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Mental Health - Isn't This The Real Issue?

Mental Health As a Country-wide Topic

  • yes - we should openly discuss and confront this as a country

    Votes: 42 84.0%
  • no - it should remain closeted and silent, like it's always been

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Other - please explain

    Votes: 8 16.0%

  • Total voters
    50
Fail on the kid part but not the mental challenges part. No idea nor do I care who that guy is. Not even gonna look it up to debate you with either.

Saying you have worked with DD kids or Aspergers kids and not knowing who Dr. tony attwood is is like saying your a physics teacher or math teacher and not knowing who Albert Einstein was. Clue.

BTW the books name was My name is Joshua written in the 80's by an Aspie teen. Great book
 
I wouldn't say that mental health is "the real" issue.

Why isn't it "the real issue"?

Do mentally healthy individuals do the kinds of things we saw in Columbine, Virginia Tech, or Newtown?

How many people simply commit suicide rather than make a choice to "take as many people with them as possible"?

Have you any clue how many people around you are on some kind of medication for anxiety, depression, or some other non-physical issue?

I'll tell you with great confidence the number would probably be astonishing.

So many people have issues, yet most are extremely uncomfortable talking about it.

That's part of the problem. It's a hush-hush topic. Not to be publicly discussed.

It's more like having to seek help is something to be kept a secret and/or be ashamed about.

That's what I think should be changed. I don't think anyone should feel ashamed for seeking or asking for help.

We' don't hide the fact that we went to a family doctor when we have a respiratory infection or a fever, but if we suffer from anxiety or depression we hide that like it's
an STD we got from a transvestite crack-whore.

The social stigma of seeking help and guidance needs to change.
 
Let's suppose we somehow managed to climb in people's minds and erased that social stigma (it'll never happen but we can pretend), that's still not going to do the trick. How many employers in their own right mind are going to willingly take on the potential problems?

And people would still do everything in their power to hide their illness. No one likes to be different in that way, social stigma or not. They know, and are correct, that the illness will limit their options in so many ways.
 
If you look - that is the thread title.

Yes I know but too many people are saying mental illness rather than MH. They also SEEM to be including all catagories of MI/DD/Ai and others under that ridiculous umbrella. MI =/ DD.

That is my point if you had bothered to read my first post.
 
Yes I know but too many people are saying mental illness rather than MH. They also SEEM to be including all catagories of MI/DD/Ai and others under that ridiculous umbrella. MI =/ DD.

That is my point if you had bothered to read my first post.

You make very valid points.

However - I'd say that I don't think anyone is purposefully lumping all things into one category to simply be insulting or prejudicial.

I think it comes back to the basic concept of an overall lack of information and a knowledge about something of this nature.
Since most of these things are kept quiet it's just innocent ignorance based on not having a broad enough vocabulary or understanding of the topic.

The word "illness" suggests some thing that can be "cured". I get that.
Whereas some genetic and physical traits are things that can't be "cured" and therefore should not be called an illness.

We would not say that somebody born without an arm or without a leg has an illness. A kid who is autistic is not "sick".

That's precisely why I think this stuff needs to be talked about. An educational process that benefits everyone.

Did the Lanza kid have something he was born with? A condition that was not an "illness"? Or was there a combination of things going on there?
Did he have a true illness where medications and treatments were required to "cure" something?
 
When will America recognize the 800 pound gorilla in the room? When will the focus of concern and attention be directed at the true issue here?

Why is mental health still such a hush-hush topic? Something to be kept secret? Something to be be ashamed of or buried?

How can something that effects so many still be thought of as unspeakable and embarrassing?

Depression, anxiety, fear, anger, loneliness, hatred, and an overwhelming sense of hopelessness.

These things need far more attention than our country currently give them.

What will it take for people to open up about such things?

How can we improve our understanding and knowledge about these conditions and not treat them as weaknesses or things to be ashamed of, but as things that can be overcome and helped through?

If mental health had the same social stigma as cancer, would society be better off as a whole?

Because it goes against the grain of what so many want this country to be about. We are all supposed to be the lone ranger, the individualist who is in control of their own minds, when the reality is so different. The realization that people routinely need help managing their own mental landscape is a spear that strikes at the very heart of the concept of rugged individualism and any political philosophy that rests on it, so it is routinely ignored.

The real truth is that most people are not in full control of their emotions and never will be (nor ever have that ability, its not built in them). We all need a societal support structure, it is simply how humans are built and any real mental health debate has to acknowledge this fact because it touches not only on mental health, but the environmental and societal factors that contribute to it. However, really doing something about it almost requires that we have a mature society where we have systems in place to deal with this stuff and not simply hope to rely on friends, family, and charity.

Any real solution to mental health issues is going to require government involvement, I see no way around that and until we can get over the silly political bickering about an individual's place in society that misses the big picture, we will never address it.
 
Another consideration. Cost. While some people might benefit greatly from a few short sessions with a counselor, many others might require years, or even decades of regular "therapy" as well as consistent and heavily supervised medication.

How much money all that costs could be staggering if not outright impossible.

So what happens when years and years of maintaining a regimen of counseling and medication all of a sudden get completely shut off due to financial struggles?
 
I've been saying this from the get-go. First, however, I want to make clear that most mentally ill people are not violent. It's only certain types that are sociopathic, revenge-seeking, enraged, etc. However, I'd like to see mental health care universally available to treat any mentally ill person whether violent or not.
 
You make very valid points.

However - I'd say that I don't think anyone is purposefully lumping all things into one category to simply be insulting or prejudicial.

I think it comes back to the basic concept of an overall lack of information and a knowledge about something of this nature.
Since most of these things are kept quiet it's just innocent ignorance based on not having a broad enough vocabulary or understanding of the topic.

The word "illness" suggests some thing that can be "cured". I get that.
Whereas some genetic and physical traits are things that can't be "cured" and therefore should not be called an illness.

We would not say that somebody born without an arm or without a leg has an illness. A kid who is autistic is not "sick".

That's precisely why I think this stuff needs to be talked about. An educational process that benefits everyone.

Did the Lanza kid have something he was born with? A condition that was not an "illness"? Or was there a combination of things going on there?
Did he have a true illness where medications and treatments were required to "cure" something?

I almost completly agree with this. I was actually thinking about this thing last night and I think it boils down to a lack of understanding between the two. it is not ignorance per se but no experience or understanding of the differences between the two. People hear Psychological or Neurological or something llke that and they Immediately think sociopath or psycho or something.

I guess it just peeves me no end when they do that. I would prefer them to use Mental health or Psychological problems at least this would be alittle closer to the truth.

I really enjoyed ready your post. I agree with the educational process and gave some ideas on another thread (I think so many now) that discusses this.
 
Saying you have worked with DD kids or Aspergers kids and not knowing who Dr. tony attwood is is like saying your a physics teacher or math teacher and not knowing who Albert Einstein was. Clue.

Clue to what? That I am not a teacher? I am not a teacher of kids with this ailment specifically. I am a teacher that sometimes gets these kids mainstreamed into my class. Clue? Clueless.

BTW the books name was My name is Joshua written in the 80's by an Aspie teen. Great book

OK
 
When will America recognize the 800 pound gorilla in the room? When will the focus of concern and attention be directed at the true issue here?

Why is mental health still such a hush-hush topic? Something to be kept secret? Something to be be ashamed of or buried?

How can something that effects so many still be thought of as unspeakable and embarrassing?

Depression, anxiety, fear, anger, loneliness, hatred, and an overwhelming sense of hopelessness.

These things need far more attention than our country currently give them.

What will it take for people to open up about such things?

How can we improve our understanding and knowledge about these conditions and not treat them as weaknesses or things to be ashamed of, but as things that can be overcome and helped through?

If mental health had the same social stigma as cancer, would society be better off as a whole?

People don't typically recognize when they have a mental dysfunction, and they aren't going to waste time and money fixing a problem they don't know they may or may not have.
 
People don't typically recognize when they have a mental dysfunction, and they aren't going to waste time and money fixing a problem they don't know they may or may not have.

Very true... I know somebody with BPD who insists that the issue is always with the other person. Very difficult to deal with.
 
Very true... I know somebody with BPD who insists that the issue is always with the other person. Very difficult to deal with.
I know what that's like. My mother has BPD. Took her 20 years to consider that she has issues. It's even worse now that she's diagnosed, because she just uses it as a crutch to blame everything on instead of fixing it.
 
I know what that's like. My mother has BPD. Took her 20 years to consider that she has issues. It's even worse now that she's diagnosed, because she just uses it as a crutch to blame everything on instead of fixing it.

You do know it well... with me it was my wife of ten years. Now I have to deal with her because we have children. It is universally my fault, no matter what. It would be comical if it was in a movie with Robert Downey Jr. or something.
 
You do know it well... with me it was my wife of ten years. Now I have to deal with her because we have children. It is universally my fault, no matter what. It would be comical if it was in a movie with Robert Downey Jr. or something.

Ironman with violent mood changes and cocaine. Mountains of cocaine.
 
When will America recognize the 800 pound gorilla in the room? When will the focus of concern and attention be directed at the true issue here?

Why is mental health still such a hush-hush topic? Something to be kept secret? Something to be be ashamed of or buried?

How can something that effects so many still be thought of as unspeakable and embarrassing?

Depression, anxiety, fear, anger, loneliness, hatred, and an overwhelming sense of hopelessness.

These things need far more attention than our country currently give them.

What will it take for people to open up about such things?

How can we improve our understanding and knowledge about these conditions and not treat them as weaknesses or things to be ashamed of, but as things that can be overcome and helped through?

If mental health had the same social stigma as cancer, would society be better off as a whole?
Is simply identifying the 800 pound gorilla enough? What can we do to actually tame it?
 
Is simply identifying the 800 pound gorilla enough? What can we do to actually tame it?

Not keep it quiet. Not make people feel ashamed to talk about such things. Not hide it. Not look down on people who seek help or need help.
Not condemn those with issues to being something less or something to fear.

There is safety in numbers usually isn't there? Nobody likes to feel alone.
Maybe if society became more open and honest about the numbers of people who sometimes feel lost, depressed, hopeless, alone, and left out, then those people who suffered these things might feel better about asking for or seeking help rather than keep it hidden and secret.
 
Not keep it quiet. Not make people feel ashamed to talk about such things. Not hide it. Not look down on people who seek help or need help.
Not condemn those with issues to being something less or something to fear.

There is safety in numbers usually isn't there? Nobody likes to feel alone.
Maybe if society became more open and honest about the numbers of people who sometimes feel lost, depressed, hopeless, alone, and left out, then those people who suffered these things might feel better about asking for or seeking help rather than keep it hidden and secret.
That's a nice, reactionary, approach, but how about taking preventative measures? What can we do to neutralize the problem at its roots?
 
Most of the responsibility will have to fall on families, friends, and even employers to some extent to have open and honest conversations about this kind of thing.

Like I said earlier, if people sought out help for emotional issues, like they did for physical issues, we might have less tragedies of such enormous proportions.

You start getting the flu, or flu-like symptoms you don't hesitate to go to a doctor.

You start feeling down, tired, emotionally drained, lonely, hopeless or "depressed" you're much less likely to seek out help.

That needs to change.
 
I think how we handle mental health is extremely broken. Many people just see their PCP or nurse practitioner and get put on medications like Xanax, Zoloft, Vyvanse and other medications pretty much because they patient complains of a mental symptom with no real diagnosis. I think these drugs are far too over-prescribed for these issues and first line treatment should always be therapy (which is something it seems most people don't even attempt to do). I think we are also living within a society that wants to explain away every evil behavior or state of mind by labeling it as a "disease" instead of recognizing character flaws and the evil nature of humans.
 
Here, amazingly, I am in the majority and its so easy to advocate mental health....even the tea bagging conservatives seem to go along...
Where we disagree is the level of mental insanity...A gun owner must be 100% sane, not 60% times 75% as it is today.
And, for protection, its better to be trained in non-lethal self defense rather than the old reliable in a side arm,,
 
From what I've read, the treatment of mental illness is a big problem in America. Somewhere I read there are more mentally ill people in prisons in America than in hospitals/rehab centers. A mother who has a 13 year old son with mental problems was told by social workers she should wait until he commits a crime, because there is hardly a chance to get help before he does that. Most health insurances don't cover serious mental illnesses and uninsured people don't get help at all, unless they pay it themselves (which often isn't possible in case of serious incapacitating mental illnesses).

If that's true, I'd say yes, a debate is necessary.

This situation makes me especially sad because I suffered from a psychosis several years ago and need meds ever since then (but I was never violent). If I wasn't living in a country with compulsory semi-public health insurance, but in America, I'd likely be a drooling bum living on the streets talking to myself today -- or in a prison.

It's sad that this is still possible in a developed country. IMO, the quality of a society can be measured by the way it treats those people who really need help.
 
As I understand it, some mental issues (including some that can lead to a person acting like this guy did) are nearly or completely undetectable (at least with today’s tech/knowledge).
Further, many mental issues stem from the life situations, styles, and problems people encounter just because they are alive.
Eating a diet that has a bit to much or too little of X can cause deficiencies or overabundances of some aspect of a person’s body, including those portions which more easily affect the mental state.
It’s such a complex network of interwoven factors that I seriously doubt medical experts are even close to fully understanding it. Or even can.

Basically what I’m saying is that even best mental care we come up with won’t stop this kind of thing from happening.

Somewhere, somewhen, someone is going to kill a bunch of kids in a school again. It WILL happen. And I’m not sure we can do much beyond keep working on mental health issues, slight increases in school security, and better parental awareness and care for their children.

****.
 
I think we are also living within a society that wants to explain away every evil behavior or state of mind by labeling it as a "disease" instead of recognizing character flaws and the evil nature of humans.

"evil" as is a religious "devil" sort of evil?
 
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