View Poll Results: Could secession ever be appropriate?

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  • Secession could possibly be acceptable

    69 70.41%
  • Secession is never acceptable

    29 29.59%
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Thread: Would you oppose secession for ANY reason?

  1. #141
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    Re: Would you oppose secession for ANY reason?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Barbarian View Post
    Thatís a tough question, while I can see just some of the many problems that would arise from such a thing, I keep looking at how divided this country has become, there seems to be less and less middle left and middle right.
    We seem to have already become of nation of liberal values VS conservative values. Almost everyone I come in contact with has a we against them mentality. As our nation becomes more and more divided, so does our government, and I understand that, after all they represent those that elected them. As our government becomes more and more polarized gridlock between the parties becomes worse and worse.

    I see at this time secession, peacefully done, as about the only viable option. We arenít at war yet, so I donít see why they couldnít sit down at a table and work out details allowing such a thing to take place. People and business could be given 5 years (pick your period of time) to move to states that fit their thinking in values. With no penalty after that it would be like moving to any other country.

    From the way this country is going, the divide getting wider, tempers becoming shorter and little hope of anyone or anything closing that gap between the parties I guess I would support secession, before I would support another civil war in this country.

    Contrary to one poster in here, it has nothing to do with race, it has everything to do with the beliefs of people on both sides. What our Constitution means and implies, what our government should be and do, and at times even the very basic concept of what is right and wrong. That list could just go on and on. We have become a nation that is divided by our beliefs. In my opinion it would be better to peacefully divide ourselves then it would be to get into another civil war over our beliefs.
    I agree

  2. #142
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    Re: Would you oppose secession for ANY reason?

    Quote Originally Posted by guru03 View Post
    I agree
    It sounds like then that both of you are taking the idea that polarization is bad so lets get more polarized. Did it occur to you guys though that these two groups of people are not living in separate areas that can be easily divided? In other words I am not moving just because I think differently than you. The entire idea of segregating the left from the right is ****ing stupid and naive. So what are you guys proposing shipping off our children to the other side if they dont agree politically with us?

    You guys really show why political parties suck. Instead of trying to work together you want to divide people by their political lean and tell them to live in a certain area just so you guys can all sit around and masturbate together singing about how great that your ideologies are. Meanwhile you will have created two authoritarian governments that the rest of us non partisan hacks will be at war with. In other words forget your little pipe dreams its not every going to happen or work, any rational person can see this.

  3. #143
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    Re: Would you oppose secession for ANY reason?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    It sounds like then that both of you are taking the idea that polarization is bad so lets get more polarized. Did it occur to you guys though that these two groups of people are not living in separate areas that can be easily divided? In other words I am not moving just because I think differently than you. The entire idea of segregating the left from the right is ****ing stupid and naive. So what are you guys proposing shipping off our children to the other side if they dont agree politically with us?

    You guys really show why political parties suck. Instead of trying to work together you want to divide people by their political lean and tell them to live in a certain area just so you guys can all sit around and masturbate together singing about how great that your ideologies are. Meanwhile you will have created two authoritarian governments that the rest of us non partisan hacks will be at war with. In other words forget your little pipe dreams its not every going to happen or work, any rational person can see this.
    That would be awful, I prefer the idea of each state being an experiment in democracy in all matters non-federal. Because when my state refuses to issue CCW permits for example, I can move to another that does.
    Haymarket's "support" of the 2nd Amendment, a right he believes we never had.
    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    no. You cannot lose rights you do not have in the first place. There is no such thing as the right to have any weapon of your choice regardless of any other consideration. It simply does not exist.

  4. #144
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    Re: Would you oppose secession for ANY reason?

    Absolutes are ALWAYS wrong. That is why I chose option one. In this case, however, secession is idiotic to say the least.
    "The trust of the innocent is the liar's most useful tool." : Stephen King

    "Commerce with all nations, alliance with none, should be our motto." Thomas Jefferson

  5. #145
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    Re: Would you oppose secession for ANY reason?

    Secession leads to hate, hate leads to civil war, civil war leads to suffering. - Yoda

    I voted option one because I can envision circumstances where secession could be warranted. But we aren't near there, at least not here in MD.
    Haymarket's "support" of the 2nd Amendment, a right he believes we never had.
    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    no. You cannot lose rights you do not have in the first place. There is no such thing as the right to have any weapon of your choice regardless of any other consideration. It simply does not exist.

  6. #146
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    Re: Would you oppose secession for ANY reason?

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    I think that if Corporate control of USA politics becomes too pervasive, then secession is a viable alternative. We can't be starting resource wars. We can't give corporations influence in our military. We can't initiate tariffs to protect Corporations. We can't allocate extra rights to Corporations. It's a country about people first. We, the people.
    Don't know how to tell you this, Dave, but all that already happened. Perhaps I had my irony meter switched off.
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  7. #147
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    Re: Would you oppose secession for ANY reason?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lachean View Post
    That would be awful, I prefer the idea of each state being an experiment in democracy in all matters non-federal. Because when my state refuses to issue CCW permits for example, I can move to another that does.
    It is your liberty to live in any of the states that you want for any reason. If carrying a concealed weapon is important enough to you to move to another state that is your choice.

    The Barbarian's pipe dream though asserts that by law if you have a certain political lean that you cannot live in certain states. Which would transform those two division of states into authoritarian governments where you may not politically lean any direction other than the direction the government dictates. If you disagree with the government you will be thrown out or arrested. Certainly not anything that I would publicly promote as if it was a good thing. I mean creating a law that divides up the country by whether you are left or right ignores the fact that not everyone is just left or right. Some people though they may be generally left or right a lot of the time support policies that transcend the left right paradigm.

  8. #148
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    Re: Would you oppose secession for ANY reason?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    It is your liberty to live in any of the states that you want for any reason. If carrying a concealed weapon is important enough to you to move to another state that is your choice.

    The Barbarian's pipe dream though asserts that by law if you have a certain political lean that you cannot live in certain states. Which would transform those two division of states into authoritarian governments where you may not politically lean any direction other than the direction the government dictates. If you disagree with the government you will be thrown out or arrested. Certainly not anything that I would publicly promote as if it was a good thing. I mean creating a law that divides up the country by whether you are left or right ignores the fact that not everyone is just left or right. Some people though they may be generally left or right a lot of the time support policies that transcend the left right paradigm.
    Kinda sounds like thought crimes and McCarthyism. "You a pinko?"
    Haymarket's "support" of the 2nd Amendment, a right he believes we never had.
    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    no. You cannot lose rights you do not have in the first place. There is no such thing as the right to have any weapon of your choice regardless of any other consideration. It simply does not exist.

  9. #149
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    Re: Would you oppose secession for ANY reason?

    REPUBLIC, REPUBLIC, REPUBLIC! GO TEXAS GO!

    I would always prefer a peaceful succession to open warfare. Although open warfare is still preferable to socialism and it's bastardized children liberalism and progressivism. Better dead than red and dead reds are even better still. I believe we are quickly progressing towards a violent confrontation as the the continued failing of the US Markets and society progress, caused by the encroachment of Socialistic institutions and thought invading our country. The death of 10-20 million liberals and other socialist ilk is preferable to the costs of what liberalism will do and has been doing to the over 300 million in this country. Just like the Phoenix, it is time for those who believe in God, self-determination, morality and the advancement of mankind to rise from the ashes of this once great country. You can be a sheep or you can a wolf, the sheep need to learn to once again fear the wolf and for the wolves to cull the heard. If the brain dead socialistic herd commonly known as liberals, progressives, socialist or communists will not allow a peaceful separation, then it is time to bare our fangs and start the cull.

    It is time for those who love the freedom to stand on their own and achieve for themselves without the weight of carrying the useless to start migrating towards the freer states and those states should implement policies that encourage the sheeple to either change or move their herd to a different pasture.

    Liberals, leave us be and head for the liberal havens and let the free people move to the non-liberal havens, then split amicably or violently, which ever the liberals choose. If you are a non-liberal in one of the liberal havens, then close your business (if you have one), move towards freedom and quit holding up liberalism through your sacrifices. Let the liberals bear the weight of their beliefs without the blood, sweat and tears of the non-liberal.
    Only a fool measures equality by results and not opportunities.

  10. #150
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    Re: Would you oppose secession for ANY reason?

    Quote Originally Posted by DVSentinel View Post
    REPUBLIC, REPUBLIC, REPUBLIC! GO TEXAS GO!

    I would always prefer a peaceful succession to open warfare. Although open warfare is still preferable to socialism and it's bastardized children liberalism and progressivism. Better dead than red and dead reds are even better still. I believe we are quickly progressing towards a violent confrontation as the the continued failing of the US Markets and society progress, caused by the encroachment of Socialistic institutions and thought invading our country. The death of 10-20 million liberals and other socialist ilk is preferable to the costs of what liberalism will do and has been doing to the over 300 million in this country. Just like the Phoenix, it is time for those who believe in God, self-determination, morality and the advancement of mankind to rise from the ashes of this once great country. You can be a sheep or you can a wolf, the sheep need to learn to once again fear the wolf and for the wolves to cull the heard. If the brain dead socialistic herd commonly known as liberals, progressives, socialist or communists will not allow a peaceful separation, then it is time to bare our fangs and start the cull.

    It is time for those who love the freedom to stand on their own and achieve for themselves without the weight of carrying the useless to start migrating towards the freer states and those states should implement policies that encourage the sheeple to either change or move their herd to a different pasture.

    Liberals, leave us be and head for the liberal havens and let the free people move to the non-liberal havens, then split amicably or violently, which ever the liberals choose. If you are a non-liberal in one of the liberal havens, then close your business (if you have one), move towards freedom and quit holding up liberalism through your sacrifices. Let the liberals bear the weight of their beliefs without the blood, sweat and tears of the non-liberal.
    Perhaps you believe that violent confrontation is in the future because that is what you preach? Is Timothy McVeigh your hero? If I knew you personally I would call the white coats for you ot report you to the authorities as a potential domestic terrorist. But since I dont personally know you Ill just assume that you are a troll.

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