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is torture a justifiable punishment in a first world civilized country?

torture a justifiable punishment in first world countires?

  • Yes- only for terrible crimes, followed subsequently by execution

    Votes: 8 16.7%

  • Yes, for terrible crimes, followed subsequently by life imprisonment

    Votes: 1 2.1%

  • Never, under any circumstances.

    Votes: 39 81.3%
  • Total voters
    48
Boo Radley said:
Not always. Sometimes the person doing it, under orders, is quite conflicted.
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Didn't consider that, Boo. You're probably right about that.

Although in military situations I would assume that special people who don't feel conflicted, but rather are more likely to approve, are selected to engage in torture. I don't think torturing someone is for the lighthearted.

I'm not so sure about say a militia situation or civil war situations where a lot of civilians are forced to participate in war activities out of the sheer necessity to survive.

Thanks
 
Zariak said:
It may seem ridiculous and a totally disgusting breach of human rights, but in some cases, do some people deserve just as much pain as they inflicted onto their victims?
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Water-boarding is not torture.

No, neither water-boarding nor torture should be punishments. Either fine, require community service, incarcerate for a short time, or execute.
 
Zariak said:
It may seem ridiculous and a totally disgusting breach of human rights, but in some cases, do some people deserve just as much pain as they inflicted onto their victims?
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I don't think torture is appropriate as a punishment. It may, however, in very limited circumstances, be appropriate to get information out of someone that could save the lives of many.

At the end of the day, all of these issues are just questions of whose rights and interests do we prioritize, and to what degree? Do I think a person should generally be free from torture? Yes. Torture is horrible, and if the person has not been proven to know the information sought, any information gained as a result is highly suspect. But if you asked to me weigh the interests of a person being tortured against the interests of say, the thousands of people who died on 9/11, and the interests of their families, and the interests of the U.S. economy . . . I'd pick the latter any day.
 
Removable Mind said:
Didn't consider that, Boo. You're probably right about that.

Although in military situations I would assume that special people who don't feel conflicted, but rather are more likely to approve, are selected to engage in torture. I don't think torturing someone is for the lighthearted.

I'm not so sure about say a militia situation or civil war situations where a lot of civilians are forced to participate in war activities out of the sheer necessity to survive.

Thanks
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I listened to some of those who tortured the two who died at Bagram. They were conflicted, even sure the two weren't guilty and knew nothing.
 
Boo Radley said:
I listened to some of those who tortured the two who died at Bagram. They were conflicted, even sure the two weren't guilty and knew nothing.
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Gezzzz, that would be a tough deal.

Dunno, I was in the military and I clearly understand how taking orders are often done without hesitation or question, but telling a soldier not specially trained for that mission...is perplexing. I'd think that unless a person feels 100% okay with engaging in torture that they could actually be even more counter-productive. I mean...from all that I've read from military experts, etc. I'm still not convinced that a person being tortured wouldn't fess up to anything, regardless of the truthfulness of the information rendered.
 
Removable Mind said:
Gezzzz, that would be a tough deal.

Dunno, I was in the military and I clearly understand how taking orders are often done without hesitation or question, but telling a soldier not specially trained for that mission...is perplexing. I'd think that unless a person feels 100% okay with engaging in torture that they could actually be even more counter-productive. I mean...from all that I've read from military experts, etc. I'm still not convinced that a person being tortured wouldn't fess up to anything, regardless of the truthfulness of the information rendered.
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I agree. . . . .
 
Zariak said:
It may seem ridiculous and a totally disgusting breach of human rights, but in some cases, do some people deserve just as much pain as they inflicted onto their victims?
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Torture is for extraction of information from hardened targets, not revenge.
 
Punishment?

Or a means to extract vital, life saving information?


Both are wrong - but the first one is NEVER acceptable.

The second one might be under EXTRAORDINARY circumstances. But even then, those that did the torturing should be prosecuted.
 
40 people voted no.

/End thread.
 
You know in the movies how the bad guy always has some "truth serum" to give to the good guy, but it doesn't work cause he is enured to this drug?

Well that doesn't happen. You whack a guy with heroin for a week and then take it away, he'll cry like a baby and tell you everything you want to know.

There's even some other recreational drugs that will get the suspect talking without him even knowing it.

Torture as punishment is barbaric.
Torture for specific information to save lives may be appropriate in some cases. Someone smarter than me would have to define the criteria tho.
 
If I knew that the guy was a "bad guy" and that he had intel then absolutely torture him...
 
9 voted yes... thread keeps going.
 
Zariak said:
It may seem ridiculous and a totally disgusting breach of human rights, but in some cases, do some people deserve just as much pain as they inflicted onto their victims?
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I don't know about torture but I think physical punishment is justified. For example I think arsonists and vandals should have the crap beat out of them by the property owners. Murder victim's loved ones should be able to beat the crap out of the murderer.
 
Zariak said:
It may seem ridiculous and a totally disgusting breach of human rights, but in some cases, do some people deserve just as much pain as they inflicted onto their victims?
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There are probably people out there who deserve to be raped to death by syphilitic baboons. Doesn't mean such a thing is moral, ethical, or constitutionally allowable.
 
Boo Radley said:
it's a rather slippery slope. Your line is there, but we make another for another, and so on. Better to simply follow humane behavior. better for all of us.
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And what is "humane" behavior? That varies even more than my line. At least my line was restricted to only the worst of crimes. The crimes where there is no possible excuse of committing. Someone killing for revenge or to protect thier percieved lifestyle is understandable, even if abhorrant. Killing multiple, complete strangers, is not. And there is simply no excuse for child rape, and there is nothing that is even close to equivalent in order to compare like I did with the killing.
 
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