View Poll Results: What is your religion?

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  • Christian (Protestant, Catholic, Orthodox, or other)

    64 42.11%
  • Agnostic

    24 15.79%
  • Atheist

    37 24.34%
  • Muslim (Sunni, Shi'a, Sufi, or other)

    3 1.97%
  • Buddhist

    4 2.63%
  • Hindu

    1 0.66%
  • Jewish

    3 1.97%
  • Eastern Philosophy (Confucian, Taoist, Shinto, etc.)

    1 0.66%
  • Polytheist/Neo-pagan

    2 1.32%
  • Other

    13 8.55%
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Thread: What is your religious denomination?

  1. #151
    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: What is your religious denomination?

    Christian, more specifically protestant, even more specifically Methodist Evangelical or better yet Methodist Episcopal and to be exact African Methodist Episcopal

    like my religion seems to be a mutt
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  2. #152
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    Re: What is your religious denomination?

    Quote Originally Posted by celticwar17 View Post
    If you look up the definition of religion atheist does fall in the realm of at least one of it's definitions.

    Why do you even care? It's just a word meant to describe things and a broad definition of the word includes Atheism.

    If you want to argue that your emotional response forbids atheism to be related to anything like religion, than that's alright I guess.
    I like accuracy. I was curious, so I looked at the link and saw that he was misrepresenting what the court ruled, so I pointed out what it actually did rule.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

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  3. #153
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    Re: What is your religious denomination?

    Lapsed Catholic who is now probably most closely identifiable as a deist

  4. #154
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    Re: What is your religious denomination?

    Non-denominational Christian. If I would choose a specific group I identify with the most, it would be the Society of Friends.
    Quakers - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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  5. #155
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    Re: What is your religious denomination?

    Quote Originally Posted by finebead View Post
    You have not read the thread. The question is not "did living organisms change from very simple ones to more complex ones", the question is WHY did that series of changes occur? Was it just a series of accidents, or was an intellect guiding the process. In the physical world, I have never seen "nature" (or an accident if you will) create a little red wagon, or a model T, or a 787; intellect and a plan is required for these inanimate objects to be built. Why would it be different in the world of animate world? We can't explain how life is created from inanimate objects, but we believe life could progress and accidentally build a human being which is infinitely more complex than a 787, without a plan and without an intellect? That is what does not make sense to me. That leaves open the possibility of god, which the atheist seeks to deny.
    Sorry, "WHY" is not an question that Science can answer. IT does answer "HOW", "WHERE", WHEN", "TO WHAT EXTENT" questions. The WHY questions are left to religion.
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  6. #156
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    Re: What is your religious denomination?

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    You have no idea! They would throw their trash on the ground, flip people off, cut people off.

    One time, one of them was blocking my driveway, and when I told him to move it, he actually flipped me off! Real God-like, right?
    Sorry to here that all I can say is to hold in there.
    An Enlightened Master is ideal only if your goal is to become a Benighted Slave. -- Robert Anton Wilson

  7. #157
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    Re: What is your religious denomination?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow Serious View Post
    Sorry to here that all I can say is to hold in there.
    Oh, that was a long time ago, and I don't live there anymore. But thanks!

  8. #158
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    Re: What is your religious denomination?

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    I'm sure SOME people behaved. I'm sure there were MANY more who were out for themselves because they could be with no real consequences. I'm sure the chances of getting caught after committing a crime back in the BC period were pretty small. People and times were really quite brutal back then. I really do think of the Bible as a set of laws and regulations with a little "fear factor" thrown in so people would take them seriously and think twice before acting.
    Quote Originally Posted by DDD View Post
    The Roman empire brought religion to us in A.C. Was ok, but did not stretch to cover politics and people who would use religion to achieve political gains. So religion is ok for promoting similar attraction phenomenon with its "commandments" but it is weak to political exploitation.
    Well, no, the evidence points to the foundation as political in nature. I'm sure you're familiar with the documentary hypothesis? It can be visually demonstrated here.

    The quick Christian summary: Moses wrote the Torah, per divine inspiration, and was included along with other divine revelations from prophets.

    The historical summary: The linguistic dialect of Hebrew, the terminology used in Hebrew, consistency of statements, narrative flow of the writing, references to other books and the political motives, points to four main sources of the Torah; Jahwist, or J (c. 900 BCE), the Elohist, or E (c. 800 BCE), the Deuteronomist, or D, (c. 600 BCE), and the Priestly source, or P (c. 500 BCE).

    Previous to 1750 BCE there is no evidence of monotheistic Judaism, and relatively all religions in Mesopotamia are polytheistic. In Canaan, modern-day Israel and surrounding area, previous to 1200 BCE, the Canaanite religion was practiced, which we reconstructed from clay tablets in Ugarit, and included El Elyon the father of the other deities. It's in 950-850 BCE where J and E begin recording their separate accounts of the history of the people of Israel. El Elyon makes several appearances, like Deuteronomy 32:8, or in Genesis 12 where it says the Abraham worships El Shaddai or when it mention that Jacob made El Elyon his elohim or primary god of worship. (It's how we know that Abraham, Jacob and Isaac were pagans.) Other Canaanite gods like Ba'al and Asherah (Jeremiah 7:18) make appearances.

    Yahweh in Deuteronomy 2 is the son of El Elyon (revisionists tried to smooth the polytheism over), originates in Edom, the region south of Judah. As a brief comment, Yahweh was considered the god of war (comparison Aries), while Ba'al and Asherah were gods of harvest and fertility, which does explain why the Old Testament tries to exemplify God as being so violent. God mauling children with bears, anyone? From there, like with Jacob and El Shaddai, Yahweh cults begin to form as much as we see in Greek mythology where we have different temples and orders.

    Book and book sources.

    The Yahweh cultists gained a lot of political and religious clout in 750-700 BCE when the Neo-Assyrian Empire invaded the Kingdom of Israel, and forcing an Assyrian mass diaspora of Israelites. Three prophets arose before this invasion - Isaiah, Amos and Hosea - who called for complete devotion to Yahweh as a call for protection. Around the same time, the head priest of Josiah, king of Judah (641–609 BC) found a scroll in the Temple in Jerusalem which was later revised into Deuteronomy, but I'm told that most scholars believe it to be a forgery created to centralize religious power by demanding complete dedication to Yahweh, and the rejection of other gods. (Previous to Josiah, most kings had worshiped many gods, instead of just worshiping one the many gods while still recognizing many gods.) This is where D steps in a begins revisions of Joshua, Samuel, Kings, Judges and Exodus to create the idea that Yahweh had always been the God of Judah and the Israelites, and that God vitriolically hated the worship of other Gods.

    When Josiah died, it sets in a turn of events, 610-520BCE, that leads to Nebuchadnezzar II of the Neo-Babylonian Empire capturing Jerusalem and bringing the Hebrew people into Babylon. Jeremiah arises as a prophet, claiming the invasion was a result of the continued worship of non-Yahweh gods. Ezekiel follows as a prophet during the captivity of the Hebrew people, as they are beginning to be absolved into Babylonian culture, and it is during this time that another reaction revision begins to take place. The author P appends Isaiah 2 to the first Isaiah, writes Leviticus, and begins revisions in Exodus, Genesis and Numbers to say El Shaddai, El Elyon and Yahweh were the same God, and inserts stories like Genesis 1, a monotheistic revision of the Babylonian creation story. It's in 600 BCE that the Christian God is created.

    tl;dr - Through various political motives, the Old Testament was revised from the polytheistic worship of gods to a monotheistic religion.

    Sources: Wikipedia, Bible, sources, source.

    From there if you go back and read the Bible after a bit more study, it makes a heck of a lot more sense. Even things such as the Ten Commandments. The first four commandments:

    1. You shall have no other gods before me.
    2. You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God ...
    3. You shall not misuse the name of the Lord your God, for the Lord will not hold anyone guiltless who misuses his name.
    4. Observe the Sabbath day by keeping it holy, as the Lord your God has commanded you.


    ... is revisiting the holy books of the Hebrews to try to combat polytheism in political/cultural/religious attempts to preserve cultural identity, centralize religious power or gain notoriety. "You shall have no other gods," "shall not make for yourself an image," "I am a jealous God," etc. make so much more sense.
    Last edited by brothern; 02-02-13 at 05:06 PM.

  9. #159
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    Re: What is your religious denomination?

    Quote Originally Posted by brothern View Post
    Well, no, the evidence points to the foundation as political in nature. I'm sure you're familiar with the documentary hypothesis? It can be visually demonstrated here.

    The quick Christian summary: Moses wrote the Torah, per divine inspiration, and was included along with other divine revelations from prophets.

    The historical summary: The linguistic dialect of Hebrew, the terminology used in Hebrew, consistency of statements, narrative flow of the writing, references to other books and the political motives, points to four main sources of the Torah; Jahwist, or J (c. 900 BCE), the Elohist, or E (c. 800 BCE), the Deuteronomist, or D, (c. 600 BCE), and the Priestly source, or P (c. 500 BCE).

    Previous to 1750 BCE there is no evidence of monotheistic Judaism, and relatively all religions in Mesopotamia are polytheistic. In Canaan, modern-day Israel and surrounding area, previous to 1200 BCE, the Canaanite religion was practiced, which we reconstructed from clay tablets in Ugarit, and included El Elyon the father of the other deities. It's in 950-850 BCE where J and E begin recording their separate accounts of the history of the people of Israel. El Elyon makes several appearances, like Deuteronomy 32:8, or in Genesis 12 where it says the Abraham worships El Shaddai or when it mention that Jacob made El Elyon his elohim or primary god of worship. (It's how we know that Abraham, Jacob and Isaac were pagans.) Other Canaanite gods like Ba'al and Asherah (Jeremiah 7:18) make appearances, and were competing gods to the cults who worshipped Yahweh. As a brief comment, Yahweh was considered the god of war (comparison Aries), while Ba'al and Asherah were gods of harvest and fertility, which does explain why the Old Testament tries to exemplify God as being so violent. God mauling children, anyone?

    The Yahweh cultists gained a lot of political and religious clout in 750-700 BCE when the Neo-Assyrian Empire invaded the Kingdom of Israel, and forcing an Assyrian mass diaspora of Israelites. Three prophets arose before this invasion - Isaiah, Amos and Hosea - who called for complete devotion to Yahweh as a call for protection. Around the same time, the head priest of Josiah, king of Judah (641–609 BC) found a scroll in the Temple in Jerusalem which was later revised into Deuteronomy, but I'm told that most scholars believe it to be a forgery created to centralize religious power by demanding complete dedication to Yahweh, and the rejection of other gods. (Previous to Josiah, most kings had worshiped many gods, instead of just worshiping one the many gods while still recognizing many gods.) This is where D steps in a begins revisions of Joshua, Samuel, Kings, Judges and Exodus to create the idea that Yahweh had always been the God of Judah and the Israelites, and that God vitriolically hated the worship of other Gods.

    When Josiah died, it sets in a turn of events, 610-520BCE, that leads to Nebuchadnezzar II of the Neo-Babylonian Empire capturing Jerusalem and bringing the Hebrew people into Babylon. Jeremiah arises as a prophet, claiming the invasion was a result of the continued worship of non-Yahweh gods. Ezekiel follows as a prophet during the captivity of the Hebrew people, as they are beginning to be absolved into Babylonian culture, and it is during this time that another reaction revision begins to take place. The author P appends Isaiah 2 to the first Isaiah, writes Leviticus, and begins revisions in Exodus, Genesis and Numbers to say El Shaddai, El Elyon and Yahweh were the same God, and inserts stories like Genesis 1, a monotheistic revision of the Babylonian creation story. It's in 600 BCE that the Christian God is created.

    tl;dr - Through various political motives, the Old Testament was revised from the polytheistic worship of gods to a monotheistic religion.

    Sources: Wikipedia, Bible, sources, source, source.

    From there if you go back and read the Bible after a bit more study, it makes a heck of a lot more sense. Even things such as the Ten Commandments. The first four commandments:

    1. You shall have no other gods before me.
    2. You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God ...
    3. You shall not misuse the name of the Lord your God, for the Lord will not hold anyone guiltless who misuses his name.
    4. Observe the Sabbath day by keeping it holy, as the Lord your God has commanded you.


    ... is revisiting the holy books of the Hebrews to try to combat polytheism in political/cultural/religious attempts to preserve cultural identity, centralize religious power or gain notoriety. "You shall have no other gods," "shall not make for yourself an image," "I am a jealous God," etc. make so much more sense.
    Thanks for this, it's very informative!

    As Baha'i, I believe Abraham, Moses and Jesus all were prophets/manifestations of the same single God (like i.e. Krishna, Buddha and Baha'u'llah were too), but OT and NT were not necessarily written by them. In fact, research shows that until these books were canonized the way we know them today a long time after these prophets lived -- which your quote seems to confirm.

    So OT and NT are not useless, as they probably contain a true core, but their tradition is way too doubtful to rely on them literally, IMO.
    "Not learning from mistakes is worse than committing mistakes. When you don't allow yourself to make mistakes, it is hard to be tolerant of others and it does not allow even God to be merciful."

  10. #160
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    Re: What is your religious denomination?

    Quote Originally Posted by German guy View Post
    Thanks for this, it's very informative!

    As Baha'i, I believe Abraham, Moses and Jesus all were prophets/manifestations of the same single God (like i.e. Krishna, Buddha and Baha'u'llah were too), but OT and NT were not necessarily written by them. In fact, research shows that until these books were canonized the way we know them today a long time after these prophets lived -- which your quote seems to confirm.

    So OT and NT are not useless, as they probably contain a true core, but their tradition is way too doubtful to rely on them literally, IMO.
    I made an edit, because I somehow skipped how Yahweh was formed.

    Haha, I may or may not write up on the NT, because that would only demonstrate how uninspired the Bible actually is and serve to hack off some posters, but it generally reflects the modus operandi of the OT. The Pauline epistles (50-60AD) predate the Gospels, as Paul didn't really believe in Jesus' divinity, didn't know of any miracles/supernatural events, and was only really in it for the crucifixition. The Gospels were written in the later half of the first Century by multiple unknown authors and got more and more miraculous and divine focused the later they were written.

    All of it was then subjected to later revisions and purges of contradictory evidence by the early church, and even recent revisions like the insertion of the word 'homosexual' into the Bible are evident when you compare early English translations to later English translations.
    Last edited by brothern; 02-02-13 at 05:38 PM.

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