View Poll Results: How does this one end?

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  • A relatively minor deal will be struck in December

    21 53.85%
  • A major overhaul of our taxes and entitlements will occur

    2 5.13%
  • We will go over the cliff on Jan 1 and make a back-dated deal

    11 28.21%
  • We are in waterfall mode, ladies and gents. Grab your hardhats.

    5 12.82%
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Thread: Will we go over the Fiscal Cliff

  1. #51
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    Re: Will we go over the Fiscal Cliff

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    Since the first term of GWShiiteForBrains we have had tax cuts for the wealthy and unemployment has steadily increased. That is not a coincidence. In my area, the unemployed cut firewood, haul junk, buy and sell, mow lawns, do shadetree mechanic work, etc. and would probably form Companies or LLCs or Corporations or whatever except for the cost of legal fees. Gov't incentivized programs make the most jobs and the opportunities are rife and ignored. Renewable energy is most efficient, both on a cost basis and an energy efficiency basis, when done locally. Instead, our gov't wants to spend our hard earned taxes on those mothers of all welfare queens, Nuclear energy and fossil fuel energy. Those are your wealthy companies and now they want us to subsidize a nice pipeline for them. Screw those welfare queens. Nukes just want us to finance all their costs and assume all their liabilities. Banks just want us to bail them out, when in fact, we should be prosecuting them. Hedge funds, vulture capitalists, etc. want money for moving paper and doesn't that make a lot of jobs? I have great admiration for local and national manufacturers that actually build things and create jobs. Create new areas of manufacturing by incentivizing renewables, tax credit local projects, For the most part, if you give big money more money, they will try to find higher paying interest paper, not make jobs. That's what Ronnie Reagan's service economy has reaped. Don't give big money anything and allow competition to be their incentive. Bush and Clinton invented tax breaks/credits that profitted corporations to move their equipment overseas. Keerist, if your head is up your nose, you are not alone.
    Orwell would have loved that one!
    "We the people are the rightful masters of both Congress & the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution, but overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution."
    - Abraham Lincoln

  2. #52
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    Re: Will we go over the Fiscal Cliff

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    Huh..."dissention" can be a RESULT of two opposing views, BUT, the extremism in the House existed BEFORE 2009. That was and still is the point which you cannot accept.

    As far as what the House members are proposing, they are so shortsighted as to not be able to see that austerity is what is causing the EU to fall further behind.
    That is correct - the EU tried a "balanced approach" of spending cuts and tax increases, not realizing that freeing up more resources for the economy through spending cuts was wise, but that then taking them back through tax increases meant that you would be unable to reallocate them to more productive uses.

    President Obama claims to want to recreate their approach here. Perhaps that should give us pause.

  3. #53
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    Re: Will we go over the Fiscal Cliff

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    That is correct - the EU tried a "balanced approach" of spending cuts and tax increases
    Oreilly? Cite the tax rate changes since 2009 in the EU that are responsible for the continued poor economic activity. Specifically in Greece, Spain, Portugal and France. show how these tax rate changes have far exceed the effects of massive cutbacks in govt spending by each nation.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  4. #54
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    Re: Will we go over the Fiscal Cliff



    Déjà vu

  5. #55
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    Re: Will we go over the Fiscal Cliff

    JON STEWART: 'Let's Go Over The Cliff!'

    "Stewart didn't find much hope for a future compromise with the way negotiations are going right now. That led him to his conclusion: "Let's just go over the ... cliff!"

    "Let's just go. Because, you know why? At least for a few seconds, it'll feel like we're flying," he said."

    Watch the full clip below:

    Read more: Jon Stewart On Fiscal Cliff: 'Let's Go Over!' - Business Insider
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  6. #56
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    Re: Will we go over the Fiscal Cliff

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    JON STEWART: 'Let's Go Over The Cliff!'

    "Stewart didn't find much hope for a future compromise with the way negotiations are going right now. That led him to his conclusion: "Let's just go over the ... cliff!"

    "Let's just go. Because, you know why? At least for a few seconds, it'll feel like we're flying," he said."

    Watch the full clip below:

    Read more: Jon Stewart On Fiscal Cliff: 'Let's Go Over!' - Business Insider
    Easy for him to say...he has millions and he has a job. (even if he's not very good at it)
    TANSTAAFL

    “An armed society is a polite society.”
    ― Robert A. Heinlein, Beyond This Horizon

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    Re: Will we go over the Fiscal Cliff

    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    Easy for him to say...he has millions and he has a job. (even if he's not very good at it)
    Right, it should be The Daily Show with Mycroft! I don't have millions and I'm with him, if that is what it takes to cut military spending and get the tax rates for the rich back to sustainable levels.

    Let's ****ing go!
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  8. #58
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    Re: Will we go over the Fiscal Cliff

    I would encourage Boehner and Co. to call obama's bluff and announce that going forward with the legislation he (obama) signed
    to raise the debt cieling is the best solution on the table right now. Tell obama, the media and everyone that listens this thing
    isn't the "cliff / horror" that its being made out to be and going over it is necessary to get our fiscal house in order; that is why
    it was presented as an option to raising the debt cieling and since the President has offered no other viable solution lets roll.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    Easy for him to say...he has millions and he has a job. (even if he's not very good at it)

  9. #59
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    Re: Will we go over the Fiscal Cliff

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    That is correct - the EU tried a "balanced approach" of spending cuts and tax increases, not realizing that freeing up more resources for the economy through spending cuts was wise, but that then taking them back through tax increases meant that you would be unable to reallocate them to more productive uses.

    President Obama claims to want to recreate their approach here. Perhaps that should give us pause.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    Oreilly? Cite the tax rate changes since 2009 in the EU that are responsible for the continued poor economic activity. Specifically in Greece, Spain, Portugal and France. show how these tax rate changes have far exceed the effects of massive cutbacks in govt spending by each nation.
    Hello....nothing?

    I thought so.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  10. #60
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    Re: Will we go over the Fiscal Cliff

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    Hello....nothing?

    I thought so.
    Sorry. Some of us have jobs.

    Spain's Income Tax Increases Take It To Top of Tax Table

    Europe's Failed Austerity

    ...In France, for example, the so-called austerity largely consisted of raising taxes. There was a 3 percent surtax on incomes above €500,000, an increase of one percentage point in the top marginal tax rate (from 40 to 41 percent), and an end to the automatic indexation of tax brackets for inheritance, wealth, and income taxes. There was also a 5 percent hike in the corporate income tax on businesses with revenue of more than €250 million, as well as a hike in the capital-gains tax, and closure of several corporate tax breaks. And even though most of these tax hikes were aimed at the wealthy, the middle class did not get off free. There was an increase in the Value Added Tax (VAT) and the excise taxes on tobacco and alcohol...

    Or take Britain, where the Tory-Liberal coalition recently suffered a drubbing in local elections, in part as a reaction to so-called austerity measures. Among the Cameron government’s first “austerity” measures was to hike the personal income tax to 50 percent for those earning more than £150,000 a year. That measure managed to actually decrease income-tax revenues by £509 million...

    Other European countries have taken the same approach: tax hikes today (especially) on the rich and promises of tiny benefit cuts in the dim and distant future. Spain imposed a “wealth tax” on citizens with €700,000 of assets, and a 7 percent income tax on those earning more than €300,000 per year; capital-gains taxes were also hiked. Italy imposed a “Solidarity Tax” of 3 percent on all taxpayers who earn more than €300,000. Greece increased taxes by nearly twice as much as it cut spending, including a 5 percent surtax on the wealthy. VATs were hiked nearly everywhere. And fuel, alcohol, and tobacco were also prime tax targets....


    You asked if they had raised taxes in Spain, Portugal, Greece, and France. The answer being: Yup.

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