View Poll Results: torture a justifiable punishment in first world countires?

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  • Yes- only for terrible crimes, followed subsequently by execution

    10 18.87%
  • Yes, for terrible crimes, followed subsequently by life imprisonment

    1 1.89%
  • Never, under any circumstances.

    42 79.25%
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Thread: is torture a justifiable punishment in a first world civilized country?

  1. #101
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    Re: is torture a justifiable punishment in a first world civilized country?

    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    Torture is nearly always justifiable to the person doing the torturing...wouldn't you say?
    Not always. Sometimes the person doing it, under orders, is quite conflicted.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: is torture a justifiable punishment in a first world civilized country?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Not always. Sometimes the person doing it, under orders, is quite conflicted.
    Didn't consider that, Boo. You're probably right about that.

    Although in military situations I would assume that special people who don't feel conflicted, but rather are more likely to approve, are selected to engage in torture. I don't think torturing someone is for the lighthearted.

    I'm not so sure about say a militia situation or civil war situations where a lot of civilians are forced to participate in war activities out of the sheer necessity to survive.

    Thanks

  3. #103
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    Re: is torture a justifiable punishment in a first world civilized country?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zariak View Post
    It may seem ridiculous and a totally disgusting breach of human rights, but in some cases, do some people deserve just as much pain as they inflicted onto their victims?
    Water-boarding is not torture.

    No, neither water-boarding nor torture should be punishments. Either fine, require community service, incarcerate for a short time, or execute.

  4. #104
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    Re: is torture a justifiable punishment in a first world civilized country?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zariak View Post
    It may seem ridiculous and a totally disgusting breach of human rights, but in some cases, do some people deserve just as much pain as they inflicted onto their victims?
    I don't think torture is appropriate as a punishment. It may, however, in very limited circumstances, be appropriate to get information out of someone that could save the lives of many.

    At the end of the day, all of these issues are just questions of whose rights and interests do we prioritize, and to what degree? Do I think a person should generally be free from torture? Yes. Torture is horrible, and if the person has not been proven to know the information sought, any information gained as a result is highly suspect. But if you asked to me weigh the interests of a person being tortured against the interests of say, the thousands of people who died on 9/11, and the interests of their families, and the interests of the U.S. economy . . . I'd pick the latter any day.
    (avatar by Thomas Nast)

  5. #105
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    Re: is torture a justifiable punishment in a first world civilized country?

    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    Didn't consider that, Boo. You're probably right about that.

    Although in military situations I would assume that special people who don't feel conflicted, but rather are more likely to approve, are selected to engage in torture. I don't think torturing someone is for the lighthearted.

    I'm not so sure about say a militia situation or civil war situations where a lot of civilians are forced to participate in war activities out of the sheer necessity to survive.

    Thanks
    I listened to some of those who tortured the two who died at Bagram. They were conflicted, even sure the two weren't guilty and knew nothing.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  6. #106
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    Re: is torture a justifiable punishment in a first world civilized country?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I listened to some of those who tortured the two who died at Bagram. They were conflicted, even sure the two weren't guilty and knew nothing.
    Gezzzz, that would be a tough deal.

    Dunno, I was in the military and I clearly understand how taking orders are often done without hesitation or question, but telling a soldier not specially trained for that mission...is perplexing. I'd think that unless a person feels 100% okay with engaging in torture that they could actually be even more counter-productive. I mean...from all that I've read from military experts, etc. I'm still not convinced that a person being tortured wouldn't fess up to anything, regardless of the truthfulness of the information rendered.

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    Re: is torture a justifiable punishment in a first world civilized country?

    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    Gezzzz, that would be a tough deal.

    Dunno, I was in the military and I clearly understand how taking orders are often done without hesitation or question, but telling a soldier not specially trained for that mission...is perplexing. I'd think that unless a person feels 100% okay with engaging in torture that they could actually be even more counter-productive. I mean...from all that I've read from military experts, etc. I'm still not convinced that a person being tortured wouldn't fess up to anything, regardless of the truthfulness of the information rendered.
    I agree. . . . .

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: is torture a justifiable punishment in a first world civilized country?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I agree. . . . .
    If I was being tortured...I often tell my wife anything she wants to hear...

  9. #109
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    Re: is torture a justifiable punishment in a first world civilized country?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zariak View Post
    It may seem ridiculous and a totally disgusting breach of human rights, but in some cases, do some people deserve just as much pain as they inflicted onto their victims?
    Torture is for extraction of information from hardened targets, not revenge.
    I love the NSA. It's like having a secret fan-base you will never see, but they're there, watching everything you write and it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that I may be some person's only form of unconstitutional entertainment one night.

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    Re: is torture a justifiable punishment in a first world civilized country?

    Punishment?

    Or a means to extract vital, life saving information?


    Both are wrong - but the first one is NEVER acceptable.

    The second one might be under EXTRAORDINARY circumstances. But even then, those that did the torturing should be prosecuted.

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