View Poll Results: Do you really think women in the Military want to risk their lives in combat?

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  • Yes

    73 68.87%
  • No

    33 31.13%
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Thread: Do you really think women in the Military want to risk their lives in combat?[W:57]

  1. #471
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    Re: Do you really think women in the Military want to risk their lives in combat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I think I have clearly stated what I want. I shall enumerate:

    1) re-evaluate thinks like the pt test to see if it really measures what the military thinks (as related to the job needs).

    2) have test for everyone, male and female that actually measure ability to do the job.

    3) stop generating and deal with individuals specifically.
    1) I wouldn't have a problem with that, but what makes you think they don't do that or haven't done that?

    2) That is what they do now. Lol!

    3) What do you mean by that? Different standards for different individuals or different standards for different duties?

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    Re: Do you really think women in the Military want to risk their lives in combat?

    Fewer women being able to pass the tests is not evidence that the test is not an accurate measure of the needs of the job.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

  3. #473
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    Re: Do you really think women in the Military want to risk their lives in combat?

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    1) I wouldn't have a problem with that, but what makes you think they don't do that or haven't done that?

    2) That is what they do now. Lol!

    3) What do you mean by that? Different standards for different individuals or different standards for different duties?
    1) I was told nothing has changed in forever, so I suspect they haven't. But they can make the process accessible.

    2) no that is your assumption. You assume the pt test dies that.

    3) I mean stop talking about men and women as a stereotyped group, and speak more to individual males and females who do and don't do the job.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Do you really think women in the Military want to risk their lives in combat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    1) I was told nothing has changed in forever, so I suspect they haven't. But they can make the process accessible.

    2) no that is your assumption. You assume the pt test dies that.

    3) I mean stop talking about men and women as a stereotyped group, and speak more to individual males and females who do and don't do the job.
    1) You were told? Oh okay.

    2) I'm sorry that you cannot understand the fact that some jobs require a high quality of expectations from potential participants. There are standards. You may not like them, but it is just common sense, especially when you factor in the seriousness of the job being life and death a lot of times. It is only natural to expect the highest levels of physical fitness and a certain level of exceptionalism. Kind of like Olympic athletes or other professional sports.

    3) You are the one stereotyping by assuming that women should get a handicap. That is not equality.

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    Re: Do you really think women in the Military want to risk their lives in combat?

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    1) You were told? Oh okay.

    2) I'm sorry that you cannot understand the fact that some jobs require a high quality of expectations from potential participants. There are standards. You may not like them, but it is just common sense, especially when you factor in the seriousness of the job being life and death a lot of times. It is only natural to expect the highest levels of physical fitness and a certain level of exceptionalism. Kind of like Olympic athletes or other professional sports.

    3) You are the one stereotyping by assuming that women should get a handicap. That is not equality.
    1) it's what started the conversation.

    2) that you assume it is common sense is my point. Life and death may depend on other factors more, and pt may not lead us in the right direction.

    3) I've asked for no handicap. Whatever they find should be across the board.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Do you really think women in the Military want to risk their lives in combat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Wouldn't be the first time they were all wrong.
    Still haven't found any evidence I see?

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    Re: Do you really think women in the Military want to risk their lives in combat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Viv View Post
    It's not as easy to dismiss if your law supports equal opportunities, a discrimination case could be made against the employer and the issue could be forced. That is probably the only way it will be done as is often the case with womens' rights and any other rights, they have to be taken, they are rarely given.
    You mean like the lawsuit against Sears where they could not find a single women in the hundreds of stores to come forward and claim discrimination?

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    Re: Do you really think women in the Military want to risk their lives in combat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Viv View Post
    It's not as easy to dismiss if your law supports equal opportunities, a discrimination case could be made against the employer and the issue could be forced. That is probably the only way it will be done as is often the case with womens' rights and any other rights, they have to be taken, they are rarely given.
    Serving in the military isn't a "right" (though it's often considered a duty), it's not a social experiment, and "opportunity" must always stem from ability and military necessity, and nothing else. Viewing it any other way is completely and utterly asinine.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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    Re: Do you really think women in the Military want to risk their lives in combat?

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Gehrig View Post
    Funny, I've known a lot of people who wanted to serve specifically in combat-- including several who enjoyed the privilege.

    Some women want to serve in the combat arms and specifically in combat. I don't hold with putting women in harm's way, but it does them a terrible disservice to claim they're anything less than genuine in their desire.
    I wanted to go to Vietnam and volunteered for it. I was young and ignorant. I think women have just as much right and propensity to be young and ignorant.

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    Re: Do you really think women in the Military want to risk their lives in combat?

    i see some pretty bias apples to oranges being done here.

    First NO FEMALE has turned blue. So ANY female being trained up for deployment has not gone through the crucible. I can assure everyone it was never a case of ONLY the females holding a unit up. I have had a glimpse into a FIRES Bde training up. The 'fat boy' program, a slight misname as it means failed the PT test not always due to wieght, is laden with MEN who couldn't do the simple PT test, much less hump a ruck under armor.

    Next I would like to address just what is carried by 'dismounts'. I was never issued a frame for ALICE. Most of the time if we left arm's distance from the track we carried at most a 'tanker's roll'. even in the Light Infantry, the true grunts, we didn't always carry our rucks. combat patrols didn't. We carried a lot of ammo bandoleers and water, C-rats in socks around our necks, but the ruck stayed behind.

    Even elite Infantry went out without rucks, the Rangers of 'Blackhawk Down' fame went sans rucks... and it wasn't the lack of rucks that hurt them, they didn't need more boots, t-shirts, ponchos or socks... no they needed canteens in their canteen carriers and ammo which could have been draped bandoleers.

    Until you have females who have graduated Ft Benning's School for Bad Boys and THEN failed subsequent training the jury is still out.

    For now we have not seen the type of female who volunteers to be one of the most abused types in the Army and damn proud of it.

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