View Poll Results: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

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Thread: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Quote Originally Posted by Luna Tick View Post
    Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act? I say that it is. It's the use of violence to try to get your way politically.
    Good question. To me someone that is a terrorist blows crap up in order to instill fear in order to get what they want. However if someone blows something up just to get rid of something they find offensive? A criminal yes, a terrorist?

    Certainly a person that blows up an abortion clinic wants to intill some fear in those that do the abortions or gets them but I don't think that is thier main goal. Which is the difference between a terrorist and a criminal. One wants to instill fear as a main form of combating something and the other the fear is just secondary.

    It's a very razor thin line imo. So i'll just vote "I don't know".
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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    With the caveat that they are blowing it up because they are against abortion, then yes, they are a terrorist. But if they blow it up a specific clinic because they felt slighted in some way or someone he/she knows had an abortion at that specific clinic and they are looking to extract revenge specifically on that clinic with no care about other clinics or people that perform abortions, then no it isn't terrorism. It is all about the motive.
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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective-J View Post
    this is totally illogical, this would mean the people who did 9/11 arent terrorists. The definition of terrorism doesn't change based on the terrorists beliefs.

    Not to mention how would bombing a clinic killing doctors and patients and employees and people just passing by be ok in the attempt to stop abortion. Sorry thats just nonsense. It terrorism by definition.
    I just listed the definition of terrorism. The difference between 9/11, which did kill innocent lives as well, and bombing an abortion clinic is one of intent. The terrorists of 9/11 wanted to send a message, to threaten, to coerce. It's not about the action itself that defines terrorism. It's the intent behind the action that determines if it was a terrorist attack or just an attack.

    Whether or not there were bystanders or innocent people dying in addition to their intended target doesn't make it a terrorist attack. It makes it a sloppy attack. Please see the definition of terrorist that I pulled from the dictionary and wrote out for you and explain how I was wrong. I understand that it could be a terrorist attack, if it were intended to threaten/coerce other abortion clinics. But if the intent of the bomber was to strictly stop that one abortion clinic, then no terrorist act was committed. A very illegal act was committed and the person should rot. But not terrorism according to the definition of terrorism.

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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    I would say it is.... and I would also say it doesn't matter if you call it terrorism or not.

    calling it terrorism does not make it a more heinous crime... not calling it terrorism does not make it a less heinous crime.


    the best thing an individual can do to combat abortion is, well, to not have one... and to voice their opinion on the matter in hopes that others will adopt that line of thinking.

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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Quote Originally Posted by fredmertzz View Post
    I just listed the definition of terrorism. The difference between 9/11, which did kill innocent lives as well, and bombing an abortion clinic is one of intent. The terrorists of 9/11 wanted to send a message, to threaten, to coerce. It's not about the action itself that defines terrorism. It's the intent behind the action that determines if it was a terrorist attack or just an attack.

    Whether or not there were bystanders or innocent people dying in addition to their intended target doesn't make it a terrorist attack. It makes it a sloppy attack. Please see the definition of terrorist that I pulled from the dictionary and wrote out for you and explain how I was wrong. I understand that it could be a terrorist attack, if it were intended to threaten/coerce other abortion clinics. But if the intent of the bomber was to strictly stop that one abortion clinic, then no terrorist act was committed. A very illegal act was committed and the person should rot. But not terrorism according to the definition of terrorism.
    The intent though of the bombers of abortion clinics is to scare other clinics into closing.

    "In the summer of 1996, the world converged upon Atlanta for the Olympic Games. Under the protection and auspices of the regime in Washington millions of people came to celebrate the ideals of global socialism. Multinational corporations spent billions of dollars, and Washington organized an army of security to protect these best of all games. Even though the conception and the purpose of the so-called Olympic movement is the promote the values of global socialism as perfectly expressed in the song "Imagine" by John Lennon, which was the theme of the 1996 Games — even though the purpose of the Olympics is to promote these despicable ideals, the purpose of the attack on July 27th was to confound, anger and embarrass the Washington government in the eyes of the world for its abominable sanctioning of abortion on demand. The plan was to force the cancellation of the Games, or at least create a state of insecurity to empty the streets around the venues and thereby eat into the vast amounts of money invested." Eric Rudolph

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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Quote Originally Posted by fredmertzz View Post
    I just listed the definition of terrorism. The difference between 9/11, which did kill innocent lives as well, and bombing an abortion clinic is one of intent. The terrorists of 9/11 wanted to send a message, to threaten, to coerce. It's not about the action itself that defines terrorism. It's the intent behind the action that determines if it was a terrorist attack or just an attack.

    Whether or not there were bystanders or innocent people dying in addition to their intended target doesn't make it a terrorist attack. It makes it a sloppy attack. Please see the definition of terrorist that I pulled from the dictionary and wrote out for you and explain how I was wrong. I understand that it could be a terrorist attack, if it were intended to threaten/coerce other abortion clinics. But if the intent of the bomber was to strictly stop that one abortion clinic, then no terrorist act was committed. A very illegal act was committed and the person should rot. But not terrorism according to the definition of terrorism.
    im aware of all the definitions and your original post is still illogical, the beliefs of the terrorist in relationship to good/bad etc still have no barring. You have changed nothing and the post I addressed still remains illogical and nonsensical. Your attempt to change the illogical statement you made is also meaningless.

    this is what you said in the post I addressed "If the bomber had the belief that abortion is murder, that a crime was being committed and ignored by society in the clinic, and the bomb was intended to stop these acts, then no, that's not terrorism"

    that is complete BS and totally illogical, sorry, you GUESSING or trying to MAKE UP a reason they may have bombed the clinic based on "they thought evil was happening there" is meaningless in your example. Its terrorism by definition, them believing abortion is murder has no impact. LOL.
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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    There are LOTS of ways to force the closing of an abortion clinic, and some of them are quite legal and non-violent. The use of explosives is the most flamboyant, attention-getting means possible. It cannot possibly be misconstrued as an "expression of feelings" about a single clinic. It is intended for many people to see and wonder about (am I next?). There can be no message for the single clinic in question because that clinic is now obliterated. It can only be a message for "other" clinics. Therefore, the action is without question, terrorism.
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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Quote Originally Posted by EagleAye View Post
    There are LOTS of ways to force the closing of an abortion clinic, and some of them are quite legal and non-violent. The use of explosives is the most flamboyant, attention-getting means possible. It cannot possibly be misconstrued as an "expression of feelings" about a single clinic. It is intended for many people to see and wonder about (am I next?). There can be no message for the single clinic in question because that clinic is now obliterated. It can only be a message for "other" clinics. Therefore, the action is without question, terrorism.
    On the contrary, people who are unstable blow up things out of revenge and for no other reason. It is not inconceivable that an abortion clinic could be blown up for no other reason than to get revenge on that specific abortion clinic or someone who works there. It is not going to be the most likely reason but it is certainly a possibility. It wouldn't be about spreading fear to the clinic, but rather to kill the person or hurt someone in the clinic.

    Another reason could be the same thing that causes many cases of arson, insurance fraud. The owner isn't doing well and decide to blow up their own clinic, making it appear to be an act of terrorism.
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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Any act of wanton violence that also kills innocents can be considered terrorism be it domestic or foreign.
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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective-J View Post
    im aware of all the definitions and your original post is still illogical, the beliefs of the terrorist in relationship to good/bad etc still have no barring. You have changed nothing and the post I addressed still remains illogical and nonsensical. Your attempt to change the illogical statement you made is also meaningless.

    this is what you said in the post I addressed "If the bomber had the belief that abortion is murder, that a crime was being committed and ignored by society in the clinic, and the bomb was intended to stop these acts, then no, that's not terrorism"

    that is complete BS and totally illogical, sorry, you GUESSING or trying to MAKE UP a reason they may have bombed the clinic based on "they thought evil was happening there" is meaningless in your example. Its terrorism by definition, them believing abortion is murder has no impact. LOL.

    It's not complicated - it's a problem of simple logic. I stand by the claim you italicized. the key words are "AND THE BOMB WAS INTENDED TO STOP THESE ACTS" - the implication being that the 'stopping of these acts' was the ONLY intent. The rest of the italicized portion was an attempt to explain how that would be the case, but it is by no means exclusive -it was intended for illustrative purposes.

    To put it in terms strictly of logic since you seem to be hung up on logic:

    If the intent was to coerce or threaten, then the act of violence was terrorism.

    Can I think of an example in which blowing up an abortion clinic doesn't have the intent to coerce or threaten? Yes, I can, and I described it.

    Therefore, the answer to the question "Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?" is: Not necessarily. The act of bombing an abortion clinic does not necessitate the intent to coerce or threaten, the definition of terrorism.

    The first thing I wrote in my original post: "I would vote that it depends on the reason of the bombing."

    That of course wasn't an answer, so I went with the most correct answer of "no". Because it is not always the case that it is an act of terrorism.

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