View Poll Results: Would you support more restrictions on guns if they had the potential to save lives?

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    87 42.65%
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    102 50.00%
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Thread: Gun Control

  1. #1051
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    This is funny, you still are not aware of the discussion and you fail to understand that an AR-15 IS a "machine gun".
    Maybe he'd understand it better if it were actually true. It isn't. An AR-15 isn't even an "assault rifle", because it is semi-automatic without a burst-fire capability; it is a civilian model sporting rifle for use in hunting and target shooting. The M-16 is an assault rifle, because it is a small caliber rifle with burst-fire capability. The M-60 is a machine gun, because it is a fully automatic weapon that fires rifle ammunition.

    The sheer ignorance of firearms and firearm terminology among gun control advocates is one of the main reasons that gun enthusiasts don't take their arguments seriously; quite frankly, it is obvious that they are talking about things that they do not possess the least bit of knowledge about and that they are not interested in becoming educated about. Under a rational government, this level of staggering ignorance would disqualify them from writing and passing laws about it.
    Last edited by Korimyr the Rat; 12-23-12 at 11:29 PM.

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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by SanderO View Post
    Why do advocates conclude that gun ownership is an INDIVIDUAL right??
    DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA v. HELLER (No. 07-290) 478 F. 3d 370, affirmed.

    Held:
    1. The Second Amendment protects an individual right to possess a firearm unconnected with service in a militia, and to use that arm for traditionally lawful purposes, such as self-defense within the home. Pp. 2–53.
    http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/07-290.ZS.html

  3. #1053
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by H. Lee White View Post
    DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA v. HELLER (No. 07-290) 478 F. 3d 370, affirmed


    DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA v. HELLER
    You know that case was in regard to a handgun ban, right?

    "Machine guns have been banned in this country for decades. Even as it found an individual right to gun ownership in the Second Amendment, the Supreme Court made the following observation: "Like most rights, the right secured by the Second Amendment is not unlimited," that it is "not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever" and noted "the historical tradition of prohibiting the carrying of 'dangerous and unusual weapons.' " That opinion wasn't written by some wild-eyed liberal - it was written by conservative Justice Antonin Scalia."

    Read more: Feinstein presses for assault weapons ban - SFGate
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  4. #1054
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by SanderO View Post
    Why do advocates conclude that gun ownership is an INDIVIDUAL right?
    Because the 1st Amendment enumerates an individual right, along with the 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, and 8th Amendments and because it is completely and utterly unnecessary for a government with an armed police force and standing military to assert that its right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed because there is no agency capable of restricting its right to do so.

    It's the only logical conclusion.

    Quote Originally Posted by SanderO View Post
    How do they justify that this amendment was written in a completely different time and is likely outdated?
    Because outdated or not-- and I am firmly in the camp that it is not-- it is the law, and it is a part of the same body of law that protects every other human right and civil liberty that you hold dear. If the government is capable of overturning or violating the 2nd Amendment because it is "outdated", or because it is "necessary", then it is capable of doing so for the aforementioned 1st, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, and 8th Amendments as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by SanderO View Post
    Can this be interpreted to mean that the well regulated militia can own tanks, and fighter jets etc?
    It could be. Our Founding Fathers, at the time that it was written, would have interpreted it exactly that way as it was entirely legal for members of the militia-- such as ourselves-- to own artillery pieces and other purely military armaments. However, legally, the Supreme Court has ruled that for the purposes of "militia", the right for private citizens to keep and bear arms is limited to weapons in common infantry usage.

    Which, of course, means that the current prohibition on automatic weapons is unconstitutional.

  5. #1055
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Gehrig View Post
    Maybe he'd understand it better if it were actually true. It isn't. An AR-15 isn't even an "assault rifle", because it is semi-automatic without a burst-fire capability; it is a civilian model sporting rifle for use in hunting and target shooting. The M-16 is an assault rifle, because it is a small caliber rifle with burst-fire capability. The M-60 is a machine gun, because it is a fully automatic weapon that fires rifle ammunition.

    The sheer ignorance of firearms and firearm terminology among gun control advocates is one of the main reasons that gun enthusiasts don't take their arguments seriously; quite frankly, it is obvious that they are talking about things that they do not possess the least bit of knowledge about and that they are not interested in becoming educated about. Under a rational government, this level of staggering ignorance would disqualify them from writing and passing laws about it.
    one of the best posts yet on this subject

    and the reason why ignorance permeates their posts is that hassling honest gun owners is their goal, not fashioning a serious attempt to limit the actions of people who ignore capital murder charges when they perpetrate mass murder

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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    one of the best posts yet on this subject
    and the reason why ignorance permeates their posts is that hassling honest gun owners is their goal, not fashioning a serious attempt to limit the actions of people who ignore capital murder charges when they perpetrate mass murder
    They gleefully wake each morning, hoping to hear about another Newton shooting, so they can further push their mindless agenda.
    Pathetic.

  7. #1057
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Gehrig View Post
    Maybe he'd understand it better if it were actually true. It isn't. An AR-15 isn't even an "assault rifle", because it is semi-automatic without a burst-fire capability; it is a civilian model sporting rifle for use in hunting and target shooting. The M-16 is an assault rifle, because it is a small caliber rifle with burst-fire capability. The M-60 is a machine gun, because it is a fully automatic weapon that fires rifle ammunition.

    The sheer ignorance of firearms and firearm terminology among gun control advocates is one of the main reasons that gun enthusiasts don't take their arguments seriously; quite frankly, it is obvious that they are talking about things that they do not possess the least bit of knowledge about and that they are not interested in becoming educated about. Under a rational government, this level of staggering ignorance would disqualify them from writing and passing laws about it.
    If I could make the 2nd paragraph my sig, I would.
    Haymarket's "support" of the 2nd Amendment, a right he believes we never had.
    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    no. You cannot lose rights you do not have in the first place. There is no such thing as the right to have any weapon of your choice regardless of any other consideration. It simply does not exist.

  8. #1058
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by H. Lee White View Post
    They gleefully wake each morning, hoping to hear about another Newton shooting, so they can further push their mindless agenda.
    Pathetic.
    the blood of innocents is the fuel that propels the anti gun jihad

  9. #1059
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Gehrig View Post
    Maybe he'd understand it better if it were actually true. It isn't. An AR-15 isn't even an "assault rifle", because it is semi-automatic without a burst-fire capability; it is a civilian model sporting rifle for use in hunting and target shooting. The M-16 is an assault rifle, because it is a small caliber rifle with burst-fire capability. The M-60 is a machine gun, because it is a fully automatic weapon that fires rifle ammunition.

    The sheer ignorance of firearms and firearm terminology among gun control advocates is one of the main reasons that gun enthusiasts don't take their arguments seriously; quite frankly, it is obvious that they are talking about things that they do not possess the least bit of knowledge about and that they are not interested in becoming educated about. Under a rational government, this level of staggering ignorance would disqualify them from writing and passing laws about it.
    Ironic that you talk about ignorance, since on the one hand the discussion involved 1st generation AR-15's, which I am sure with your vast knowledge of all and everything realize that they were fully auto and are owned privately.....along with the knowledge that anyone with a $10.00 manual, a jig, some basic tools and a few legal parts can convert a modern AR-15 to fully automatic. Heck, you can even install a slide-fire stock and go the low-tech path to "full auto" conversion.

    But...I'm sure you knew all that anyway.....being super knowledgeable and all.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  10. #1060
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    Re: Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Gehrig View Post

    It could be. Our Founding Fathers, at the time that it was written, would have interpreted it exactly that way as it was entirely legal for members of the militia-- such as ourselves-- to own artillery pieces and other purely military armaments. However, legally, the Supreme Court has ruled that for the purposes of "militia", the right for private citizens to keep and bear arms is limited to weapons in common infantry usage.

    Which, of course, means that the current prohibition on automatic weapons is unconstitutional.
    LOL....and you are a Constitutional lawyer too!

    Funny how the SC has never supported that view....but then you are omniscient.

    Guess how many fingers I'm holding up.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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