View Poll Results: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

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    106 94.64%
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Thread: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

  1. #141
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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Quote Originally Posted by fredmertzz View Post
    You've just contradicted yourself... again:

    The act of bombing with the intent to stop an action occuring at that place (which is exactly what you wrote: "if it was to stop abortion it was terrorism") is not the same as the act of bombing with the intent to intimidate or coerce other people. The intent to intimidate or coerce is a necessary part of the definition of terrorism. If the act was simply 'to stop abortion', it's not terrorism as it does not include any intent of coercion or intimidation.

    Like I said, this likely is not the case. it's likely that coercion and intimidation are part of the intent of the bomb. But if it's not necessarily the case, if the case is strictly "if it was to stop abortion", then it is not terrorism. Which means the absolute statement: "Bombing an abortion clinic is an act of terrorism." is false as an absolute statement.
    there is ZERO contradiction LMAO unless of course you look at it in a biased and totally void of reality and logcial manner.

    heres where you will fail every time, answer this question.

    how is the abortions stopped?
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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    [QUOTE=Bodhisattva;1061172101]Redefine what? I have done no such thing...

    "There is no single, universally accepted, definition of terrorism. Terrorism is defined in the Code of Federal Regulations as “the unlawful use of force and violence against persons or property to intimidate or coerce a government, the civilian population, or any segment thereof, in furtherance of political or social objectives” (28 C.F.R. Section 0.85).

    Your definition was: "any time you intentionally bomb something, in a non-military situation, it is terrorism" - that's fine, if you wish to define terrorism in that way - as you pointed out, there is no single, universally accepted definition. I'm not saying you can't. I'm just saying that the definition is different from mine. I use the definition listed in the Code of Federal Regulation which requires the act of force and violence to have the intent of coercion or intimidation.

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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective-J View Post
    there is ZERO contradiction LMAO unless of course you look at it in a biased and totally void of reality and logcial manner.

    heres where you will fail every time, answer this question.

    how is the abortions stopped?
    You site the definition of terrorism as requiring an intent to coerce or intimidate, then claim a situation that the intent was not to coerce or intimidate, but rather to stop abortions as terrorism. This is a contradiction.

    I'll answer your question, because I'm really very interested to try to understand how you think "to stop abortion" is the same as "to coerce or intimidate":

    Q: "how is the abortions stopped?"
    A: The abortions were stopped by an act of bombing the abortion clinic.

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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Quote Originally Posted by fredmertzz View Post
    You site the definition of terrorism as requiring an intent to coerce or intimidate, then claim a situation that the intent was not to coerce or intimidate, but rather to stop abortions as terrorism. This is a contradiction.

    I'll answer your question, because I'm really very interested to try to understand how you think "to stop abortion" is the same as "to coerce or intimidate":

    Q: "how is the abortions stopped?"
    A: The abortions were stopped by an act of bombing the abortion clinic.
    nope thats what YOU say i do and reality and facts disagree with you and prove you wrong.

    but at least you answered the question, ill lead you right to the facts lets see if you are honest and logical enough to see them.

    you said by bombing it

    how did bombing stop them? answer
    VIOLENCE, FORCE, COERCION and INTIMIDATION

    there for its terrorism lol
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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective-J View Post
    nope thats what YOU say i do and reality and facts disagree with you and prove you wrong.

    but at least you answered the question, ill lead you right to the facts lets see if you are honest and logical enough to see them.

    you said by bombing it

    how did bombing stop them? answer
    VIOLENCE, FORCE, COERCION and INTIMIDATION

    there for its terrorism lol
    If you wanted to be fair, you would let me answer the questions.

    Q: "how did the bombing stop them?"
    A: It killed them, so they were unable to perform their duties.

    Violence and Force, yes. But you cannot coerce and intimidate someone you just killed. Ergo, not terrorism.

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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Quote Originally Posted by fredmertzz View Post
    If you wanted to be fair, you would let me answer the questions.

    Q: "how did the bombing stop them?"
    A: It killed them, so they were unable to perform their duties.

    Violence and Force, yes. But you cannot coerce and intimidate someone you just killed. Ergo, not terrorism.
    LMAO

    so you are just going to be dishonest and lie now, I see the issues LMAO

    Terrorism: The unlawful use of force or violence against persons or property in order to coerce or intimidate a government or the civilian population in furtherance of political or social objectives.

    no matter how much BS you try to feed us, your example is terrorism and thats just the facts

    Let me know when you can change this fact.
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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective-J View Post
    LMAO

    so you are just going to be dishonest and lie now, I see the issues LMAO

    Terrorism: The unlawful use of force or violence against persons or property in order to coerce or intimidate a government or the civilian population in furtherance of political or social objectives.

    no matter how much BS you try to feed us, your example is terrorism and thats just the facts

    Let me know when you can change this fact.
    In order for it to be terrorism, all parts of the definition of terrorism must be true. You've highlighted the parts that are obviously true, which I am not attempting to refute.

    Allow me to highlight the portion that I am consistently arguing, which you have failed time and again to address:

    Terrorism: The unlawful use of force or violence against persons or property in order to coerce or intimidate a government or the civilian population in furtherance of political or social objectives.

    That is a critical piece of the definition. Without the intent to coerce or intimidate, what you have is "an unlawful use of force or violence against personrs or porperty."

    Explain to me how a person bombing an abortion clinic in every situation is doing so in order to 'coerce or intimidate'. If we can think of one example in which this is no the case, then the absolute statement of: "If a person bombs an abortion clinic, it is an act of terrorism" is false.

    These are the rules of logic.

    If you claim "If 'A' then 'B'" and I explain a situation in which "A and not B" exist, then your claim is false.

  8. #148
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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Quote Originally Posted by fredmertzz View Post
    In order for it to be terrorism, all parts of the definition of terrorism must be true. You've highlighted the parts that are obviously true, which I am not attempting to refute.

    Allow me to highlight the portion that I am consistently arguing, which you have failed time and again to address:

    Terrorism: The unlawful use of force or violence against persons or property in order to coerce or intimidate a government or the civilian population in furtherance of political or social objectives.

    That is a critical piece of the definition. Without the intent to coerce or intimidate, what you have is "an unlawful use of force or violence against personrs or porperty."

    Explain to me how a person bombing an abortion clinic in every situation is doing so in order to 'coerce or intimidate'. If we can think of one example in which this is no the case, then the absolute statement of: "If a person bombs an abortion clinic, it is an act of terrorism" is false.

    These are the rules of logic.

    If you claim "If 'A' then 'B'" and I explain a situation in which "A and not B" exist, then your claim is false.
    thanks for this long post that doesnt change any facts. LOL
    are you trying to lie on purpose or do you honestly just dont know that your example is 100% wrong and 100% terrorism?

    now you are also trying to say i made an absolute statement, this is a lie, in fact a gave an example of how bombing an abortion clinic would NOT be terrorism. Its a last minute dodge, backpedal to save face, but honesty trumps you every time.

    seems like you ignore the definition of words when they dont suit you and just make stuff up and be dishonest.

    you already saw the definition of terrorism.

    heres the definition of coerce

    co·erce (k-ūrs)
    tr.v. co·erced, co·erc·ing, co·erc·es
    1. To force to act or think in a certain way by use of pressure, threats, or intimidation; compel.
    2. To dominate, restrain, or control forcibly
    3. To bring about by force or threat

    this is exactly what bombing would do, your example is terrorism, thats a fact, sorry you dont understand that but facts dont care about your opinion and broken logic

    make 20 more posts, you will continue to be wrong if you say your example isnt terrorism.
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  9. #149
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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Quote Originally Posted by wolfman24 View Post
    Its also showing thier understanding of Christian doctrine. In reverse.
    True. But that doesn't change the answer to the question.

  10. #150
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    Re: Is bombing a family planning clinic in opposition to abortion a terrorist act?

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    Violence against clinics and doctors who provide abortions is terrorism by definition. The terrorists are sending a message meant to terrorize and coerce doctors into refusing to provide abortion services because they fear for their lives, and women are terrorized by the threats against them for using clinic services.

    It's quite obviously a tactic to prevent women from receiving a perfectly legal, constitutionally-protected medical procedure, thereby enforcing their will on the rest of the populace by violent means.

    I don't see how playing semantical musical chairs can obfuscate the obvious.
    I was always find it curious how often debate-ending posts like these need to be ignored in order for the debate to continue.

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