View Poll Results: Would you support more restrictions on guns if they had the potential to save lives?

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  • Yes

    87 42.65%
  • No

    102 50.00%
  • Others

    15 7.35%
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Thread: Gun Control

  1. #641
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    As long as replacements are offered free of charge, i.e. trade two 15-round magazines for a three 10-round magazines, or allow them to be grandfathered in, I have no problem with it. The problem occurs with offering no "fair market" funds for the "taking" of private legally owned private property.
    On the other hand, I would find it equally unacceptable to use taxpayer funds for such a purpose. As a taxpayer, I must object not only to having my Constitutional rights openly violated, but with being forced to pay for it as well.

    It is equally a violation of property rights to confiscate privately-owner property that the owner has every Constitutional right to keep and bear; or to take citizens' property in the form of taxes to be used to compensate the owners of the property to be confiscated.

    Either way, it amounts to government illegally taking property to which it is not entitled.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  2. #642
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    You really have no idea what you're talking about.

    AR-15s were manufactured and sold quite legally throughout the entire term of the AWB; they simply didn't have the banned features. You don't know what the law banned and didn't ban; you don't know the criteria for banning, and continually posting a link to WaPo story doesn't change anything.
    If I'm not mistaken, they changed the name as well. It wasn't an “AR-15”; it was a “Sporter” or something like that. With the bayonet lug and flash suppressor omitted, and a few other minor changes, just enough for Colt to claim it was not an AR-15, but a distinctly different model, that didn't violate the letter of the fraudulent “assault weapon” ban.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  3. #643
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    LOL

    I think if you get the war you want hardship is going to be a term you might rue.

    You continue to lie constantly. tell us makes a gun more dangerous by having a bayonet lug

    as to folding stocks, its easy to change a fixed one out

    why should that be illegal

    why do you lefties love silly restrictions that have no use against criminals?
    Really, it gets down to their view of the whole relationship between government and the people.

    If you believe government is to be the master over the people, then you can believe that government can and should impose restrictions that serve no useful purpose, and that if the people oppose these restrictions, then the burden is on them to prove that these restrictions are unreasonable and need to be lifted.

    If you believe that government is supposed to be a servant of the people, then you must believe that the burden is on those who support imposing restrictions on the people to demonstrate that these restrictions are necessary and reasonable; and that such restrictions must not be imposed until this burden is met.

    Our nation was founded in rebellion against the former point of view, and is based on the latter. Sadly, too many of our countrymen are regressing toward the former view.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  4. #644
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by earthworm View Post
    No one, who is not 100% sane and stable , should be allowed to own a gun....
    How do you propose that this be judged?

    I do not think there is anyone who is truly, objectively, “100% sane and stable”. All of us are subject to emotions and irrational motives. It's an innate characteristic of all human beings.

    I cannot see any application of trying to judge who is sufficiently “100% sane and stable” to own a gun that doesn't invite abuse. Perhaps someone charged with making such a determination might consider the desire to own a gun as sufficient proof of someone not being sane and stable enough to be allowed to do so. Catch–22.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  5. #645
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    well I suppose I could ask you why most of the anti gun posters whine about the NRA and not criminals

    I could ask you why everyone of the most anti gun posters admit to being "progressive" or very liberal

    everything wrong one can do with a gun is illegal. use a gun in a crime you get extra years. in some states many years

    its illegal to possess a gun with the INTENT to use it in a crime

    its illegal to posses a gun if you are a fugitive, have a felony or DV record, etc

    so who is affected by laws that limit magazine capacity or flash hiders on rifles etc?
    I cannot speak for others.

    You ask me about magazine capacity. Could you please tell me the practical argument from the gun lobby side as why a user needs more than ten bullets available to them at one time?

    I do not know of anybody who is FOR criminals. People who commit crimes like the Connecticut murders or the Batman film murders are the lowest sort of stacked crap and I certainy have no sympathy for them. For myself, I have long supported the death penalty for such atrocities. I think even you would agree Turtle that I am very anti-criminal.

    As far as being anti-gun - I keep telling people I am pro Second Amendment while being against the gun lobby. There is a difference and it has a distinction.

    I hope you notice that five days ago, right here on this very site, I took the position that the NRA took yesterday- namely that an armed police officer be in every school in America. People accuse me of being against the Second Amendment and somehow somehow way I end up as the person here who was right in sync with the NRA on this solution to the problem.
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  6. #646
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    "High-capacity ammunition magazines are the common thread that runs through most mass shootings: giving attackers the ability to fire numerous bullets without reloading. Last week's attack in Arizona joins a long list of mass shootings made possible by the easy availability of high-capacity ammunition magazines: Columbine, Virginia Tech, Luby's, Stockton, and all too many others.

    Earlier this week, Representative Carolyn McCarthy (D-NY) and Senator Frank Lautenberg (D-NJ) announced plans to introduce federal legislation to ban high-capacity ammunition magazines. A similar ban on high-capacity ammunition magazines was in place for 10 years as part of the now-expired federal assault weapons ban.

    Here are just 10 of the U.S. mass shootings that involved high-capacity ammunition magazines."

    Josh Sugarmann: 10 U.S. Mass Shootings Involving High-Capacity Ammunition Magazines (Slide Show)
    LOL again the gun haters are dishonest, those were mostly STANDARD CAPACITY MAGAZINES

    the glock was designed with a 17 round magazine

    the only case of a high capacity magazine was Aurora where the guy had a Beta mag (100 rounds)

    now that is higher than the one that the weapon came with

    VT-another lie, the handgun was used with the standard capacity magazine

    you gun haters assume that ten is all that should be allowed (today-next month it will be 6 and the oozing turd Bloomberg said three was all you should have) and that ten round was based on no evidence or constitutionally sound reasoning

  7. #647
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    The guns the courts say you are allowed.
    that's the sort of evasive nonsense i expected. I asked you since right now the USSC has not said that other than MILLER which clearly suggest an M16 is protected

  8. #648
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    I cannot speak for others.

    You ask me about magazine capacity. Could you please tell me the practical argument from the gun lobby side as why a user needs more than ten bullets available to them at one time?

    I do not know of anybody who is FOR criminals. People who commit crimes like the Connecticut murders or the Batman film murders are the lowest sort of stacked crap and I certainy have no sympathy for them. For myself, I have long supported the death penalty for such atrocities. I think even you would agree Turtle that I am very anti-criminal.

    As far as being anti-gun - I keep telling people I am pro Second Amendment while being against the gun lobby. There is a difference and it has a distinction.

    I hope you notice that five days ago, right here on this very site, I took the position that the NRA took yesterday- namely that an armed police officer be in every school in America. People accuse me of being against the Second Amendment and somehow somehow way I end up as the person here who was right in sync with the NRA on this solution to the problem.
    since every major police department has determined that the most suitable self defense tools are 15-17 round magazines in pistols and 20-32 round magazines in carbines that alone is suitable guidance

    where did the anti gun nuts come up with 10 rounds when none of our police departments are so limited

    will you tell us what (if any) magazine limit do you support? there is no government agency that has found 10 rounds to be a suitable limit for their employees that I am aware of

  9. #649
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    since every major police department has determined that the most suitable self defense tools are 15-17 round magazines in pistols and 20-32 round magazines in carbines that alone is suitable guidance

    where did the anti gun nuts come up with 10 rounds when none of our police departments are so limited

    will you tell us what (if any) magazine limit do you support? there is no government agency that has found 10 rounds to be a suitable limit for their employees that I am aware of
    I am not talking about professional law enforcement officers entrusted with enforcing the law. I am talking about civillians who are not officers and who are not legally entrusted with enforcing the law.

    You mention 15 - 17 rounds or 20-32 rounds as suitable. Why are they so?
    __________________________________________________ _
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  10. #650
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    I am not talking about professional law enforcement officers entrusted with enforcing the law. I am talking about civillians who are not officers and who are not legally entrusted with enforcing the law.

    You mention 15 - 17 rounds or 20-32 rounds as suitable. Why are they so?
    because massive government agencies have said so.

    I realize its hard for many people to fathom but most of us with CCWs are better shots and as well or better trained than most cops

    the government agencies spent years determining what were the best choices for self defense. I think its reasonable for HONEST law abiding to look to groups that have studied the issue and they all come up with the same type of weapon. when I was involved in a shooting the DA asked me in front of the Grand Jury why I had the gun I did and I said its the one my local department had listed as approved backup or off duty weapons and the DA noted that was a very good reason

    I note that many of the antigun nuts assume that we are using these weapons improperly without understanding that felons and criminals are not allowed to owning guns

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