Democrats get the bugs worked out of this by November of 2014, it will be a sweep in the midterms. And they have until 2016 to get it worked out enough to use against Republicans in the next Presidential contest.

    If they're able to get the systems smooth enough by those dates, the Republicans will be left holding a bag full of hysterical quotes about how America will end and there will be a government genocide if the law passes, and they'll never be able to recover their image.

    If they can't get the bugs worked out by then, it will hurt the Democrats pretty badly. Not as much as the rightwingers think it will, though. After all, in 2008 people voted for health care reform. So far, only the Democrats have even made an attempt. All the GOP has offered was bitching and moaning. It won't hurt the DNC as much as the right-wing thinks it will, because a lot of voters will by sympathetic to the attempt to fix the problem, and even failure may translate into election material for the Democrats. "We're trying to fix the health care mess and the Republicans won't let us," in short. Just a question of how much such a message will resonate with the undecideds. Probably not as much as the DNC would hope for, but far better than the RNC expects.

    But again, we have to see how well they can fix the bugs, whether or not they can use it as leverage for single-payer, and whether or not the voters are sympathetic enough to vote for the ones who at least tried, instead of the ones who did things like shut down the government as a protest against the attempt.
    "All that stuff I was taught about evolution, embryology, Big Bang theory, all that is lies straight from the pit of hell [the bible] teaches us how to run all our public policy and everything in society." Rep. Paul Broun (R)

  7. #377
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    Re: Who will Democrats blame for the failure of Obamacare?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Your poll is also prefaced by the assumption that Obamacare will fail.
    You can wipe the truck load of egg from your yap.

    CPWill prefaced it correctly. From the lessons of history, massive Socialist schemes always fail. It a matter of time... and well... this failed right out of the box after 3-years of prep work by the brilliance of government.

    Of course... for a Socialist, that's not failure... it's an opportunity to grow government even more! A True Success.

    Keep your Doc? Nope.
    Website works? Nope.
    Can tell us how many signed up? Nope.
    Reduces costs? Nope.
    Government lives on same plan? Nope.
    No exemptions for political favorites? Nope.

    Lied and deceived to pass ObamaAbortion? Yep.

    This "success" was brought to you by the Socialists of Amerika Partei (SAPs).
    The Clintons are what happens...
    when you have NO MORAL COMPASS.

  8. #378
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    Re: Who will Democrats blame for the failure of Obamacare?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grendel View Post
    Although this is a bit hysterical, I'm not sure there isn't a grain of truth in it. The DNC couldn't push through the whole package, including single payer, so they went along with a fractional package. It seemed kind of pointless to me, when they did it, but it's not unlikely that they are planning to do partial implementation, because that's all they could get at the time, and then re-float single payer once people are on it and used to it. I think the single-payer modification will to through easily in a couple of years.

    As for the original question, like others have said, it's too late to start grinding the tombstone for OC. Most of the predictions of certain doom are based on either hysteria about death panels, or on the bad interface, but the whole system is a hell of a lot more than just a web-interface. If the Democrats get the bugs worked out of this by November of 2014, it will be a sweep in the midterms. And they have until 2016 to get it worked out enough to use against Republicans in the next Presidential contest.

    Wait. No - the predictions about Obamacare's failings pre-date the website, are independent of the IPAB (which is an ugly, though fiscally helpful, piece), and are pretty well-thought-out. If you believe the descriptions of how this thing is doomed are dependent on what you have described, you haven't been paying attention.

    By 2016 the Democrat Presidential Candidate will be running on 'fixing' Obamacare.

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    Re: Who will Democrats blame for the failure of Obamacare?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    By 2016 the Democrat Presidential Candidate will be running on 'fixing' Obamacare.


    ...Thousands of Californians are discovering what Obamacare will cost them — and many don't like what they see.

    These middle-class consumers are staring at hefty increases on their insurance bills as the overhaul remakes the healthcare market. Their rates are rising in large part to help offset the higher costs of covering sicker, poorer people who have been shut out of the system for years…

    Pam Kehaly, president of Anthem Blue Cross in California, said she received a recent letter from a young woman complaining about a 50% rate hike related to the healthcare law.

    "She said, 'I was all for Obamacare until I found out I was paying for it,'" Kehaly said....

    BWWWAAAHAHAHAHAH

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    Re: Who will Democrats blame for the failure of Obamacare?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    By 2016 the Democrat Presidential Candidate will be running on 'fixing' Obamacare.
    Possibly, and the Republicans will still be running on repealing OC. We'll have to see which resonates with the voters the most. People did vote for health care reform in 2008 -- maybe not OC, but HC Reform in some fashion, and all the Republicans have offered was obstruction. We'll have to see if voters would rather fix it or scrap it. I haven't seen any polling on that.

    "Fix it" probably means "single payer". People wouldn't go that far in 2008, but they might in 2016 after getting used to the idea of federally managed health care. Or, they may recoil and want the whole system brought down. I have no idea which way the majority will break on that.
    "All that stuff I was taught about evolution, embryology, Big Bang theory, all that is lies straight from the pit of hell [the bible] teaches us how to run all our public policy and everything in society." Rep. Paul Broun (R)

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