View Poll Results: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?

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  • Yes, civil unions are an acceptable compromise.

    17 16.19%
  • No, they are not, because:

    55 52.38%
  • The government should not be involved with marriage, at all.

    25 23.81%
  • Other (Please Explain)

    8 7.62%
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Thread: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

  1. #361
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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    We live in the present, not the way things were.

    And if we go back further in history we will find that marriage was not a religious thing. Plus, marriage has never been in this country just left to those who are religious.

    No religion owns the term marriage, not even Christianity.
    I now realize I threw people off with the relation to Christianity thing... My point is that marriage is a subjective tradition, but the marriage laws in the U.S. were created with the christian method of marriage in mind. But the second is not important to my main point overall, but it does play a factor in how a large part of the population can take offence (this stems from how the government has no right to define marriage, nor does Christianity have any right to define it either.)

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    And it would be fiscally irresponsible to change the term we use to describe the most solid unions between two people, making them legal family. It would cost taxpayer money to change everywhere we use "marriage" in law to "civil union". And it would all be done just to appease those who wrongfully believe they own a term they don't.
    This is where we disagree full-heartedly.
    How is it fiscally irresponsible, it can easily be changed with an Act, like the defense of marriage act.

    Again, who are you and who is the government to determine who qualifies a relationship fit enough to be a marriage? Why can't ANY two or more individuals (as long as it is not a minor or mentally disabled)?

  2. #362
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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    The fact that we allow blood relations to have certain legal rights/benefits necessitates that we have a way for adults to grant those rights and benefits to someone other than blood relations.
    Blood relations don't have the same legal rights as a individuals that participate in a marriage contract.

  3. #363
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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by celticwar17 View Post
    1.)But what does the government define as marriage? as far as when it relates to individuals who participate in it?

    2.)Or to you is marriage literally just this agreement in which two individuals get these benefits?
    3.)If it is that then why can't anyone who is not a minor or mentally disabled participate in these benefits?
    1.)not sure what you are asking i said its about 1400 different things
    2.) yes thats all LEGAL marriage is but thats not all my marriage would consist of, not sure why this is so hard to understand since its common sense.
    3.) like i already answered earlier because the government would want some restrictions since these laws, benefits and rights are already had by some in ways.
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  4. #364
    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by celticwar17 View Post
    1.)Who determines who needs these benefits or not? Does anyone actually need these benefits? And who determines what kind of relationship is enough to qualify for these benefits?

    2.)It is related to the push for gay marriage, because I don't agree with the institution of marriage by government in the first place. So even more of it, i dont agree with.
    1.) dont know how all that was determined i would imagine our government and voting process lol
    2.) no you only TRY to make it related, it really isnt in reality.
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  5. #365
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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective-J View Post
    1.) dont know how all that was determined i would imagine our government and voting process lol
    Haha, now we get somewhere.

    This is what is inherently wrong with the system. You can't pick favorites among relationships, the government shouldn't discriminate that only certain individuals can have these benefits. Because if they do, than they defined marriage in a way that is discriminatory.... just like it is now. Any two or more consenting adults should be able to get these benefits to be fair and not discriminatory.

  6. #366
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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective-J View Post
    3.) like i already answered earlier because the government would want some restrictions since these laws, benefits and rights are already had by some in ways.
    So what about the ones that arn't "had by some in ways".

  7. #367
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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by celticwar17 View Post
    what is your definition of marriage? I can't address it unless we all have the same definition. But is that part of the problem.

    When it comes down to the government all it is, is that two or more individuals have an agreement to have certain responsibilities and benefits. Is this what marriage is? I don't think so. In my opinion a civil union describes this a lot better. Not only is it the right description, but it also doesn't define something that is cultural and is different to many different cultures. The government should not define such a thing.
    The government shouldn't do a lot of things. What is more relevant is what the government can, does, and will do.

    As far as my definition of marriage...I view it as a life long commitment between two people. You don't need the government to have one of those, nor do you need a religious organization. However, given that the government can, does, and will recognize life long commitments between heterosexual couples and bestow rights and privileges for those couples, I know of no reason they cannot do the same for same sex couples.
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  8. #368
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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    The government shouldn't do a lot of things. What is more relevant is what the government can, does, and will do.

    As far as my definition of marriage...I view it as a life long commitment between two people. You don't need the government to have one of those, nor do you need a religious organization. However, given that the government can, does, and will recognize life long commitments between heterosexual couples and bestow rights and privileges for those couples, I know of no reason they cannot do the same for same sex couples.
    Well, I don't think the government should, because of all the my previous reasons. So I cannot advocate for something I don't believe has a right to be there in the first place.

    Marriage is still discriminatory even when gay couples are introduced.why can't multiple people get married? Why can't a brother and sister? Two friends? Why do divorce laws condemn adultery? There is tons of bias with divorce laws....

    how can you say you are for no discrimination when you only focus on one aspect of the problem?

  9. #369
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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    The government shouldn't do a lot of things. What is more relevant is what the government can, does, and will do.

    As far as my definition of marriage...I view it as a life long commitment between two people. You don't need the government to have one of those, nor do you need a religious organization. However, given that the government can, does, and will recognize life long commitments between heterosexual couples and bestow rights and privileges for those couples, I know of no reason they cannot do the same for same sex couples.
    I like this response, but you seem to look at it too simply for me. You are right, but I try to confront the real problem and not pretend I stand on some kind of higher moral ground.

  10. #370
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    Re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by celticwar17 View Post
    Haha, now we get somewhere.

    This is what is inherently wrong with the system. You can't pick favorites among relationships, the government shouldn't discriminate that only certain individuals can have these benefits. Because if they do, than they defined marriage in a way that is discriminatory.... just like it is now. Any two or more consenting adults should be able to get these benefits to be fair and not discriminatory.
    no you only think we are, nobody is playing favorites in reality only in the fantasy world you are making up. LOL

    if you think i against others fighting for what they deem as equal rights buy all mean they are free to do so but again that has nothing to do with equal rights for gays

    you are TRYING to make a point but you keep falling short and not providing any reason to deny gays equal rights
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