View Poll Results: Has participation on the forum changed your political views?

Voters
47. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, significantly

    3 6.38%
  • Yes, but to a minor degree

    10 21.28%
  • Yes, but only on some issues

    14 29.79%
  • No, my views are exactly the same since I joined

    14 29.79%
  • No, it has reaffirmed and harden my views

    8 17.02%
  • I'm still open for persuasion

    8 17.02%
  • IDK/Other

    1 2.13%
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Thread: Has participation on this forum changed your political views?

  1. #31
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    Re: Has participation on this forum changed your political views?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fisher View Post
    This logic is why Libertarianism will never be anything other than the playground of rednecks, history majors, and disgruntled constipated republicans. It is essentially a better dressed movement toward anarchy.
    Really? How does maintaining a minimalist state a better dressed movement towards anarchy?

    I swear people know as much about libertarianism as they do socialism or fascism.

  2. #32
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    Re: Has participation on this forum changed your political views?

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    When I 'nah', and mutter 'money doesn't solve problems', they get all self-righteous like that. I tell them that we need to own poverty to solve poverty, and it's not something one can buy. Oh course, they get all "what have you done" and then it's talk about me time (end game, win).

    Some monetary aid does help. I don't mean to end our involvement in projects abroad entirely. I think it's best one finds an organization they can trust, preferably grass-roots.
    My goal is when I'm a doctor and have been in the industry for some years and am free of debt is to provide concierge medicine for a reasonable rate directed at lower-middle class households, and attempt to donate a month out of every year to medical charity.

    First I have to get into med school though

  3. #33
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    Re: Has participation on this forum changed your political views?

    Not really. Not because the debates aren't of great quality on this site but because I'm a Liberal living in a vast swath of southern conservatives/Tea Partiers. My views get challened constantly. I can see how someone's views may change if their a liberal living in a staunchly liberal area or conservative in a staunchly conservative area.

    It's always good to hear actual Liberal or Conservatives debate their views rather than depending on Liberals telling you what Conservatives think or Conservatives telling you what Liberals think.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

  4. #34
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    Re: Has participation on this forum changed your political views?

    Quote Originally Posted by ReformCollege View Post
    Pure libertarianism isn't anarcho-capitialism. We believe in law enforcement, what we don't believe in is the politicization of it.
    When you say "we" you presume to speak for everybody, as if everybody thinks in lockstep, and would act accordingly... which is exactly part of my point regarding the disconnect from reality.
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

  5. #35
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    Re: Has participation on this forum changed your political views?

    My time on political message boards began well before I joined here, and while my actual views on the world have changed little, I have observed that my assumptions as to which people share those views has changed quite a bit.

    If I were to generalize at all, I would say that my time on message boards has led me to view complete and utter dogmatism as being more pervasive than I once believed possible, and that there is a stupid, conformist knee-jerk portion of the left every bit as mindless as that of the right. I see precious few liberals posting compared to lock-step leftists, as most people operate from the principle of conforming to group think instead of understanding concepts.

    It's weird, but it is almost as if people are trying to confirm that all the things the radio demagogues keep saying about those blasted "liberals" is true. Of course, most wouldn't recognize a liberal principle if it smacked them along side the face, but with far too many of the illiberal leftists posing as liberals, the entire notion of what IS liberal has become so muddied as to be almost meaningless.

    When I first started posting on message boards, I self-identified as liberal. I am now loathe to do so because actual liberalism is now a moderate position, the illiberal nature of the dogmatic left having shifted the goal posts as to the perceived meaning of the terms.
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

  6. #36
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    Re: Has participation on this forum changed your political views?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gardener View Post
    My time on political message boards began well before I joined here, and while my actual views on the world have changed little, I have observed that my assumptions as to which people share those views has changed quite a bit.

    If I were to generalize at all, I would say that my time on message boards has led me to view complete and utter dogmatism as being more pervasive than I once believed possible, and that there is a stupid, conformist knee-jerk portion of the left every bit as mindless as that of the right. I see precious few liberals posting compared to lock-step leftists, as most people operate from the principle of conforming to group think instead of understanding concepts.

    It's weird, but it is almost as if people are trying to confirm that all the things the radio demagogues keep saying about those blasted "liberals" is true. Of course, most wouldn't recognize a liberal principle if it smacked them along side the face, but with far too many of the illiberal leftists posing as liberals, the entire notion of what IS liberal has become so muddied as to be almost meaningless.

    When I first started posting on message boards, I self-identified as liberal. I am now loathe to do so because actual liberalism is now a moderate position, the illiberal nature of the dogmatic left having shifted the goal posts as to the perceived meaning of the terms.
    Good post. I feel like "liberal" and "conservative" principles have been lost in the rhetoric and each term no longer means what it used to mean.
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

  7. #37
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    Re: Has participation on this forum changed your political views?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    When you say "we" you presume to speak for everybody, as if everybody thinks in lockstep, and would act accordingly... which is exactly part of my point regarding the disconnect from reality.
    I'm saying libertarians in general in terms of what it means. Of course, that's usually my exact criticism of collective ideology.

  8. #38
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    Re: Has participation on this forum changed your political views?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Really? How does maintaining a minimalist state a better dressed movement towards anarchy?

    I swear people know as much about libertarianism as they do socialism or fascism.
    Because a "minimalist" state would people living back in Little Houses on the Prairie. No thanks.

  9. #39
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    Re: Has participation on this forum changed your political views?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fisher View Post
    Because a "minimalist" state would people living back in Little Houses on the Prairie. No thanks.
    WTF is that supposed to mean?

  10. #40
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    Re: Has participation on this forum changed your political views?

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Has participation on this forum changed your political views?

    It has mine. When I first was here, I was a stauch Obama supporter, what I would call Independent Democrat and more views leaning left than right. My early messages clearly were "pro-Democrat." "anti-Republican" and "pro-Obama." I had been a Democrat election judge for my precinct.

    However, reading so many messages by members "on the left" and "on the right," OTHER THAN SOCIAL ISSUES - I find my self going further and further "right" and "Republican." However, I disagree with Republicans vehemently on nearly all social issues (gay marriage, abortion).

    I am stunned at the extreme bigotries of many on "the left" - economic, gender, race, by their almost rabid opposition to free speech, the mass number of messages calling for people of different views to be imprisoned in extremely harsh terms - and then causing them to lose nearly all rights including the right to vote, and overally contempt of individuality, private citizenry rights, and demanding goverment control-freakism. I have learned that "liberal" mostly now is the anti-thesis of "personal freedom."

    Has your views changed, hardened, or ? by participation on this forum?
    Not so much this one but others prior to my participation here. A republican nearly all of my adult life, witnessing the complete meltdown of many Republicans over the election of Barack Obama in 2008 over the most ridiculous reasons you can imagine has caused me to be offended, embarrassed and lose much of the esteem I once had for the GOP. The group I once thought of as the "looney left" I learned were no more looney than those on the right and loss of political power is seemingly what causes basket case tendencies in either party to come out. I learned that although there are differences in the parties, they are in a practical sense very minimum and what really drives people politically aren't for the most part policy differences but the fact that they see their side as powerless. With the exception of social issues, something the GOP as practically officially abandoned, you can cite historical facts of Republicans working to advance the exact same things they more recently charge Democrats with as things that are destroying America but when Republicans were doing them few complained. The conclusion: the issues aren't really the issue, rather its their side isn't driving the ship.

    I've also learned emotionalism can be dangerous and prevents people from being able to think rationally. I've learned that human beings are innately tribal. Thankfully we (at least in America) have for the most part moved past tribalism based on race (at least wrt black and white) but sadly we've replaced it with political tribalism with similar animosity and hatred based this time on political party affiliation. Those who have tolerance for those of other political persuasions experience a unique type of tribal animosity; democrat lovers or RINOs on one side, or defining those with political/social disagreements as hate-filled or bigots on the other side. Political correctness is alive and well and that both democrats and republicans alike make use of the tactic in efforts to silence those who disagree with them. They define various speech as somehow immoral but in reality that is only a PR tactic/opportunity either in hopes of marginalizing their voices in the public square or to shut them up entirely motivated by reasons having to do with their positions on the issues, not concern over morality. A heck of a lot of news is nothing more than propaganda and the scary part is most don't realize it when it comes to the so-called news they consume the most. More scary is propaganda works, not just on the viewers of Al-Jazzera but the viewers of American political media outlets as well.

    I've learned that the "nuclear option" in shutting people up from discussing race relations even when legitimate is to accuse them of "using the race card". Race relations are something many Americans, especially those of us on the right for some reason want to never acknoweldge. To that end, minor racisim gets a pass and the only race issues we can discuss under the rules of right-wing political correctness are the major horrific stuff and racism where blacks are the offenders.

    Lastly, the most effect tactics in shutting people up on political/social discussions is by making use of what I call the "outrage card" where the person acts like they are too boiling mad to even address one's comments and more importantly, others should be as well. And the use of humiliating personal insults directed toward the person with the opposing view point. Fortunately, not so much here but I've seen this elsewhere.
    Having opinions all over the map is a good sign of a person capable of autonomous thinking. Felix -2011

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