View Poll Results: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?

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  • Yes, civil unions are an acceptable compromise.

    17 16.19%
  • No, they are not, because:

    55 52.38%
  • The government should not be involved with marriage, at all.

    25 23.81%
  • Other (Please Explain)

    8 7.62%
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Thread: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    including the financial costs to taxpayers across the country and the perceived discrimination, it is not worth it to have the two separate things in place for the same legal benefits/rights/protections/etc.
    the question i keep asking (and maybe not well or clearly enough) is what additional financial costs to taxpayers are involved in the proposed compromise that are not also involved in rewriting laws to allow gay "marriage"? what are the specific costs involved in this compromise?
    The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.

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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by Verthaine View Post
    Actually,I didn't,but if if you choose to believe otherwise,then I have no control over that.
    and neither did I



    So in other words,there is no need for gays to compromise since no one owns the word "marriage" to compromise with.

    and with many current laws banning gay marriage of any kind.....why is there a need for anti-gays to compromise?
    The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.

    An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.

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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    suppose all current law said marriage was between one man and one woman. the proposed compromise would require a second set of laws that said civil union was between two consenting adults. what gays want would require rewriting current law to say marriage is between two consenting adults.

    in either case new laws must be written or old laws rewritten/ammended. the only difference is that under the "compromise" there would basically be two sets of almost identical laws on the books. other than being a bit cumbersome, where is the big difference?
    The change to the law(s) that need to be made to allow same sex couples access to legal marriage are small compared to the changes needed to be made to not only allow people access to civil unions but to also set them up across the country to give the exact same benefits/rights/protections as marriage and to also ensure that the federal government recognizes them as well.

    What is needed to allow same sex couples to be legally recognized as married: since marriage laws are gender neutral now in how they operate, then we only need to remove gender restrictions within the laws for who can legally get a marriage license.

    What is needed to allow couples access to civil unions: we would need to write new laws pertaining to civil unions, specifying that they are exact to marriage except same sex couples can enter into them. Since some states already allow same sex couples to marry, it would have to be decided if their marriages would be recognized as civil unions or marriages in which other states and by the federal government. It would still leave the question about those marriages where someone started as one gender and changed legally to another after the marriage and stay married. Are they married or in a civil union? What if they started in a civil union, then changed genders legally? Civil union or married?
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    the question i keep asking (and maybe not well or clearly enough) is what additional financial costs to taxpayers are involved in the proposed compromise that are not also involved in rewriting laws to allow gay "marriage"? what are the specific costs involved in this compromise?
    I can't give you exact costs, but logic tells me that it is will cost more to put into place new laws and decide how to handle contradictions or problems between the new and old laws than it would to just say that a man can marry either a man or a woman and a woman can marry either a man or a woman. Marriage laws are gender neutral in how they apply to each spouse already because men and women in marriage are equal and in those rare cases they wouldn't be, those laws would be wrong anyway.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    and neither did I






    and with many current laws banning gay marriage of any kind.....why is there a need for anti-gays to compromise?
    There isn't.
    "Anti-gays" don't own the word "marriage",so it really isn't any reason for anyone to compromise.
    Just as segregationists had no reason to compromise,but eventually history has proven them to be on the nwrong side of the issue.

    It is already been proven in the past that "seperate but equal" just doesn't work.Why compromise and settle for something that doesn't work?

    Current laws banning gay marriage will be overturn by the SCOTUS in due time,just as miscegenation laws were done in the pass.
    And current trends are pointing to more and more people accepting of SSM.
    Why compromise with those who have nothing to offer when the "whole enchilada" will be given by those (a majority of voters) who do matter in due time?

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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by Verthaine View Post
    There isn't.
    "Anti-gays" don't own the word "marriage",so it really isn't any reason for anyone to compromise.
    Just as segregationists had no reason to compromise,but eventually history has proven them to be on the nwrong side of the issue.

    It is already been proven in the past that "seperate but equal" just doesn't work.Why compromise and settle for something that doesn't work?

    Current laws banning gay marriage will be overturn by the SCOTUS in due time,just as miscegenation laws were done in the pass.
    And current trends are pointing to more and more people accepting of SSM.
    Why compromise with those who have nothing to offer when the "whole enchilada" will be given by those (a majority of voters) who do matter in due time?
    if it's jsut a matter of time....why all the handwringing? just sit back and be patient

    and, unless i am mistaken...the question in the OP was not "should gays compromise" but rather "would they be willing to". and obviously the answer is no.

    as I said, i don't have a dog in this fight so I really don't give a rat's ass either way. I just enjoy playing devil's advocate
    The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.

    An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.

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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    IOW...what it is called is more important than what it really is. tomaytoe or tomahtoe it still tastes the same

    military rank example: an O3 in the army, air force and marines is called a "captain". an O3 in the navy is called a "lieutenant". separate but equal for more than 100 years and there is no discrimination there.

    if the only difference is the name... where is the grounds for discrimination?

    it's all about being socially accepted instead of any legal issue
    There is set precedence in the law that shows that separate but equal simply isn't equal.
    What the military decides to call a job has nothing to do with the laws that are bring discussed.
    " May you live as long as you wish, and love as long as you live"
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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    just for a reference; a compromise is when both sides give up something. neither side gets 100% of what they want.

    anti-gay crowd wants no gay unions at all
    gays want 'marriage"

    seems to me that in this instance the 'anti-gay' crowd is willing to compromise their position to a much greater extent
    Since when do we compromise on the rights of American citizens?

    If the anti-gay side was willing to compromise then there would be no laws that ban same sex civil unions/domestic partnerships.
    " May you live as long as you wish, and love as long as you live"
    R.A. Heinlein

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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    No, they are not, because conservatives have yet to provide a legitimate reason why marriage should be a term reserved for heterosexuals.

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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    how about incest and polygamy? since we are rewriting the laws defining marriage...why not give those consenting adults the same rights everyone else has?
    The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.

    An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.

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