View Poll Results: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?

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  • Yes, civil unions are an acceptable compromise.

    17 16.19%
  • No, they are not, because:

    55 52.38%
  • The government should not be involved with marriage, at all.

    25 23.81%
  • Other (Please Explain)

    8 7.62%
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Thread: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

  1. #111
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    re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by Krhazy View Post
    No, they are not. If the rights of a married couple and a unionized couple are exactly the same, then the only possible reason for distinguishing between the two is the purpose of stigmatization.

    This issue was effectively decided more than half a century ago in the Brown v. Board of Education case, where SCOTUS was asked whether, if black educational facilities were identical in every way to white ones, segregation would nonetheless be a violation of equal protection. The Court answered yes.

    Segregating homosexuals from society though similar policy is just as likely to negatively effect homosexuals of all ages. It reinforces the idea that homosexuals are "different" and "inferior" to straight people. How can parents righteously scold their children for anti-gay bullying when they themselves forbid homosexuals from sacred and honored institutions such as marriage? How can young homosexuals be encouraged to establish meaningful and lasting relationships if they look forward and see that society doesn't value those relationships the same as they do straight ones?
    ...but that was physical separation between black and white students. Will there be separate lines at the justice of the peace for same sex and opposite sex marriages? Will they have to sit in two different waiting rooms? When same sex couples go to file for their taxes, are they going to have to mail their joint returns to a completely different address than opposite sex couples? At hospitals, in waiting rooms for surgeries, are their going to be state mandated separate same sex and opposite sex rooms? Separate Coke machines? Two different TV's, one tuned to ESPN and one to Bravo?

    What ACTUAL segregation is going to take place?

    The Brown v. Board of Education argument is nonsense.
    The morality of abortion is not a religious belief, any more than the morality of slavery, apartheid, rape, larceny, murder or arson is a religious belief. These are norms of the natural law of mankind and can be legislated even in a completely religionless society.

  2. #112
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    re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Please. We were all around 2004 when this came up. The public voted measures that added to their state constitutions language that bars gay marriage, including my state. This continued thereafter. The masses, under the command of demagogues, decided that homosexuals don't have the right to marry, because somehow this "threatens" the institution of marriage. Every campaign thereafter rested on "the people" deciding-not some "activist judge." The people, in their collective wisdom, thrust their uninformed mob rule onto civil rights.
    And now, that sentiment is changing. You are citing something that happened in 2004. That was 8 years ago under a GOP dictator...I mean President. The country is capable of changing my man.
    “Mr. Speaker, I once again find myself compelled to vote against the annual budget resolution for a very simple reason: it makes government bigger.” ― Ron Paul
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  3. #113
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    re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by Omgitsme View Post
    Im sure someone already beat me too this but separate but equal is unconstitutional.
    Nope, my idea is to open both options to homosexuals and heterosexuals. Either could choose a civil union or a traditional marriage.

  4. #114
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    re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    I thought what you said is that heteros get the word "marriage," and gays don't. That gays wanting the word "marriage" is "unfair." Did I get that wrong? Mix you up with someone else on this topic?
    Yes, you got it wrong. I said that if gay people don't like the terminology and concepts behind traditional marriage, then they could choose a civil union, but that BOTH options would be open to both heteros and homosexuals. I think that's a good idea. If an atheist couple decided that a civil union would be a more appropriate union for them rather than traditional marriage, they could also choose civil union. If a homosexual couple decided that they wanted a traditional marriage, then they could choose that option.

  5. #115
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    re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    How a marriage certificate is worded has no practical effect on a marraige.
    Well then why did some people want to change the terminology?

  6. #116
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    re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by Jredbaron96 View Post
    One of the common arugements I've seen from social conservatives is that the creation of a civil union should answer the questions regarding gay marriage.

    Typically, the general idea is this:

    • The civil union will contain the same benefits as a heterosexual marriage
    • The term 'marriage' will only be recognized as between one man and one woman


    So, dear reader, my question to you is: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise with regards to the issue of Same-Sex marriage?

    I'll try to have the answers as applicable as possible.
    Yes. Each should have the same 'rights' and protection under the law and civil unions should be provided for everyone.

    Marriage should be done away with altogether, I don't understand why people want in on that sinking ship to begin with
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  7. #117
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    re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Well then why did some people want to change the terminology?
    You are talking about in Washington? Because it is a government document and as such has to be accurate. Gay people had nothing to do with that, it was changed due to the needs of the government. The terms "wife" and "husband" have gender specific meaning, and as such a document that expects one of each in an era when 2 of one can marry would be clearly inaccurate and necessitated a change. No one's marriage was actually affected in any way by the change, only records going forward. How much would your marraige change if the label on a document was called something different?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    You are talking about in Washington? Because it is a government document and as such has to be accurate. Gay people had nothing to do with that, it was changed due to the needs of the government. The terms "wife" and "husband" have gender specific meaning, and as such a document that expects one of each in an era when 2 of one can marry would be clearly inaccurate and necessitated a change. No one's marriage was actually affected in any way by the change, only records going forward. How much would your marraige change if the label on a document was called something different?

    Gay people have a gender. They are still either male or female. Transgendered people can use whatever gender they feel they should be. So I don't see what the problem is with the terms "bride and groom," especially if the option to choose any combination of the two was to be allowed, such as husband/husband, wife/wife, wife/husband, etc.

    I feel that if there are things about marriage that they want to change, then it isn't actually a traditional marriage that they want, and those people should go for a civil union, but I'm not saying that they cannot choose to have a traditional marriage. It's just that a lot of people take the terminology, vows and concepts behind traditional marriage to carry deep meaning.

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    re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    I don't know how anyone could say that traditional marriage has no religious connections, because it most certainly does. The rings, the vows and a lot of the other traditional marriage customs are most definitely tied into religion.

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    re: Are civil unions an acceptable compromise for SSM?[W:237]

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Gay people have a gender. They are still either male or female. Transgendered people can use whatever gender they feel they should be. So I don't see what the problem is with the terms "bride and groom," especially if the option to choose any combination of the two was to be allowed, such as husband/husband, wife/wife, wife/husband, etc.

    I feel that if there are things about marriage that they want to change, then it isn't actually a traditional marriage that they want, and those people should go for a civil union, but I'm not saying that they cannot choose to have a traditional marriage. It's just that a lot of people take the terminology, vows and concepts behind traditional marriage to carry deep meaning.
    http://www.southfloridagaynews.com/n...this-week.html

    The state Department of Health changed the language on marriage certificate and divorce forms. Secretary of Health Mary Selecky recently approved adding "spouse" to the existing language that includes "bride" and "groom" and couples can check a box to choose the term they prefer.
    Oh such major changes....
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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