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Will we go over the Fiscal Cliff

How does this one end?


  • Total voters
    36
There is no such thing as POINTLESS when you're the POTUS. Boehner is simply doing what we elected him to do... curb Obama's excessive spending. If he wants a tax cut on the rich, he needs to come up with some spending cuts. Tit for tat... see how that works?
You did not elect Boehner, he is not in control of the House, it is a myth that Obama has been spending dramatically above the last Bush years....but then you need to toss more noise into the discussion to distract from your original erroneous point....the President did not create the extremist environment in the House, the rw cons have...and they still have not gotten the message that they had better get on with passing a reasonable budget or face losing more seats come 2014.
 
A tiny little bandaid will be put on then 2-3 years later we will face the same issue again
 
We will most assuredly go over the "fiscal cliff" because Obama wants most of the things that will happen on 1/1 to happen anyway.
 
You did not elect Boehner, he is not in control of the House, it is a myth that Obama has been spending dramatically above the last Bush years....but then you need to toss more noise into the discussion to distract from your original erroneous point....the President did not create the extremist environment in the House, the rw cons have...and they still have not gotten the message that they had better get on with passing a reasonable budget or face losing more seats come 2014.

Since this statement started out with two untruths, won't bother pointing out the rest. Except you're wrong to say this level of dissention existed before Obama took office. He's the master when it comes to creating conflict. The man couldn't lead a troop of Girl Scouts out of a burning building.
 
We will most assuredly go over the "fiscal cliff" because Obama wants most of the things that will happen on 1/1 to happen anyway.

He does NOT want taxes to go up on 98% of the people.
 
Since this statement started out with two untruths, won't bother pointing out the rest. Except you're wrong to say this level of dissention existed before Obama took office. He's the master when it comes to creating conflict. The man couldn't lead a troop of Girl Scouts out of a burning building.
Um...."dissention" happens when two opposing views meet, there was less "dissention" when Bush was in office...for the OBVIOUS reason that the rw House was OK with some of what Bush wanted, but that extremist bent existed BEFORE Obama was elected.....sheesh, understand context and chronology FFS! I was not talking about "dissention" existing before Obama came into office, I said the extremism of the House existed before he was elected. This shift in the House has been documented by both liberal and conservative writers for a while.
 
Um...."dissention" happens when two opposing views meet, there was less "dissention" when Bush was in office...for the OBVIOUS reason that the rw House was OK with some of what Bush wanted, but that extremist bent existed BEFORE Obama was elected.....sheesh, understand context and chronology FFS! I was not talking about "dissention" existing before Obama came into office, I said the extremism of the House existed before he was elected. This shift in the House has been documented by both liberal and conservative writers for a while.

So what you're saying is... dissention can't possibly be the fault of the Democrats' tax & spend policies, huh? One question... why on earth did you think things would be different this time around when he couldn't get anything passed for the last 4 years?

Here's what he's expected to tell a group of business leaders today:

Obama to stress need to raise debt limit "without drama"

Both sides dig in on "fiscal cliff," "nothing going on"

WASHINGTON | Wed Dec 5, 2012

President Barack Obama will renew his case for tax hikes on wealthy Americans to avert a year-end fiscal crunch and call for a smooth increase in the nation's borrowing limit in a speech to a business group on Wednesday, a White House official said.

The president is embarked on an aggressive campaign to pressure congressional Republicans to compromise on steps to avoid the so-called fiscal cliff. He will argue to corporate executives that it would hurt the nation's economy to have another protracted political fight over raising the debt limit, the official said.

"The President will highlight why it would hurt our economy and our nation's businesses if we do not find a solution to avoid another debt ceiling crisis, and will ask the business leaders for their help in supporting an approach that resolves the debt limit without drama or delay," said the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity.

*************

The president will renew his insistence that taxes rise on the most affluent Americans in his speech to the business group, the White House official said.

If the administration and lawmaker remain at loggerheads, going over the fiscal cliff is projected to throw the weak economy back into recession.

Obama, re-elected to a second term last month in part on a pledge to raise taxes on the wealthy, has sought to pressure Congress into yielding on tax increases with a stream of meetings with a wide range of interest groups, including businesses, non-profits, and governors of states.

IOW...

obama_baby.jpg



Maybe he'd do better actually *addressing Congress instead of hiding behind private citizens and hope they do his dirty work for him.

(*not gonna happen)
 
It's adorable that you truly believe that.

If you have access to other verifiably and reliable infomration, please do publish it here.
 
So what you're saying is... dissention can't possibly be the fault of the Democrats' tax & spend policies, huh?
Huh..."dissention" can be a RESULT of two opposing views, BUT, the extremism in the House existed BEFORE 2009. That was and still is the point which you cannot accept.

As far as what the House members are proposing, they are so shortsighted as to not be able to see that austerity is what is causing the EU to fall further behind. We did not go that route to the level they have, and as a result we are doing better than they...but the House thinks the EU model might be a good idea after all.



One question... why on earth did you think things would be different this time around when he couldn't get anything passed for the last 4 years?
Uh...he did get some VERY big things passed....which apparently you are confused about.....but this "crisis" was entirely a creation of the extremist House actions.

Here's what he's expected to tell a group of business leaders today:



Maybe he'd do better actually *addressing Congress instead of hiding behind private citizens and hope they do his dirty work for him.

(*not gonna happen)
Congress has known what the WH has proposed for some time, they (the House GOP) ought to get on with the business of Congress instead of being obstacles.
 
No deal struck by January 1?

No deal post-dating itself?
I'm all for going over the fiscal cliff. What? The GOP will get blamed? Oh noez!1 So, the GOP is supposed to cooperate with Obama just so they don't get blamed? What a bunch of crap. Take the blame, accept it, wear it as a crown of pride saying "this is what you voted for", and maybe offer a * Conservative* candidate next election, not another Liberal-Light like Bush or Romney.

The GOP needs to STFU and go along with absolutely everything Obama wants. Don't stand in the way of anything. Rubber-stamp everything. Let Obama have his way on everything.

The public has to experience the consequences of their stupidity in electing Obama in order to change their thinking. We need to use tuff-love on the American public and let them fully experience the consequences of the election.

Let Obama have his way.
 
Well, yeh! The unemployed could show up at a "night soil" generator once each day to make a deposit. Jobs ain't zactly plentiful at this time. The Repubs lost and it is time to get behind the new management or move out of the country. I think the taxes will increase and should. I think Military Offense/Defense spending will be cut and should. I pray for some kind of co-ordinated push for honest renewable energy legislation. I desire that members of the Nuclear Regulatory Commission be replaced by real people instead of cheerleaders for Nuclear Power. I would like legislation advantageous to small farms. I would like legislation that grows a new industry/job source in balance with our future National and International responsibilities. All easier said than done, but a nice, pleasant dream, nevertheless.

So jobs aren't plentiful. Do you have any idea why that might be? Do you suppose it might just possibly have something to do with Obama's war on the people who create the jobs? Maybe with his idiotic EPA going rogue? Maybe with killing the pipeline? Maybe with his making the future cost of employees so uncertain via taxes and his Patient Disposal and Unavailable Care Act?

How do you think jobs get created?
 
The consequence of "going off the cliff" is it will damage the US credit rating and make it harder to borrow from China in the future.

Well, since we shouldn't be borrowing money in the first place, it's ok if we go off the cliff.

Oh, but borrowing money is the only way to pay for ObamaCare? That's fine, ObamaCare shouldn't exist in the first place, so it's ok if we can't pay for it and have to shut it down. That saves us the trouble of repealing it.

The US is standing at the edge of a cliff, and I'm one voice in the crowd chanting "jump jump jump".

Don't worry, Liberals, the GOP doesn't have the balls to do the right thing and jump. You've successively feminized the Right into being ashamed of being and acting like men. They'll cave. They always do.
 
So jobs aren't plentiful. Do you have any idea why that might be? Do you suppose it might just possibly have something to do with Obama's war on the people who create the jobs? Maybe with his idiotic EPA going rogue? Maybe with killing the pipeline? Maybe with his making the future cost of employees so uncertain via taxes and his Patient Disposal and Unavailable Care Act?

How do you think jobs get created?
Uh....via DEMAND. Wealthy people do not create demand.
 
Uh....via DEMAND. Wealthy people do not create demand.

Nope. Jobs get created by supplying products and services that people are willing to pay for. You need to pull your head out of that Keynesian nonsense.
 
So jobs aren't plentiful. Do you have any idea why that might be? Do you suppose it might just possibly have something to do with Obama's war on the people who create the jobs? Maybe with his idiotic EPA going rogue? Maybe with killing the pipeline? Maybe with his making the future cost of employees so uncertain via taxes and his Patient Disposal and Unavailable Care Act?

How do you think jobs get created?

I think it has a lot to do with the fact that $2.5 trillion is sitting in Corporate coffers at this time. Those are those job creators you talk about. As the 1% has accumulated more wealth, fewer and fewer jobs have been created. The job creators are not those holding the big money is what that says. The pipeline is going to make Oily money more money. The idiotic EPA was there before Obama. Healthcare? We have the most expensive healthcare in the world. Not the best, mind you, the most expensive. Jobs programs at grass roots is what I want to see and you don't do that giving more to the wealthy. That works backwards and the proof is our current economic condition. I'm definitely saying that the people with the money are not the job creators. Is that clear?
 
Nope. Jobs get created by supplying products and services that people are willing to pay for. You need to pull your head out of that Keynesian nonsense.
Uh, that IS demand, the part you left out is having the means to do so. Henry Ford figured this out a long time ago.

Edit...and just to note, we are not experiencing an economic downturn because there is a "supply" issue of goods. There exists an adequate supply of nearly everything, the issue is demand. People cut back (lack of demand) because of loss of wealth/jobs.....which creates a vicious cycle.
 
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I'm definitely saying that the people with the money are not the job creators. Is that clear?

So why are the people without money not creating jobs right and left? Surely we have a lot more people without money now that Obama has been in office for four years, so there should be plenty of jobs available according to your assertion.
 
Uh, that IS demand, the part you left out is having the means to do so. Henry Ford figured this out a long time ago.

Ah, so demand is supply and supply is demand? Orwell would be proud of you...
 
Ah, so demand is supply and supply is demand? Orwell would be proud of you...
Ah you are so confused, you think "people are willing to pay for" equals "supply".

FFS.

Still wondering....you really believe the econ problem right now.....is a lack of supply of goods?
 
I have come around to thinking the automatic cuts may be the only way we get military spending pruned back to where it needs to be. If the GOP doesn't budge on giving up the tax cuts for the wealthy, I'm willing to give up my small tax cut so they will have to give up their larger tax cut.

I read today where the White House is preparing for the fiscal cliff if the GOP doesn't give up the tax cuts for the wealthy.

Let's do this!!!! :cool:
 
So why are the people without money not creating jobs right and left? Surely we have a lot more people without money now that Obama has been in office for four years, so there should be plenty of jobs available according to your assertion.

The people without jobs unemployment benefits ran out and they are dealing in the cash economy. You must have pulled that strawman out of your behind side. Do you realize how friggin' ridiculous you appear?
 
The people without jobs unemployment benefits ran out and they are dealing in the cash economy. You must have pulled that strawman out of your behind side. Do you realize how friggin' ridiculous you appear?

You are the one who claims that people with money are not job creators. Do you realize how friggin' ridiculous you appear?
 
You are the one who claims that people with money are not job creators. Do you realize how friggin' ridiculous you appear?

Since the first term of GWShiiteForBrains we have had tax cuts for the wealthy and unemployment has steadily increased. That is not a coincidence. In my area, the unemployed cut firewood, haul junk, buy and sell, mow lawns, do shadetree mechanic work, etc. and would probably form Companies or LLCs or Corporations or whatever except for the cost of legal fees. Gov't incentivized programs make the most jobs and the opportunities are rife and ignored. Renewable energy is most efficient, both on a cost basis and an energy efficiency basis, when done locally. Instead, our gov't wants to spend our hard earned taxes on those mothers of all welfare queens, Nuclear energy and fossil fuel energy. Those are your wealthy companies and now they want us to subsidize a nice pipeline for them. Screw those welfare queens. Nukes just want us to finance all their costs and assume all their liabilities. Banks just want us to bail them out, when in fact, we should be prosecuting them. Hedge funds, vulture capitalists, etc. want money for moving paper and doesn't that make a lot of jobs? I have great admiration for local and national manufacturers that actually build things and create jobs. Create new areas of manufacturing by incentivizing renewables, tax credit local projects, For the most part, if you give big money more money, they will try to find higher paying interest paper, not make jobs. That's what Ronnie Reagan's service economy has reaped. Don't give big money anything and allow competition to be their incentive. Bush and Clinton invented tax breaks/credits that profitted corporations to move their equipment overseas. Keerist, if your head is up your nose, you are not alone.
 
Since the first term of GWShiiteForBrains we have had tax cuts for the wealthy and unemployment has steadily increased. That is not a coincidence. In my area, the unemployed cut firewood, haul junk, buy and sell, mow lawns, do shadetree mechanic work, etc. and would probably form Companies or LLCs or Corporations or whatever except for the cost of legal fees. Gov't incentivized programs make the most jobs and the opportunities are rife and ignored. Renewable energy is most efficient, both on a cost basis and an energy efficiency basis, when done locally. Instead, our gov't wants to spend our hard earned taxes on those mothers of all welfare queens, Nuclear energy and fossil fuel energy. Those are your wealthy companies and now they want us to subsidize a nice pipeline for them. Screw those welfare queens. Nukes just want us to finance all their costs and assume all their liabilities. Banks just want us to bail them out, when in fact, we should be prosecuting them. Hedge funds, vulture capitalists, etc. want money for moving paper and doesn't that make a lot of jobs? I have great admiration for local and national manufacturers that actually build things and create jobs. Create new areas of manufacturing by incentivizing renewables, tax credit local projects, For the most part, if you give big money more money, they will try to find higher paying interest paper, not make jobs. That's what Ronnie Reagan's service economy has reaped. Don't give big money anything and allow competition to be their incentive. Bush and Clinton invented tax breaks/credits that profitted corporations to move their equipment overseas. Keerist, if your head is up your nose, you are not alone.


We should have done what Iceland did -

67710_444881805575094_1522512556_n.jpg
 
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