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Is the United States Nearing a Civil War?

Is the United States Nearing a Civil War?


  • Total voters
    108
  • Poll closed .
Two points you make - One: You apparently know a bunch of folks suffering from paranoia

and

Two: If you "dont quite care what the government does" then it really doesn't matter in which nation you choose to live - does it?


I havent cared for some time. Some are more preferable than others I freely admit. However as a matter of course I have decided a bit ago that what the govenment does will not hinder my effects for my familiy and for myself any further. I color outside the lines much more than I used and have dropped my loyalties. After all why be loyal to something not loyal to you. I am perfectly happy to use governments for my personal gains.

No that dont suffer paranoia, they are quite sane and IMHO quite right. I just dont particularly care except for the instability part. Instability screws with my interests.
 
Do you think the United States is approaching an upcoming Civil War? Or maybe we will just become more and more divided?

A civil war? Likely not, Americans are fat and lazy and care not about the trials and necessities to keep freedom.
 
I wonder too, Ikari, how many care what's happening...and how many will realize only when it's too late that this matters.
 
Sorry, my administrative assistant couldn't make it here today.

My point is that the citizenry of Germany leading up to the take over by Hitler was giving away rights and finally it had slid to the point that there were no rights at all.

When the problems to be addressed grow beyond the means of the people to address them, they seek help from the places they suppose they can find it. Now, as then, the problems are growing so great that the populace will willingly give away all of their rights just to be able to eat.

wake me up when they suspend elections and dissolve the government. that's tyranny. at my last check, the 2016 race is still on. go vote in it. no violent civil war necessary.
 
Capitol-dome-AP.jpg


We're now one step closer to America's coming civil war.....

But soap opera dramatics about fiscal "cliffs" and sequestration shouldn’t deflect from where President Obama is really taking this country. Consider this story from the Wall Street Journal a few days before Christmas:

“Thousands of people in several Argentine cities ransacked supermarkets for a second day in the latest challenge to President Chistina Kirchner, who is struggling to revive a weak economy...In the central city Rosario, two people were killed during the incidents and 137 people arrested.

Some have said my warnings about a coming civil war between makers and takers are exaggerated. It’s true that Argentina’s politicians have been waging class warfare since Juan and Eva Peron–and they aren’t fazed when it turns bloody. Obama and the Democrats are relative newcomers to the game. But Argentina reveals who really suffers when those who create a nation’s wealth get mugged by those who spend it–as just happened this week in Washington.

It’s the poor and the middle class, the very ones big government says it’s trying to protect.

Experience teaches that those who believe in free markets are right. The November election and the budget deal, however, show that the other side is winning, and winning big.

Since 1970, America’s public sector has exploded as a percentage of GDP, rising to almost 25% last year. While the national unemployment rate hovers at the 8% mark, government worker unemployment rate is a cozy 3.8%. Sixteen percent of America’s workforce now work for government. By the time the Obama administration ends, we won’t be that far away from Argentina’s 21 percent.

Yet as an economic and social enterprise, government creates nothing.

When the economy tanks and the government checks have to shrink, their only alternative is to take to the streets. That’s what happening in Argentina, and in Greece; and that’s where the growth of government is taking us here, as this current budget deal increases handouts–and more and more Americans are finding that an unemployment or Social Security disability check is their only life line.

Washington’s Republicans and Democrats alike have become the toll collectors on the road to serfdom–and the road to Rosario.

Read more: We're now one step closer to America's coming civil war | Fox News

Historian Arthur Herman is the author of the just released "Freedom's Forge: How American Business Produced Victory in World War II" (Random House May 2012) and the Pulitzer Prize finalist book "Gandhi and Churchill: The Epic Rivalry That Destroyed an Empire and Forged Our Age.

Experience
•Lecturer, Smithsonian's Campus on the Mall, 1990–present
•Associate Professor of History, George Mason University, 1990–2000
•Visiting Assistant Professor of History, Georgetown University, 1991–92
•Coordinator, Western Heritage Program, Smithsonian’s Campus on the Mall, 1995–2004

Education

Ph.D., history, Johns Hopkins University

M.A., history, Johns Hopkins University

B.A., history, minor in classics, University of Minnesota
 
I wonder too, Ikari, how many care what's happening...and how many will realize only when it's too late that this matters.

There are so many things that most don't want to deal with until consequences have grown to an unnecessary and costly severity.
 
reply to MMC

I don't think that we are anywhere near a Civil War. My fears are that the "alleged" wealth creators already have too much power, especially at the political level. I see too much of Korporate Amerika. Why don't we do something about Global Warming? Who organizes to prevent recognition of the problem? That would be Big Money. Who prevents a dedicated alternative Energy policy? That would be Big Money. Who organizes wars to gain access to energy resources, among other resources? That would be Big Money. Who buys politicians to get favorable energy policies for Korporate Amerika? That would be Big Money. Who buys Major Media to make people think the US Warmongers are the World's policemen? That would be Big Money. Who buys politicians to make sure 60-70% of the US budget goes to Military Offense when we are not threatened? That would be Big Money. That would be the people you refer to as wealth creators. Bullsh*t. Warmogers. Sleazeballs. Scumbags. Profiteers. Cayman Island bookkeepers. Not Patriots.
 
reply to MMC

I don't think that we are anywhere near a Civil War. My fears are that the "alleged" wealth creators already have too much power, especially at the political level. I see too much of Korporate Amerika. Why don't we do something about Global Warming? Who organizes to prevent recognition of the problem? That would be Big Money. Who prevents a dedicated alternative Energy policy? That would be Big Money. Who organizes wars to gain access to energy resources, among other resources? That would be Big Money. Who buys politicians to get favorable energy policies for Korporate Amerika? That would be Big Money. Who buys Major Media to make people think the US Warmongers are the World's policemen? That would be Big Money. Who buys politicians to make sure 60-70% of the US budget goes to Military Offense when we are not threatened? That would be Big Money. That would be the people you refer to as wealth creators. Bullsh*t. Warmogers. Sleazeballs. Scumbags. Profiteers. Cayman Island bookkeepers. Not Patriots.

I would recommend listening to the Michael Medved show from yesterday with the Historian Herman.....then he can explain it moreso as to how such thinking that it would be left vs is right. Is the Wrong mentality on such. As when it breaks down to what Greece and Argentina are experiencing. Then it is each interest group that thinks their issue is Prime. Which affects all as seen in Greece and Argentina. So from community to community and on up the scale. To each their own diversity and separation. Which he says all will see played out with the Middle class and the Poor.

Although Herman is not the only Historian and Prof that is saying such. Plus he does have several Articles out on the Subject.
 
MMC wrote a lot of words and cites a very right wing historian in an attempt to support what I consider to be a rather distorted view of reality. There was one sentence however, that caught my eye as a prime example of historical ignorance

Experience teaches that those who believe in free markets are right.

Right about what? That free markets provide a great living for less than one percent of the population? But then we may end up in a debate over the definition of "free markets" - which would take this thread off topic
 
No, I honestly think it is a little ridiculous to think so. A few idiots might attempt to fight, however, they will quickly be taken care of.
 
Nope. The only people who I've heard seriously hypothesize civil war are those who, in their difficultly accepting that Obama won re-election and frustration with his approach to the 2nd amendment, have abandoned the political process solidified by the Constitution they apparently hold dear, think they need to kill people to get their way. In other words, adults with guns are throwing temper tantrums.
Great post, and agreed.
 
Nope. The only people who I've heard seriously hypothesize civil war are those who, in their difficultly accepting that Obama won re-election and frustration with his approach to the 2nd amendment, have abandoned the political process solidified by the Constitution they apparently hold dear, think they need to kill people to get their way. In other words, adults with guns are throwing temper tantrums.
Good post. But, I'm going to nit pick. I have to disagree with "they apparently hold dear" as it doesn't appear to me that they do. For example they often site the 2nd Amendment (A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.) then omit the the "well regulated militia" part.
 
Good post. But, I'm going to nit pick. I have to disagree with "they apparently hold dear" as it doesn't appear to me that they do. For example they often site the 2nd Amendment (A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.) then omit the the "well regulated militia" part.
And I agree.
 
Secession is as likely as a Civil War.

Review & Outlook: Hope and Exchange - WSJ.com

But it won't be a typical civil war. It would more resemble a very large and aggressive OWS protest gone out of control.. When the country goes broke then those who have become accustomed to public entitlements that are no longer available will attack public institutions and ordinary citizens. Then the fireworks will start.
 
wake me up when they suspend elections and dissolve the government. that's tyranny. at my last check, the 2016 race is still on. go vote in it. no violent civil war necessary.




With the debt about to go over 17 trillion dollars, the problem of the national security is about to be draw into the same consideration.

A gradual build up of debt while the economy shows a gradual build up of vigor is nothing to be worried about.

What we have witnessed over the last 12 years is anything but that. The current guy is worse than the previous, but both were and are unmitigated disasters. I'm not sure we as a nation can recover from what has already happened and there is no sign that it's going to stop.

The situation is as bad as a house on fire and the guy we are looking to to fix it is only pouring on more gas.
 
Good post. But, I'm going to nit pick. I have to disagree with "they apparently hold dear" as it doesn't appear to me that they do. For example they often site the 2nd Amendment (A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.) then omit the the "well regulated militia" part.

what is lost by omitting it?

do you see the militia clause as somehow limiting the right?.... do you see it as providing a justification for the federal government to infringe upon the peoples RTKBA?
 
Numerous polls have showed that people overwhelmingly wish to find an answer to certain elements of this gun debate. No. No civil war whatsoever. IMHO: just the thought is totally ridiculous.:roll:
 
reply to MMC

I don't think that we are anywhere near a Civil War. My fears are that the "alleged" wealth creators already have too much power, especially at the political level. I see too much of Korporate Amerika. Why don't we do something about Global Warming? Who organizes to prevent recognition of the problem? That would be Big Money. Who prevents a dedicated alternative Energy policy? That would be Big Money. Who organizes wars to gain access to energy resources, among other resources? That would be Big Money. Who buys politicians to get favorable energy policies for Korporate Amerika? That would be Big Money. Who buys Major Media to make people think the US Warmongers are the World's policemen? That would be Big Money. Who buys politicians to make sure 60-70% of the US budget goes to Military Offense when we are not threatened? That would be Big Money. That would be the people you refer to as wealth creators. Bullsh*t. Warmogers. Sleazeballs. Scumbags. Profiteers. Cayman Island bookkeepers. Not Patriots.

good luck with your war on corporations, money, and business... i'm sure you will be victorious one day and those evil bastards will be done away with :lol:
 
With the debt about to go over 17 trillion dollars, the problem of the national security is about to be draw into the same consideration.

A gradual build up of debt while the economy shows a gradual build up of vigor is nothing to be worried about.

What we have witnessed over the last 12 years is anything but that. The current guy is worse than the previous, but both were and are unmitigated disasters. I'm not sure we as a nation can recover from what has already happened and there is no sign that it's going to stop.

The situation is as bad as a house on fire and the guy we are looking to to fix it is only pouring on more gas.

I don't argue that the debt isn't a serious problem. I support tax increases, spending cuts, and a complete redesign of our global military role.

still, I'm not picking up a gun to kill hyperpartisans on either side. it's an idiotic solution in a first world country which has free and open elections.
 
Numerous polls have showed that people overwhelmingly wish to find an answer to certain elements of this gun debate. No. No civil war whatsoever. IMHO: just the thought is totally ridiculous.:roll:

Of course people continue to buy more guns then ever before and their reasons may be mixed, but there is no reason to believe that the possibility of social unrest isn't one of those reasons.
 
Of course people continue to buy more guns then ever before and their reasons may be mixed, but there is no reason to believe that the possibility of social unrest isn't one of those reasons.
Yes. But I challenge you to get that same number to go join the NRA. ;)
 
good luck with your war on corporations, money, and business... I'm sure you will be victorious one day and those evil bastards will be done away with :lol:
We simply wish to improve things, without any war..
A dialog, is all we need for now.....at least for me...
However, if "one-way conversations" continue, then..........
And, I'll go as far as to say that accepting things as they are now is "un-American"./
 
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