View Poll Results: Would you support more restrictions on guns if they had the potential to save lives?

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    87 42.65%
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Thread: Gun Control

  1. #1441
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    still spewing the same nonsense

    criminals have high capacity magazines

    its illegal for them to have any guns

    but they do

    so we need the same stuff for defense

    cops have gun with high cap magazines

    they are civilians and their employers have determined that such weapons are the most useful devices for self defense against criminals

    so we should have the same stuff

    and again since you are not me and don't have the skills I have you are in no position to tell me what i NEED
    Still doing the 'never been' tuff guy chest thumping on the internet I see.

    I'll type this slow because reality seems to have trouble penetrating your bubble...

    It won't be me telling you high cap mags or for that matter AR/AKs are not needed for homeowner self defense- you won't be carrying one down the street. It will be the Supreme Court- I thought you knew this lawyer stuff???

    Law Enforcement OFFICERS hold commissions- do you hold a commission? They have a duty to move TOWARD armed criminals, you do not. You have to really stretch 'self-defense' on it's ear to claim that is what a LEO's firearms are for. I guess my M16 was for self defense when I humped a ruck.

    But then again it isn't for someone so hard right on the 2nd Amendment they claim any restriction is an infringement, yet admit we do restrict it when it comes to the mentally ill and felons... it is for the Supreme Court and Justice Scalia has already gone on record that it isn't an unlimited right...

    Now as one shooter to another, it has always seemed to me the better the shot the fewer rounds you need in your mag, that you want so many in your mags seems contrary to your constant internet boasts...

  2. #1442
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    "M16" is simply the Army's nomenclature for an AR15 model. The Army does this with every weapon. The Army's M9 is a Beretta 9mm. "Beretta 9mm" is not the 'first version' of the M9, they're the same exact firearm by different names. The M2, a .50cal machine gun, is just the Army's nomenclature.
    Uh....that is essentially what I said, the early version of the AR-15 (circa 1960) was adopted by the US Army as the M-16. It has gone through various revisions. You are not countering anything I said, simply showing that I got it right.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  3. #1443
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by notquiteright View Post
    It won't be me telling you high cap mags or for that matter AR/AKs are not needed for homeowner self defense- you won't be carrying one down the street. It will be the Supreme Court
    Only if the SCotUS reverses the Miller and Heller decisions.
    Why would they do this?

    You have to really stretch 'self-defense' on it's ear to claim that is what a LEO's firearms are for.
    Police officers may only shoot someone under the same cicumstances that a civilian may shoot someone - that they, or others, are in imminent danger of being harmed.
    That is, self-defense.

    But then again it isn't for someone so hard right on the 2nd Amendment they claim any restriction is an infringement...
    Restrictions inherent to the exercise of right are not infringements; those not inherent to the exercise of the right, are.

    yet admit we do restrict it when it comes to the mentally ill and felons
    This is a due process issue. All rights can be removed thru due process.

    Now as one shooter to another, it has always seemed to me the better the shot the fewer rounds you need in your mag.
    When you humped a ruck w/ your M16, why were you issued w/ 30rd instead of 5rd mags?
    Last edited by H. Lee White; 12-31-12 at 12:42 PM.

  4. #1444
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    Re: Gun Control

    Actually it was in the Heller decision that Justice Scalia gave his opinion on the 2nd A not being unlimited.

    Funny how the Law Enforcement Officers are civilians crowd try and expand 'self-defense' to cover over the fact a LEO runs TOWARD the sound of gunfire. FYI if you had read any of my other posts on LEO and 30 round mags I said I don't think they need more than 20 round mags in their semi only rifles.

    It is the likes of Turtle Dude who insist he gets 30's because 'someone' says cops gets 30's. I say neither get 30's.

    Again Turtle Dude made no much distinction about restrictions, he claims ANY restriction is infringement. The Supreme Court disagreed.

    I like the due process dodge when finally admitting an 'uninfringeable' right can be infringed. Due Process can also be a law debated in Congress, passed, signed and ruled on by the Supreme Court. So Restricting the sale of AR/AK/30round mags/number per day is quite within the legal frame work.

    Now if you had read any of my posts on ruck humping and what mag I was issued I got 20 round mags. While yes I 'hunted' men unlike deer they hunted back, and they weren't have bad at it.

    I am perfectly happy with a 5 round cap in my AR/AK when hunting animals that can't shoot back- most times you don't get a bunch of good shots at fleeing game. No fire and maneuver on deer of feral hogs.

    I guess we were very offensive 'self defense' grunts. 20 round mags allowed us to get much lower to the ground than the 30's that came along later, and when on a two way range getting low and small was always appreciated...

    Those who's only experience comes from arcade games on one-way ranges might have a different opinion...

  5. #1445
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    Uh....that is essentially what I said
    That's not what you said. Maybe that's what you meant, but that's not what you said.

  6. #1446
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    Re: Gun Control

    Please use the quote function.

    Quote Originally Posted by notquiteright View Post
    Actually it was in the Heller decision that Justice Scalia gave his opinion on the 2nd A not being unlimited.
    You did not address what I said.
    The SCotuUS will uphold a ban on 'assault weapons' and hi-cap mags only if it reverses the Miller and Heller decisions, becuse under these decisions, 'assault weapons' with hi-cap mags are the best example of the sort of arms covered by the 2nd.
    Why would they reverse these decisions?

    Funny how the Law Enforcement Officers are civilians crowd try and expand 'self-defense' to cover over the fact a LEO runs TOWARD the sound of gunfire...
    This does not address what I said.
    Thus, I can only assume that you agree with my statement, that LEOs may only shoot others in self-defense.
    If LEOs can only shoot in self-defense, like civilians, why do they need hi-cap mags, while civilians do not?

    I like the due process dodge when finally admitting an 'uninfringeable' right can be infringed. Due Process can also be a law debated in Congress, passed, signed and ruled on by the Supreme Court. So Restricting the sale of AR/AK/30round mags/number per day is quite within the legal frame work.
    You clearly do not understand "due process" as the term is used in the 5th.

    Now if you had read any of my posts on ruck humping and what mag I was issued I got 20 round mags.
    You did not answer the question.
    When you humped a ruck w/ your M16, why were you issued w/ 20rd instead of 5rd mags?

  7. #1447
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by H. Lee White View Post
    Please use the quote function.


    You did not address what I said.
    The SCotuUS will uphold a ban on 'assault weapons' and hi-cap mags only if it reverses the Miller and Heller decisions, becuse under these decisions, 'assault weapons' with hi-cap mags are the best example of the sort of arms covered by the 2nd.
    Why would they reverse these decisions?


    This does not address what I said.
    Thus, I can only assume that you agree with my statement, that LEOs may only shoot others in self-defense.
    If LEOs can only shoot in self-defense, like civilians, why do they need hi-cap mags, while civilians do not?


    You clearly do not understand "due process" as the term is used in the 5th.


    You did not answer the question.
    When you humped a ruck w/ your M16, why were you issued w/ 20rd instead of 5rd mags?
    H- I answered your questions. What bothers many radicals on both sides is not getting the answer they want.

    that you do not wish to read what I type is on you.

  8. #1448
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    That's not what you said. Maybe that's what you meant, but that's not what you said.
    Give it up, I stated multiple times in this thread the early history of the AR-15/M16, the various revisions it has gone through, the differences between the modern civilian and military versions and the modifications that can be cheaply done to the current AR-15.

    You are engaging in pointless discussion.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  9. #1449
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by notquiteright View Post
    H- I answered your questions.
    You did not describe why the SCotUS would overturn Miller or Heller, you did not explain why you were issued 20rd rather than 5rd magazines, and you did not illustrate an understanding of "due procees" as the term is used in the 5th.

    Thus, you avoided the questions I asked and issues I presented, because you cannot respond with anything of relevance or competence.

    If you disagree, please copy/paste yout text to that effect; absent that, I shall accept your concession of the points.

  10. #1450
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Federalist View Post
    Unfortunately for many of us, the reality is that there are far too many authoritarian control freaks out there that DO want to control, rule, and dominate us. That is not pretending; that is reality.
    Then, if "they" wish to control you, its logical that "they" will also control me.
    Or, there is a big difference between us...
    What can that be ?
    And why do I not detect "their" presence ?

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